Ya know, those jolly , green-dressing “little people” that supposedly inhabit Ireland? Years ago, I heard a story about how the myth of the leprechauns got started. and it goes like this:
-in the early Bronze Age, when the Celts began migating from Europe to the British isles, they eventually reached and settled in Ireland. They were not alone…the original inhabitants were a different race of people, who had lived there since the end of the last Ice Age (about 15,000 BC). These people were possibly a remnant population of Neanderthals, and had become so severely inbred that they were of small stature, and humped over, were very short-perhaps less than 5’ average height. These people were gradually exterminated by the immigrant celts, and passed into legend as the “leprechauns”.
Anyway, the Icelandic people have a similar legend…in that case the peoplein question were called the “huldafolk” or “hidden people”
Has anybody heard this? Could the leprechauns have been the last remant s of the european neanderthal people? :eek:
Can’t say I have. And I doubt that it is very possible.
It’s just as likely that the leprechaun’s symbol is not really meant to represent a clover at all, but hashish. Which explains everything :rolleyes: 
Could they have been the last remant s of the European Neanderthal people? Sure they could.
Could they have been unicorns dressed up in human suits? Sure they could.
Is there one skeric of evidence for either theory? No, none whatsoever.
There have been no small hunched H. sapiens skeletons found in Ireland. There have been no Neanderthal skeletons of any stature found in Ireland. Why didn’t these people leave any remains at all for archaeologists/palaeontologists to find?
The last of the Neanderthals became extinct on mainland Europe about 30, 000 years before your ‘original inhabitants’ supposedly arrived at ‘the end of the last Ice Age (about 15,000 BC)’ so where the hell had they been hiding for 30, 00 years?
And if the Neandertahls were able to reach Ireland at ‘the end of the last Ice Age (about 15,000 BC)’ why hadn’t the done so 100, 000 years earlier?
In short why is this hypothesis anything but wild speculation constructed upon an argument from ignorance? It’s no good just constructing an hypothesis that might account for some observation. You really do need to have some observational evidence to support it or else some means of readily falsifying it. This hypothesis has neither and because of that it hs no credibility whatsoever.
We had a thread about a month ago on Neanderthals that touched on their role in troll myths. A lot of good science in that thread but the only comment that could be made on that particular point was ‘Can’t know!’. No evidence, no way of knowing. What I will add here is that there are myths of little people from al over the world, literally. Since Neanderthals never lived in equatorial Guinea or Central Australia you will need to find some other explanation to explain the little people myth in those cases. When you have an explanation perhaps you could come back and explain why you can’t also apply it to Ireland.
Leprechauns are cobbler spirits, and as such, are part of a long Western European tradition of domestic spirits. It is thought that the Irish Sidhe are a memory of a pre-Celtic people. The Sidhe were a race of people living in Ireland before the Celts, who the Celts drove underground and who are afraid of iron.
I will mention that the Sidhe were never portrayed as short. They were human sized, if not larger, and the people they defeated when they came to Ireland, the Formorians, were portrayed as even bigger than the Sidhe.
the mythology I was taught:
The leprechauns were supposedly the ancestors of the Tuatha De Danann who, after defeating the Fir Bolg, ruled Ireland for 4 generations, before being crushed by the Milesians.
the Tuatha de Danann were allowed to exile underground, and through magic, became the leprechauns.
giant pinches of salt, 2 cent.
Possible origins for the name: leath bhrogan (shoemaker), or luacharma’n (pygmy). http://www.irelandseye.com/animation/explorer/leprechaun.html
The source for all of Ireland’s fairie mythos is most likely the pre-Christian pagan religion.
An anthropology professor I had said that they were originally the pagan gods, altered suffieciently so that believing in them would not offend Church authorities.
I knew Peter Beresford Ellis’s gawdawful Chronicles of the Celts would come in handy at some point.
Irish legendary history says that the Emerald Isle was colonized in three waves, the first being the Fomorians, who were overthrown and enslaved by the Tuatha de Danaan, in competition with the Firbolg. They in turn were replaced by the Milesians, who gave rise to the assortment of characters from standard Irish legend: Cuchullain, Finn mac Cool, Conann, and so on.
When the Tuatha were defeated by the Milesians, they retreated underground, notably into the hill at Tara, and became the Sidhe (pronounced “Shee”). Most of the assorted not-quite-human peoples of Irish legend, such as the Banshees and the leprechauns, are of the Sidhe.
Most specifically:
Some of my thoughts on Leprechauns, after a visit to Ireland.
I’m no expert in the area. But IIRC the Emerald Isle was at one time inhabited by a short people, the Picts. They were not AFAIK hunchbacks. More, a group of folks in Ireland would fail to explain Brownies, Tomthte, Domoyev/Domovoi and similar legends of small beings who were mischevious if offended and helpful if given proper gifts.
I thought Banshees were the opposite/enemy of the Sidhe? Banshee = Bane of Sidhe?
Of course I could just be mixing up my fantasy books with actual legends.
Banshee in its many variations typically just means “fairy woman.” The bane idea sounds like a particularly clumsy bit of fiction.
The Irish for woman is “Ban” eg Policewoman is Ban Garda.
Banshee is almost certainly just Ban Sidhe, fairy woman.
Banshee is an IRISH word, with IRISH word roots, no bane anywhere in there.
With this talk of leprechauns and banshee, and now a post by Irishgirl I can’t be the only one fighting the urge to break into “My Pretty Irish Girl” from Darbie O’Gill.
Oh, what the heck! An a 1 an a 2
Oh, she is my dear, my darling one!
Her eyes so sparkling, full of fun.
No other, no other,
Can match the likes of her!
Oh, she is my dear, my darling one!
My smiling and beguiling one!
I kiss the ground she walks upon!
My pretty Irish girl!
BTW
For more information on the many fairies of the British Isles, I recommend the rpg book For Fairie, Queen, and Country. It’s a very well researched book, with a large section describing the many different types of fairies, and such found in British folklore. There’s also a very good pronunciation guide.
Semi HiJack
While we’re on the subject of Irish folklore, can anybody give me more information on Nuckelavee? So far I’ve got- Either has no skin, or his skin is on inside out. Rides a strange, skinless horse which may be a part of his body. Has a really big head which is too heavy for him to support. Is repelled by fresh water.
Origen understandably wrote little directly of Celtic mythology, however he did touch briefly on the subtle matter of incorporeal creatures in his Principia, in connection with certain apocryphal writings:
More concisely, the Saviour is not a fey spirit like a brownie or leprechaun.
Glad I could help.