Permanent Resident vs Citizenship

Factual Questions
1

My fiance is Japanese and living in the US with me. We are going to be married in the spring of next year and we have a long standing debate I would like to settle.

She is of the opinion that it is preferable to remain a Japanese citizen with her status as a permanent resident. I believe that it would be better to be a citizen of the country you plan to live in for the rest of your life. Maybe I’m being overly paranoid but the more I look around the more I see the rights of people living here being stripped away one layer at a time. I see non-citizens as particularly vulnerable to this, a prime example being the situation in Guantanamo (sp?) where there are lots of people being held without access to a lawyer or a trial. I know the events that led up to it are exceptional but the fact is these people are there and nobody can get near them. Only recently has the supreme court done something to challenge that situation and it was too little too late. I fear that she would not have the same rights I do and in the wrong situation it could go very badly. For all I know in 2010 they pass some law requiring all non-citizens to leave the country. The one good point she does make is that if she becomes a US citizen she will no longer officially be listed as a Japanese citizen (she says no dual citizenship in Japan) and won’t be able to travel as freely there. I say its just paperwork and that she will always be Japanese regardless.

So, my real question is:

What is the downside to remaining Japanese and living in the US permanently?

2

I think you’ve nailed the most important one: she’ll be more likely to be subject to the increasing paranoia of the US Government.

If she ever wants to leave the US for a significant length of time (roughly a year, although there’s no strict definition in the law) she will need to get a Re-Entry Permit first, or else she mightn’t be allowed back in. If she makes frequent trips out of the country and the Immigration Officer becomes suspicious that she isn’t actually living in the US, as required by the green card, the officer can take it away from her.

She also won’t be able to vote, except in local elections if your locality permits it.

However, I believe she is correct that she will lose her Japanese citizenship if she becomes a US citizen. And there is definitely more to this than paperwork.

It’s really up to her and what she’s comfortable with.

3

She also wants a kind of escape hatch. If the crap really hits the fan in this country as a Japanese citizen she would legally be allowed to bring her husband (me) and children with her to Japan. Makes sense, I just want to be sure that there are no big pitfalls to living her as a non-citizen. I just have a gut feeling there is something else to it that I haven’t considered. I don’t want to have to die defending my home from rampagining government agents trying to take my family away.

4

My father-in-law is Canadian and had been a permanent resident since he attended college here in the 50s. He became a US citizen a couple of years ago as he neared retirement and the government was moving to exclude non-citizens from getting social security payments even though he’d been paying into the system for decades. I doubt Social Security itself is an issue for your fiance, but the general idea of excluding non-citizens from social services, health care, education, etc. might be an issue.

5

Practically speaking, the major disadvantage is that she’ll have to report change of address every time the two of you move. One advantage is that she’s uneligible for jury duty (perfect excuse, and with a clean conscience!) :smiley:

I’m in her situation right now (Danish citizen living in the US w. Green Card), and I’m in no hurry to give up my Danish citizenship. It sucks not being able to vote, but I can take part in the political process in other ways (volunteering etc.), which I do. ruadh lists a very valid concern, though: It seems as if a lot of the rules are really just guidelines, wide open to interpretation by any USCIS agent who may or may not like your face that day. That’s pretty darn scary. (I do not enjoy interacting with the USCIS. At all.)

Putting on the tin-foil hat, if the fecal matter really collides with the turbine blades in the near future, who says legislation can’t be passed that makes it possible to revoke citizenship ?

Do not be blind to the fact that a lot of your identity, like it or not, is tied up in your nationality. It’s not just a hat you can put on and take off, as logical as it may seem. A lot of emotional luggage goes with it. Speaking for myself, I’m a Dane and for the time being plan to remain one - I could not pledge allegiance to the United States with a straight face. Not that I dislike the US - I like this country a heck of a lot - it’s just that I’m simply not an American. (Your fiancee might be shy about making a similar point for fear of it sounding as if she’s critical of the US.)

By all means let it be up to her. If she wants to change, she can do so down the road. But it’s a huge step to take, once you’re actually faced with it, and when you’re tackling a couple of other life-altering changes - marriage, moving country - it’s a good feeling that you haven’t severed all ties to your former life.

6

She should, however, make this perfectly clear with the proper Japanese authority – sometimes the home country will for some purposes continue to recognize someone’s claim of nationality (e.g. the nightmare scenario of possible persecution)

7

And some countries simply don’t acknowledge that you give up your citizenship when you become a citizen of a new country, even if becoming a citizen requires you to take an oath renouncing that other citizenship. (Oddly enough, the US is one of these countries…) Best to ask someone who really knows what’s going on, e.g. a Japanese consulate.

8

One disadvantage of US citizenship that has not yet been mentioned is that US citizens are required to file income tax returns on all their income, regardless of the origin of the income and regardless of whether they are resident in the US. They may not have to pay tax on foreign-source income, due to the operation of a double-tax treaty, but even in those circumstances they still have to file a return.

(This is a consideration for me, an Australian citizen permanent resident in the US, who intends to return to Australia when I retire).

9

Most relevant issues have already been covered, but another tax issue to keep in mind involves estate taxes. I’m very fuzzy on the whole thing, and I’m sure you don’t want to be thinking about death before you even manage to get married, but sometimes there are estate tax issues if the surviving spouse is not a U.S. citizen and wants to repatriate to the country of origin. IIRC there are certain circumstances under which a person who abandons U.S. permanent residence or renounces U.S. citizenship is assumed to be doing so to evade U.S. income/estate taxes; I’d look into it if I were you.

Also, keep in mind that the case law on dual nationality is very messy and changes constantly.

Eva Luna, Immigration Paralegal

10

Another thing to think about too is the ability to pass on citizenship to any future children.

There are some countries that make you renounce other citizenships when you take out citizenship of the new country, but if you are born a citizen of another country, then you get to keep it, including citizenship conferred by descent.

For example, because of the citizenships of my parents and location of my birth, I hold three citizenships. Not because I chose to take them out, but just because I was born. I could renounce them, but I didn’t get a choice about whether I wanted them. (I did have to register with each of the countries so they know about me and recognise me as such, but it was more "prove your mum was a citizen of our country when you were born and that you are really who you say you are and we’ll send you a spiffy certificate, but even if I hadn’t, I wouldn’t be a citizen).

Now I don’t know the laws of the US and Japan, but a (really quick) google search shows that any children you have that are born in the US may be entitled to dual citizenship of both the US and Japan. (This link is where I get this from).

Now, holding multiple citizenship can provide huge advantages - it increases the number of countries you can visit without a visa (since the different nations will have different visa treaties with different countries), you can work without permits in either country (and potentially a few others, again depending on visa arrangements each nation has with other nations). You may be entitled to various government grants and benefits (for example, one country may offer free or subsidised university education to its citizens to which you’d be entitled). And in the event of major distaster in your country of residence, the government of your other citizenship may well evacuate you, and you’ve automatically got somewhere you are entitled to live. Plus it’s a great talking point.

But multiple citizenships can also have a downside too - you may be bound to the laws of multiple countries, even when overseas (for example Australia has underage sex-tourism laws that you can be charged under despite the criminal acts being conducted in a foreign territory). and if I commit a crime in Australia, the Canadian’s can’t help me (or vice versa), because as an Australian in Australia, the Aussies get first crack at me. The simple solution is don’t commit crime in any country :D. But you may be subject to taxation, compulsory national service etc. in both countries - do the research, and remember that the kid may not have a choice of taking out citizenship of both parents, it may be automatically conferred, and when you get that call up for your year’s military service in a country you are a citizen of, but have never even visited, you still have to go. It’s just something to think about an be careful of.

11

Um… what?

I’ve never had to.

12

You should. Just had to do it for my permanent resident wife. It’s the law.

13

It’s been the law for a long time, but they are starting to enforce it more heavily over the past couple of years. However, giving USCIS’ propensity for losing mail and/or taking aeons to match mail to files, I’d strongly advise informing them of a change of address by some traceable method, such as certified mail. The appropriate form is the AR-11:

http://uscis.gov/graphics/formsfee/forms/ar-11.htm

14

I did a little checking… it turns out since my parents’ home is still my primary address (even though I’ve been living by myself for six years) I’ve just never had to inform the INS.

Eva, isn’t putting a new address on your W-4 considered sufficient?

15

Nope - the W-4 is a tax form, which goes to the IRS. You need to inform U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (formerly known as INS). FAQ and legal authority:

http://uscis.gov/graphics/howdoi/address.htm

16

On the Japanese citizenship issue, perhaps we can channel hibernicus. His wife is a Japan native who has to put up with Ireland’s absofuckinglutely ridiculous noncitizen laws, so I’m pretty sure he’s up to speed with Japan’s requirements in this regard.