Penn Jillette: Religious folk SHOULD proseletyze?!?!

Because IF you buy into the cosmology, the afterlife lasts a whole hell of a lot longer than this one.

Because it lasts for ever and ever and ever. And then, when you think it must be over, you realise it’s only just begun. So, basically, a long time, would be the summary.

I dunno…forever kind of takes the “duration” out of time, if you get my drift. There is no time, if it’s forever, it just is. But that doesn’t have anything to do with “importance.” What kind of job will you have? Do you get new skills when you transition to the other side? Do you hang with your friends and family? Do you play canasta? I’m just not sure what the expectation is once I get there. I can make it as important or frivolous or hedonistic as I want, can’t I?

Depends. In the Biblical Christian version of Heaven, you’ll (literally) sing the praises of God all the livelong eternity and you’ll like it! Sound good?

Uh, yeah. I’m giddy with anticipation.

The afterlife is not a sequence of moments that happens to be endless. Rather, it is a place without time. The common misconception seems to arise from cartoons and other unworthy sources, not from any sound understanding of the issue.

He did not seem to be in a joking mood at all, but that did puzzle me. Especially for a man who has admitted to taking as many full Gideon Bibles as he can from hotel rooms, and using them to hold up furniture, etc.

Something tells me he’s going to be treating that pocket NT/Pslms/Prvbs with more respect.

I think the idea is it will be a completely different kind of existence. You won’t be able to relate it to anything you’re experiencing now, except maybe as a vague analogy. YOu won’t have a body, at least not one like you have now. Words like “hedonism” or “frivolity” or “job” or “family” won’t have any meaning. It will either be an eternity of transcendant joy or transcendant suffering.

Or so I’ve been told.

Do I have a memory? Do I remember what my Earthly existence was?

If it’s a completely different existence, will I know I’m floating blissfully along or being endlessly tortured (thanks, loving god!!!)? Will I have anything to compare my existence to?

Except that I can do good deeds, be helpful & compassionate, etc. and be an adherent of a whole range of philosophies. Heck, I can do these things & be a fervent Ayn Rand Objectivist. BUT if I believe my good nature is due to my adherence to a certain POV that would benefit everyone, then I should specify what POV that is.

Something about Judaism being non-proselytizing- that was not necessarily always the case. Around the first centuries BCE to CE, there seems to have been Hillel-esque efforts to win Graeco-Romans to Noachic Monotheism. And there is presently a similar effort in some Hasidic groups, I think the Lubavitchers (it was a project from the late Rabbi Schneerson, IIRC). The Judaic non-proselytizing policy came about due to the brutal responses to such efforts from the Imperial Christian authorities .

Well, again, you’re asking the wrong person here, but I’ve heard all sorts of explanations. Basically the way “you” experience things will be so radically different that no concept or word can describe it. You won’t float or move but neither will you stand still. The entire concept of motion won’t be relevant anymore, tied as it is to physics, biology, and the laws of the universe. Even the word eternity is misleading as it implies time, which will no longer have meaning. The eternal bliss comes from being in God’s presence, the torment comes from the absence of God.

Of course, there’s also the Jack Chick idea.

So many gods, so many heavens, so many hells. I’m sure you can see how an atheist could find this endlessly amusing.

What would y’all think about taking the discussion of “Christian Afterlife views” into a new thread?

I’m in, but can’t it be “all” afterlife views?

I want to be reborn as a woman’s horse saddle.

The actual quote is from St. Francis of Assisi: “Preach the Gospel at all times. If necessary, use words.” It’s one of my favorite quotes.

As far as I know, the Lubavichers exclusively prosthelitize other Jews.

I don’t think that the non-prostheletizing policy came about because of persecution. In my opinion, it seems more likely that it came about because Judiasm is essentially a tribal, national religion - some sects of course did believe in breaking that national bond and proselytizing: the most famous of which abandoned the markers of tribal ethno-nationality like circumcision and keeping Kosher - they are today known as “Christians”. :smiley:

I guess nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition. They believed eternal salvation of the soul was much more important than eartly life and so, if you had to burn heretics at the stake, well, that was well worth it.

Keep in mind I’m not advocating that view. I’m not religious. But if they were true believers (and I doubt everyone was - most were going with the group, afraid of persecution, and some were sadistic assholes) - then it’s a logical extension of their belief system. If they could guarantee someone salvation (and avoidance of hell) through torture and killing, then for that belief system they were doing a far greater good.

Of course, in the real world, it’s all bunk, and all they commited was evil - but those actions are in a twisted way more humane than believing everyone will go to hell and not trying to stop it.

Pretty much like Democracy and Communism.