Pearl Jam took the opening riff from The Who’s Water and used it for their song Black. They didn’t change anything. Not a thing.
Ok, I’m done.
I have heard neither song, so I can’t agree or disagree. But I’m curious to know if you’ve looked to find guitar tab on both songs to see how similar they are (assuming tab is readily available). Are they merely 90% similar or is it 98% or more?
Pearl Jam also ripped off part of Led Zeppelin’s “Going to California” in the opening of “Given to Fly” (off of the Yield CD) I like both bands, though for each band (and for so many others) their latter releases don’t hold up to their earlier material.
I have never noticed any resemblance between the two songs.
Even if there is some similarity, that’s pretty common in rock. It’s not that broad of a genre, and there’s a lot of intragenre stealing/sharing. And it’s not as if The Who never ripped anyone off/paid tribute to them either – they were always quite open about their influences. As is Pearl Jam, for that matter.
The Who being one of their primary influences.
I don’t think Given to Fly rips off GtC in the same way that people say it does. The vocal melody is very similar in the verses, which is where that connection comes from, but the guitar part is pretty different: just because they are both “jangly” doesn’t mean they are the same thing. They’re also in different time signatures I think.
Haven’t heard “Water” but hey, how many bands have used that chord progression? Probably about 5000 of them, in multiple songs.
Bah. Dig deep enough and you’ll find songs with even closer similarities. Some obscure ones:
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The song “Nepenthe” by Sentenced is virtually a note-for-note ripoff of Bathory’s “Under the Runes”. Except for the lyrics, the songs sound totally identical.
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Glenn Hughes recorded a song called “Make My Day” that uses the same melody and keyboard signature as “That Was Yesterday” by Foreigner. (It’s on a collection of demos I have, so I don’t know if it was ever released or whether it came before or after the Foreigner song.)
Of course, with a good enough lawyer, any artist can successfully sue another for supposedly “ripping off” one of their hooks. For instance, Vanilla Ice was successfully used for using the same bass hook in “Ice Ice Baby” that was in “Under Pressure” by Queen & David Bowie. Also, Nirvana got sued by Killing Joke for using the same guitar hook in “Come As You Are” that appeared in KJ’s song “Eighties”, when the two songs otherwise sound nothing alike!!
That one’s not much of a stretch if you ask me. As a DJ I’ve often played “Under Pressure”, and a friend and I have a tradition of always singing the song together when we’re doing karaoke, and when the song begins people always think it’s “Ice, Ice Baby”.
As someone who knows how to play both songs, there is a difference. I’m sure Pearl Jam intended the similarities, though, as Pearl jam oftentimes pays homage to The Who. I don’t think there is going to be a lawsuit in this case, either, because I know several fans of The Who who owe it to Pearl Jam for even discovering The Who in the first place.
I read an interview with Kurt Cobain once and he said that they got the main riff from Smells Like Teen Spirit from the Boston ong More Than a Feeling but he just sped it up. I didn’t believe it until I played SLTS on my guitar but slowed it down. Sure enough, same same GI.
Same, same, though slightly different.
I give the edge to Boston because of the cool arpeggio intro.
At this point I think I ought to point out that Eddie Vedder and Pete Townshend are close personal and professional friends. Vedder and Townshend have in fact performed together on three occasions - the House of Blues in 1998 (available on CD), an appearance on David Letterman in 1999, and at a Who concert at the Albert Hall in 2000 (available on DVD). When several people were trampled at a Pearl Jam concert in Europe, Townshend was the first to call and offer his sympathies. If the “borrowing” was intentional, it’s likely that Pete either gave him permission to use it or actually suggested it.
That makes sense, except that “Black” is on Ten, Pearl Jam’s first album (released in, I think 1992). I’m pretty sure Eddie Vedder didn’t hang out with Pete Townshend when he was a surf bum in San Diego.
In my copy of the single Black (released 1991), there is mention of Townsend’s name in the liner notes. It is actually in the “special thanks” section along with Neil Young, Cris Cornell (and the rest of Soundgarden) and Alice in Chains. Funny that there is no mention of Nirvana.
Perhaps the use of the similar (though not the same) guitar part is what expedited Vedder and Townsend’s friendship. However, due to the fact that differences do exist, I find it hard to believe that whoever owns the rights to The Who’s material would have any grounds for a lawsuit.
I’m just speculating at this point, but in 1992, Townshend did live in San Diego for a while while composing the Broadway production of Tommy (its debut was at the La Jolla Playhouse). It’s not impossible that he may have seen Pearl Jam when they were playing small local gigs and struck up a rapport with Vedder at that time.
Considering that Cobain couldn’t stand Pearl Jam, and said so in print numerous times, why would Pearl Jam thank Nirvana?
Late in his life Cobain did make amends with Vedder and publically said he was sorry for all the nasty things he’d said about him and Pearl Jam (see Cobain’s last Rolling Stone interview), although he always maintained that he didn’t care for their music.
Another reason for Pearl Jam not to thank Nirvana in the early days was simply that Nirvana was not one of their influences. Pearl Jam had no reason to mention Nirvana in 1991. It’s undeniable that Nirvana’s success with Nevermind/“Smells Like Teen Spirit” gave other bands from the Seattle area a huge boost, but prior to that they weren’t as well known even locally as Soundgarden and Alice in Chains. Members of those bands were also personal friends of members of Pearl Jam, so all the more reason to single them out for thanks.
I just listened to both intros back to back, and they ARE NOT the same. They sound kinda similar (same chord? same FX?), but if I was on a jury for that civil suit I’d definitely vote in Pearl Jam’s favor.
Trying to understand the whole music copyright thing is a fun way to waste an afternoon. Ever since George was found “guilty” of unconsiously using He’s So Fine to write My Sweet Lord I’ve been waiting for the next wrinkle which will change what can be used and what can’t.
“Ideas” are common property, anybody can use an idea from someone else. The implementation of an idea is private property, you have to pay to use someone else’s. I can write a song using examples of irony, but if I copy the lyrics or melody of Alana’s “Ironic”…we’ll, I’ll have my checkbook ready. In between we end up in court and who knows what will happen?
PS
I heard that Huey Lewis sued Ray Parker, Jr. over Ghostbusters (a rip-off of I Want a New Drug) but I never heard what happened. Does anyone know?
Huey Lewis did sue Ray Parker Jr. over the similarity of the theme from ‘Ghostbusters’ to ‘I Want a New Drug’. It was settled out of court in 1995. Many cites – do a search on the song titles and “lawsuit”. VH1 talked about it recently too.
Also, although I don’t have a cite, I seem to remember that an executive associated with the movie had written a memo saying, “We need a song like this Huey Lewis one”. That constituted a paper trail, which is a rarity for such cases.
IIRC, George was found guilty, but then bought the company that had the rights to “He’s So Fine”.