Great title. 
On A Cable To Jewish Life a rabbi with a Downs Syndrome child is speaking with Rabbi Katzmann, and it is mentioned that abortion is not available to Jewish parents; Mrs. Plant heard them say “neither is amniocentesis”, that if it is done the child is put up for adoption. Far be it from me to contradict a Rabbi, (or, G-d forbid Mrs. Plant,) but is the later true?
I have not heard any opinions that state that doing an amnio is forbidden. However, not being a posek (decisor of Jewish law), I would have to do further research.
In any event, if an amnio is done (whether forbidden or not), one is not required to put the child up for adoption. Of this I am 99.9999% sure. I don’t know where that came from. Even if the amnio revealed birth defects, the parents can certainly choose to raise their own child.
Zev Steinhardt
I used to be a production intern for the producer of the show, a woman named Bea Moss. As I recall, very often, the guests on her show were Lubavitchers. I don’t know if Rabbi Katzmann or Mrs. Plant are Lubavitchers, but if they are, it certainly would explain a bit.
I do know that the late Lubavitcher Rebbe was against doing routine ultrasounds. As a result, many (most?) Lubavitch women do not have them done. I would imagine (and I’m guessing here, not being a Lubavitcher) that they would also not have routine amnios as well. But, in any event, I still can’t see the basis for saying that if one is done the child must be given up for adoption, even if a birth defect is found. Are you sure you heard correctly carnivousplant?
Zev Steinhardt
Whoops, sorry. I didn’t realize “Mrs. Plant” was your wife. I thought she was another guest on the show. My boo-boo…
Zev Steinhardt
It sounds like it could be a mixup of facts and ideas to me:
If abortion is definitely not an option, what would be the point of amniocentesis? - It seems the only reason to do it would be that if the child has some ‘undesirable’ trait like Downs, the required mechanisms for adoption could be put into motion before birth.
Rather did Mrs. Plant hear correctly, and that is what the post is about.
;j
Rabbi Katzmann is Lubavitcher. Mrs. Plant is not, although she sings along with the “Mosiach” song at the end of the program.
PS-Any idea why the Rebbe was against ultrasound?
This sounds wacky to me. Aren’t there things that could be detected by an ultrasound and then treated in utero, so that the problem would either be corrected or much less severe by the time the baby was born? Does amnio only detect irreparable genetic defects?
Why would anyone be against ultrasounds???
I just posted a question to Chabad, and will post the reply.
Robin
I imagine the objection to ultrasound and/or amnio would be that since Judaism does not allow abortion in case of a problem with the fetus, knowing about such things in advance can only cause grief and anxiety - and perhaps temptation to abort - therefore it’s better not to know.
Once upon a time, this was true to a great degree. These days, there are things that can be done for a fetus in utero that can in fact help the fetus if it seems to not be developing properly. So I don’t know if such objections hold up.
There is also a (quite small) risk of miscarriage when amniocentesis is performed.
I suspect that the adoption thing was mentioned in relation to “the temptation to abort” (or put up for adoption). Some Baptists might adopt the child, and then where would you be?
The ultrasounds though-isn’t this used for things like seeing if someone has twins, or sex of the baby?
And don’t they use it for labor, to tell if the baby is in distress?
I can see amniocentesis, but ultra sounds-aren’t they routine medical-and used for other medical situations?
I think ultrasonuds may be regular anymore, my sister has had two, and a former coworker had one. I realize this is all very anecdotal, but i do not know of many pregnant women.
When I was pregnant, I had an ultrasound almost every appointment. It’s just a quick and dirty way to check the health of the baby without going through a lot of uncomfortable tests.
Robin
1 in 200 chance of miscarriage as a result of amniocentisis. Some claim 1 in 400, but that is under a study where the doctors used ultra sound for needle placement which is not routine practice. The 1 in 200 is more typical of real world occurence.
I can’t see either as a small enough risk.
Ultrasound guidance isn’t routine practice in amniocentesis? How else does the OB place the needle properly into the uterus, and how does the OB not hit the fetus with the needle?
From this site:
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Robin
Sideline question: what is a Lubavitcher, and why is that important?
Thank you.
A Lubavitcher is a member of a sect of ultra-orthodox Jews that seeks to follow all commandments, and that includes commandments as applied to modern technology.
It’s important because the OP mentioned that his wife had heard that amniocentesis is not allowed according to Jewish law.
Robin