One Strike Rule

In My Humble Opinion
1

This was inspired by this thread, but since I am more interested in the hypothectical than the specifics, I thought I ought start a new thread.

The OP relates a story about a 12 year on-and-off agian relationship with a man. She mentions that the romantic relationship ended when he hit her, and she left, never to return.

Most of the subsequent posts latched on to this detail–the attitude was overwhelming that “one strike and you’re out”–that a romantic relationship is totally and forever nulled by an act of violence. This same attitude is repeated over and over again in the media–in women’s mags, in domestic violence literature, in television shows, in movies. The woman-hitting man is always shown as being utterly without redemption and he always reverts back to abusive behavior.

On one hand, I am really uncomfortable about blanket rules of any kind–if I have figured out anything in my few years it is that there is always the odd exception. On the other hand, I understand why this particular maxim is always stated in such absolute terms–women in abusive relationships often go to great lenghs to excuse what is clearly inexcusable behavior, and by saying “there is no possible excuse” one hopes to nip that in the bud. But I still wonder if striking a partner is truly the unforgivable sin. A few senarios occur to me:

  1. If a man ever strikes a woman ought he be off limits for life? If one had been with someone for a year and they had never shown any signs of violence, and they confessed that 5 years ago they had hit their ex a single time, ought one leave?

  2. Is it acceptable to accept a man back that was violent towards you if much time has elapsed? How much time? 5 years? 10? 25? (This is assuming that in the intervining years he has shown no violent tendencies).

  3. If drugs or alcohol are involved, and then someone “goes straight”, ought one overlook the violence and assume it is unlikely to happen again?
    I think my own point of view is that violence is similar to infidelity. Multiple occurances of either terminate a relationship completly and make a person highly suspect for relationships with other people. But while a single instance of infidelity is a terrible betrayal and is legitimate grounds for the ending of a relationship, if the offended person is willing to try and work through it they are not censered for being co-dependent or spineless. In the same way, I think that if a person’s SO has an isolated outbreak of violent behavior (one smack, one hard shake, one shove), presumably in extenuating circumstances (since atypical behavior ususally is), it is a legitimate choice to forgive them and give them a second chance. (It is also a legitimate choice to throw them out on thier ass). But at the same time I think I would teach a daughter that if a man smacks you, you leave.
    (On a side note, there is no personal agenda here. To the best of my knowledge my husband has never commited a violent act towards anyone or anything. The man truly has no temper, and frankly, I couldn’t stand to live with someone tempramental).

2

Here’s my thinking.

I have been around friends with violent men. I have saved and even risked my own life because of my friend’s violent man.

Me, I will never, never, never accept that hitting me as an acceptable behavior. I have seen the cycle and I wont go there.

Yep, there’s a once strike rule with me. I have dealt with the cheating fiance and one of my best friend and her dealing with the aftermath of violence.

There is no way in hell a man could hit me and not get away with it. Knowing me, he’d probably end up with the bad end of a gun, a friend who is willing to kick some ass or me going totally ballistic pulling on my world of helping violent friends and my torment of a mother and her abuse.

I would expect the same in return, if I ever felt the need to hit a man, he should leave me too.

There is no down time to this, if a partner hits another, the other needs to get out and get out soon never to return. If he or she continues in this manner it’s no longer your concern unless you report it and subsequent relationships bring up similar results.

One hit is means by which to end the relationship in my eyes no matter the perpetrator.

3

Goddamn right.

How routinely does a female protagonist in a film give a fellow a resounding slap? There’s a perception that that’s somehow more acceptable then vice versa. I think that’s a pretty sad perception.

Smacking one another around has absolutely no place in a relationship. (Unless, say, it’s mutually consenting involving things like floggers, in which case, woo-hoo!)

That said, the OP has valid points. I’d say a lot depends on the magnitude of the one-strike. A cheek-stinging slap is an enraging thing; a full-force closed-fist slug will generally do a lot more damage–the former does allow a bit more leeway for one-strike forgiveness. The latter…I say no.

4

Manda, I share your discomfort with absolutes and zero tollerance policies in general but this is one I really question.

Obviously the magnitude and circumstances of the one incident has some relevance. In my time at a legal clinic I saw many cases where a push was clearly defensive and somewhat understandable in the circumstances or an attempt to escape a screaming partner who had them cornered. To be honest most of these people, men and women, were such losers they deserved each other anyway.

I do think that a single incident of a clear aggressive hit crosses the line. I find this incredibly abberant behavior that is not at all comparable to an incident of infidelity. It isn’t even as excusable as normal criminal behavior. Why would you want to stay with someone who is even capable of that. Most of us couldn’t hit our spouses no matter how enraged or drunk we might be. This isn’t just misbehavior, its a clear character flaw of massive proportions.

As a practical matter decisions are harder for people. if your just dating your insane not to end it. If you have been together for ten years its obviously a different decision.

5

but why on earth would anyone WANT to get back together with a guy that hit her?

Disclaimer: I’m NOT talking about a slap on the ass while wrestling around between the sheets. S

If the guy is such a pathetic loser that he has to demonstrate what a bad-ass he is on his wife, he has more serious problems and should be dumped ASAP.

If drugs or alcohol are involved, so what? I personally enjoy both of those but don’t get violent or obnoxious and have ZERO tolerance for those who do. I also believe that a thorough butt kicking induces future restraint in people who drink or drug, get violent, and then whine about how substance X made them do it. There nothing like waking up with fractures to make a guy think twice next time he gets hold of a bottle. Again, she should dump the guy ASAP.

To tell the truth, I really prefer TekChick’s response in either of the cases above, soooo much more satisfying to know the guy was on the receiving end of some serious brutality. Problem is, the lady probably can’t do the job herself and the friends/relatives just aren’t around all the time.

As far as women hitting men. I know this sounds sexist and terribly terribly non-PC, but so what if they do? I haven’t seen that many women that have the temperment, training, bone structure, or upper body strength to actually do much damage anyway. I’m fairly large and have never had a woman try to hit me. I do know that knocking her out would not be an option. Maybe just restrain her some way until she cooled down, sit on her if that’s what it took but DON’T hit.

All in all, and as much as I hate rules that are “always” or “Never,” I think the “One strike and you’re out” rule is a good one.

Again, I’m talking about a guy actually trying to hurt his SO, and that includes slapping.

Testy.

6

IMHO, once there is domestic violence, the romance has ended, the relationship is ruined. Maybe you can start a new one later, buy you can’t continue that one.

7

Ned:

Of course, we like to think we couldn’t hit our spouses no matter what (I certainly can’t actually imagene it) but many people find themselves doing things that they never dreamed they were capable of. I am assuming extreme circumstances here: for a person who has never been violent to suddenly become violent there has to be more going on than a bad day at work. It would have to be something like the aftermath of a death of a child, or while packing to move out of an apartment you’ve been evicted from and having no place to go, or while trying to pass a kidneystone, or upon walking in on some sort of terrible infidelity (like your wife and your dad). Situations when normally rational people are not thinking straight and conflict tends to erupt and escalate quickly.

This, I suppose is what I am realy asking–is it always an irredemable charecter flaw? That is why I asked about continuing to date someone if you found out that they once slapped a previous partner. If you should never, ever, under any circumstances, be involved wiht a man who once hit you because it is an inate charecter flaw, then you really ought not ever, under any circumstances be involved with a man who once hit anyone–the same charecter flaw is there. But what that means is that in the eyes of most people a person can make themselves totally and permanently outcast from society–and that dosen’t seem quite right to me. The only other thing we treat like that is sexual assult, and sexual assult seems alot worse for me than one open handed slap. (I do think that any beating that takes as long as sexual assult–to pound on a woman for a full three minutes (at least)–is totally unacceptable and unforgivable. But in that case we are talking about making the decsion to hit someone 20-30 times–not just once.)

I am definitly talking about a situation where you haveknown someone long enough to know that the behavior is totally unlike them, and not just be taking thier word for it.

testy said:

Perhaps because you have children together, and have had 15 years of marrige with nothing like this ever happening, and this is a person who you are happy with except for one moment when something went terribly wrong.

Accoding to people that work with domestic violence cases this is more common than many people realize, but becuase of the attitude that a real man ought not be able to be hurt be a woman, it is often hidden. Remember that not all guys are “fairly large”–quite a few are small and out of shape. Furthermore, if you add a baseball bat or a dinner plate or a metal spatula or a boot into the picture almost anyone can hit anyone if the victem dosen’t do anything to stop it. I know women who have, in a fit of rage, thrown soething heavy at a partner. If a hard shove means you have no option but to leave, then I think that a hurled set of keys falls into the same catagory.

8

Manda, I assure you I have been pushed to the limit of human endurance. It is not a theoretical for me personally.

I question why any sane person would want to be involved with someone who has committed a sexual assault either. I am a soft on crime liberal but this isn’t the parole board, its a life partnership. I don’t think that the person would be a terrible choice for a mate is equivalent to making them an outcast.

I wonder if this is realistic. It certainly isn’t in my experience. Even the ones who hadn’t hit before were complete assholes in other ways. The hitting was preceded by all manner of controling and abusive behavior that had escalated over time to physical violence. These are the kind of guys your girlfriends can’t understand what you see in.

But lets concede that there are such men who really are decent normally and just snapped. I suppose one could make a rational decision to assume this was an abberation that, with anger management courses would probably not happen again, and over time the damage might be healed. In reality the decision is usually far more grim involving the assessment of risk for future harm verses the difficulty of leaving what is usually a highly dependant relationship.

9

Wife-beater, or husband-beater, my answer applies to both.

What if a previously non-violent, gentle person murders someone in the heat of the moment?
We aren’t in the habit of letting them get away with murder simply because they haven’t done it before and it seems out of character. Although the punishment may be somewhat more lenient if there is no sign of premeditation, we do still punish the murderers amongst us.
Without trying to sound melodramatic, I think spousal abuse has a lot in common with the above scenario, because both muder and spousal abuse rank up there amongst the most heinous crimes one can commit in our society. We do not accept either as permissable under certain circumstances, and we certainly shouldn’t consider them justifiable.
This issue is about self-control. In our society, we rely on the people around us to control themselves, and not give into impulse, rage or desire without taking consideration of others into account. When someone loses that self-control and hits another human being in anger, they violate the basis of our society. The reason we are so angered by this loss of self-control is because it is what we rely on to exist together as a community. A man who loses control in an argument and hits his wife - the person he is supposed to love most in the world - shows that he is volatile and unpredictable, and a possible danger to all of us. A woman who lashes out and hits her husband instead of walking away could pose a threat to any one of us if provoked. We make these rules about self control to make our world a better place to live in.
Should we give these people a second chance? Probably. But that doesn’t mean we’re inclined to do so. Just as we shun people with violent criminal histories, we shun the people who express their anger on their loved ones with their fists.

I know a couple… she’s a psycho. He’s a nice guy. She regularly starts screaming at him for little or no reason. She treats him like a slave. She orders him around. She confiscates his cigarettes “until he shows her some respect”. She’s driven away all his friends. She has beaten him up. He has never retaliated at all. I cannot respect him for staying with her - I think if he had any brains at all, he would leave - but I admire the fact that he has never raised a hand to her. If he ever hit her back, I would be disgusted. If he finally reaches breaking point, then that is the time he should turn and leave her forever, not the time he should resort to using his fists on her. And though I’ve always disliked her for the way she treats him, I began to hate her when I first found out that she beats him up.

Caz.

10

Thank you for replying, this is something I feel strongly about and believe needs more discussion.

“Perhaps because you have children together, and have had 15 years of marrige with nothing like this ever happening, and this is a person who you are happy with except for one moment when something went terribly wrong.”

I understand your point but I came from a home where such things happened starting when I was about 6 YO. As a child, I would have preferred to live with one or the other parent or even a total stranger if they would just stop fighting. The screaming and abuse that took place both frightened and appalled me. Aside from the obligatory Christmas call home, I haven’t spoken to my parents in over 20 years. From my own point of view, a man who physically assaults his wife with intent to do harm has forfieted any claim to respect. As far as it just happening once, I see it as a slippery slope. If it is excused once it could be again.

Having gotten all that off my chest, if the situation is as you say, and the woman in question is “happy” with the guy, then who am I to poke my nose into her business?

Accoding to people that work with domestic violence cases this is more common than many people realize, but becuase of the attitude that a real man ought not be able to be hurt be a woman, it is often hidden. Remember that not all guys are “fairly large”–quite a few are small and out of shape. Furthermore, if you add a baseball bat or a dinner plate or a metal spatula or a boot into the picture almost anyone can hit anyone if the victem dosen’t do anything to stop it. I know women who have, in a fit of rage, thrown soething heavy at a partner. If a hard shove means you have no option but to leave, then I think that a hurled set of keys falls into the same catagory. **
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Well Manda, much as I hate to admit it you have a point. After thinking about it a bit I even know a case where the man is not terribly large and the woman in question is enormous. She uses it, taking obvious enjoyment in knocking him down, ordering him around, etc. Different kind of people I suppose, I’d have been out of there like a shot. S I do agree with CAZZLE though, the minute he hits her I lose all respect for him.

When either party uses potentially lethal weapons, clubs, knives, that sort of thing, the person (male or female) is now dealing with a mentally disturbed opponent and had better leave ASAP. If there are any children then (s)he should take them along as well.

Just my two cents worth and best regards.

Testy.