Pedestrians standing by crosswalk (but not crossing)

The BBQ Pit
1

Here in Calgary, they’re getting serious about pedestrian safety. As a driver and a pedestrian, I embrace this. If a pedestrian comes up to a crosswalk and wants to cross, I make every effort to stop safely for them. The problem is pedestrians who either don’t know or recognize that it would really be appreciated by drivers if they don’t just hang around by crosswalks if they aren’t crossing.

This morning I was driving to work, and a boy of about 10 stopped on the sidewalk, and looked like he was waiting to cross (there is a school across the street from where he was standing). I came to a stop and waited for him to cross. He stood on the sidewalk, facing into the crosswalk, and continued to stand there. I continued to sit and wait for him to cross. Okay, this is getting silly. Oh, it’s getting more interesting - a police car has just pulled up to the intersection as well. The fine for a driver interfering with a pedestrian in a crosswalk is (to my best knowledge) around $300 here, and double that in a school zone (which I was in).

Now it’s really getting silly, because I’m afraid to continue driving with the boy standing by the crosswalk, because I don’t want to get hit with a possible $600 fine. It might have been defensible, but I don’t want to take a chance on that. Finally, the police pull over and ask me if there’s a problem, I say that the boy looks like he wants to cross but he won’t go, the policeman asks the boy if he wants to cross, he says no, the policeman thanks me for my caution and indicates I can go.

What a ridiculous situation. Young man, if you have to stand and wait for someone, would you mind not doing it right at the crosswalk? And I’d like to include bus stops in this rant, too - a bus stop right by the crosswalk is also adding to the muddle out here. And while I’m at it, pedestrians, please remember that in winter, drivers can’t always stop for you, based on road conditions - if I’m on sheer ice, please allow me a reasonable time for stopping - don’t just hit the pedestrian walk button and hop out in front of me. Thank you. Let’s all try to stay safe out here.

2

Reminds me UT in reverse! There, everyone just hops across the road at any time. Not that there’s much to worry about. AFAIK, there hasn’t been an acident in years, so…

C’est la vie.

3

featherlou I totally agree … especially when adults do it, because I always assume that most adults either drive or at leat have a clue about what drivers have to deal with. Kids … meh … I give 'em a bit more leeway.

On another note, when I lived in Calgary a few years ago, I was AMAZED at how many drivers were very courteous of pedestrians. When I first moved there I didn’t have a vehicle, and I could not believe how easy it was to cross the street - VERY different from the places I’ve lived in BC.

Thanks for listening …
S.

4

Also, it annoys the hell out of me when pedestrians choose to jaywalk across Broadway in a 45 MPH zone wearing all-black in the dead of night and then wonder why cars aren’t stopping for them and flip people the bird.

If you’re jaywalking, as long as nobody is intentionally trying to hurt you, you have no reason to be angry at anyone or anything except your own stupidity. But this is Boulder, and all the dirty hippies just don’t care.

5

Wow. I really don’t understand why people should not be allowed to stand on streetcorners. Or why drivers should stop when they see someone standing on a sidewalk. It drives me crazy to be stuck behind drivers like that. It even drives me crazy when I am a pedestrian and a driver stops for me, even when I was in fact intending to cross the street. Forcing cars to stop and idle frequently is a waste of time and fuel. When I am walking, I wait for the cars to pass by like I’m supposed to. There is no need for the driver to stop until the pedestrian steps into the street. That isn’t the law where you’re from?

6

The law here is that if someone is waiting to cross the street you have to stop for them and wait until they have completely crossed the street.

They just finished a crackdown on this problem because we had a high incidence of pedestrians getting hit, it’s 600 for the driver if they go without letting the pedestrian go by, and 25 for the pedestrian if they jaywalk (iirc). I do recall them saying that more pedestrians than driveres were ticketed during the crackdown though.

7

When a friend of mine moved here from Montreal, he and I went out one evening. We were downtown and were walking to the Rose and Crown (a local pub). I got to the crosswalk on a one way street, looked at the traffic (that was a way’s away) and steped out into the crosswalk.

Friend flipped out! He grabed me and was like “Yer gonna get killed!!” Having lived in Montreal for a time, I just said “Nope” hauled him into the crosswalk and smiled as he stared in stunned disbelief as all the cars stopped and waited for us to cross.

This is kind of a cool city to live in. :slight_smile:

8

Those ped priority laws were passed by idiots. Peds have the sidewalk, cars have the street. You can wait until the traffic light changes before charging out into the street and expecting someone operating a two-ton vehicle to test the laws of physics because you’re an impatient putz.

9

Its that “Taco Bell” guy just faking you out.

10

From my OP:

Drivers don’t have a choice here. It is the law, and they have recently upped the fines drastically to get people to obey it. I would love it if they would have an “information blitz” or something to get the message across to pedestrians: drivers HAVE TO STOP. Don’t stand at the crosswalk, and wave drivers to keep going. As a driver, I am risking a HUGE fine if I do that. Oh, and we’re not talking about at lights here, but at crosswalks.

11

I forgot to add. This law only applies at crosswalks where there are no lights or is not being directed by a police officer.

So if you are being an impatient putz and walk against the light it’s still considered your own damn fault, but not every crossing has a light.

12

From Here

13

Yup, that’s the one I was talking about, Flutterby. $575 fine, eh? I knew it was high, but that’s really high.

14

They were saying 600 on the news a few nights back.

I kinda like the law actually because I am a pedestrian, it’s nice that I don’t have to stand at a marked crossing and wait… and wait… and wait… for everyone to by. Before I used to dodge traffic right there and I’m amazed I didn’t get dinged.

15

featherlou, when you wrote that a driver must yield to pedestrians “in a crosswalk,” I did not interpret the phrase to mean “on a sidewalk near a crosswalk.” A crosswalk is located in a street. A pedestrian cannot be on a sidewalk and in a crosswalk at the same time. There is nothing in Flutterby’s link that contradicts my interpretation. It states that every intersection is a crosswalk. Therefore, a driver must yield to a pedestrian who is in an intersection. This law does not appear to be more strict than the one where I grew up.

16

Like featherlou and alice and probably a few more of the posters here, I’m in Calgary, and while I think it’s a sensible policy, I also think that we all need to use a little sense in interpreting it.

First of all, a little background. I spent much of my life in Toronto, and have a similar approach to crossing streets as alice’s friend from Montreal. Streets are car territory; the pedestrian who ventures into them must necessarily be alert, cautious, and ready to yield the right-of-way to the two-ton metal beast hurtling down the road. It is not stopping, nor is it generally expected to. The pedestrian is. More than a few times in my life, I’ve had to literally dance across Yonge Street, but I always made it safely precisely because I was alert, knew where the next car was coming from, and fully aware that I was on the cars’ turf.

So. Here in Calgary, I find that the two-ton metal beast is expected to stop for pedestrians at crosswalks. All very well and good (and IMHO, an admirable policy), but as a pedestrian, I have found that drivers don’t just stop at crosswalks. They stop everywhere they see pedestrians who might, at some unknown point in the future, decide to cross the street, the parking lot, the driveway. I’ve seen cars stop at corner crosswalks when pedestrians approaching the corner are fully 100 feet away and have give no indication whether they will be crossing the street or simply walking around the corner. I’ve had traffic stop in front of my own home as I’m walking down the front steps to my parked car, just in case I change my mind and want to cross the street in front of my house. I’ve exited the doors at the mall just to get a breath of air before going back inside, and had traffic stop so I could cross to my car.

This is silly.

At the same time, I think a number of Calgary pedestrians need to spend a little time trying to cross streets in Montreal or Toronto, since they somehow think that traffic will magically stop for them. I’ve seen them simply stride into crosswalks when a great glumph of cars is bearing down on them at 60 km/h (35 mph). Brakes are slammed, screaming tires are heard, and on at least one occasion, I’ve heard the metal-on-metal crunch of a rear-ender occurring. And the pedestrian just blithely continues on, secure in his or her knowledge that he or she has the right of way.

This is also silly. And dangerous.

I think a little common sense is needed on all sides:

Pedestrians, you need to plan a bit. If you’re approaching a crosswalk and planning to cross, try to time it so nobody needs to slam on their brakes. Don’t congregate near corners or crosswalks if you don’t plan to cross. If you’re waiting for a bus, make it clear that you’re at the bus stop and not waiting to cross the street (not always possible, given the design of some of the bus stops, but do your best). Be alert, cross when the traffic does indeed stop for you, and be ready to yield the right of way (that is, do not cross) if it seems that it will not. Never blithely walk into the street hoping that traffic will stop.

Drivers, you need some advice too. Stop for pedestrians who are standing on the curb at crosswalks, certainly. But remember the key part of that phrase: at crosswalks. Yes, in front of the mall doors is a crosswalk, but until I walk the twenty feet from the door to the curb, you don’t have to stop. The road in front of my home is not a crosswalk; stopping while I walk down my front steps does neither you nor me any favours, especially if I’m going to my car parked in front of my house. And the pedestrian who is over forty feet away from a corner crosswalk likely will not get there until you have driven past it. Be alert and be ready to stop in such situations, but also be sensible.

Anfd finally, to the City of Calgary itself: Folks, you need to make crosswalks stand out more. Some have flashing lights and warning signs for drivers, but there are many, many, more that do not. Trying to spot the crosswalks through all the visual noise on some main and busy roads (Country Hills Boulevard near Harvest Hills is a great example) is like trying to find a needle in a haystack. Make the crosswalks stand out, and we’ll all be better off.

Yep, it’s a sensible policy. And it will be most effective if we all use a little sense.

17

Another Calgarian checking in -
I worry about the time that the police decide to enforce their massive new fine in downtown Calgary. If drivers turning corners waited until the pedestrians were completely across the street before proceeding, traffic would come to an absolute standstill.

18

Hear hear! I’m half pedestrian, half driver (I drive half an hour to my parking spot, then walk half an hour to my job), and I’ve seen plenty of melonheads on both sides.

It’s funny how traffic behaves, you know. There are some streets where drivers will stop for anyone setting foot on the sidewalk, and other streets where I can be standing in the middle of the street on the boulevard, obviously in a crosswalk, obviously trying to cross, and traffic will not stop (Memorial Drive near downtown, if you’re curious). Pedestrians really, really do need to be alert in this city - maybe more so than other cities, because if you’re used to drivers stopping for you, it can be really dangerous when they don’t.

19

Preach it! I am more often pedestrian than driver, and here on a college campus it’s quite normal to cross at places that aren’t intersections. I wish drivers would just go by but instead, one in three or so will stop. By the time I can tell a driver’s stopping, he might as well have gone by, since it’s approximately zero delay for me to wait while a car goes by. And the worst is when a driver stops, the next lane keeps going, and I’m stuck waiting for all the traffic to clear while the asshole who stopped gesticulates frantically.

I don’t see the point in that law, anyway. As a pedestrian, it’s not as though I trust cars to just stop for me. So I don’t see how it would help since I still would wait to be sure the cars were really going to stop.

20

Yah, not a chance. Although I have had some success with holding my hand out, a la traffic cop (you know, in the “stop” position). I sure wouldn’t bank on it if I had my niece or my dog with me though.