I’m not sure whether this goes in GQ or maybe IMHO as I’m not sure it has a definite answer, but I think it probably does. Anyway…
I have a freind. She’s Japanese. She’s the same age as I am (22). When I met her, she was with a large group from her school visiting my school here in the states. Anyway, a lot of pictures were taken. In almost every one of them, numerous students were holding 2 fingers up in a V, or a “peace sign.”
Even though it’s been a couple years since we were last together, we trade pictures ocasionally and she almost always is giving that V sign, along with a number of friends. I have since seen this hand gesture repeated in other photos featuring Japanese youth.
So my question is, what does this signify? Is it just a “peace sign” of does it have some different significance? Given the large number of eople I’ve seen do it, it must be some sort of cutlural thing. Does anyone know how recent this practice is? Or if indeed, only younger people (say, under 25 or so) do this when getting their picture taken. I know not every Japanese person does this, but it seems pretty ubiquitous, so I’m thinking there’s something to it I’m missing.
If you have any info, it is appreciated as I’ve been wondering this for quite a while. Thanks.
In Thailand they do something similar to this, but only the young people. If you take their photo they hold up their thumb and index finger (sort of like a pistol), typically alongside their face. I asked a Thai friend why they do this and she answered, “to look cool”. Personally I didn’t get the cool part, but my kids still do this when their pictures is taken now, so I guess there is something alluring to it.
[sub]If I can find a digital photo of a Thai doing this I will post a link here.[/sub]
I think it’s just something to do with the hands. Kida like a ‘cheese’ for the fingers. Although it means peace I wouldn’t put more meaning into it then cheese.
It’s caught on here in Hong Kong as well. Even adults - politicians, pop stars, etc - do it when being photographed in an informal setting. Looks really stupid. Heck, even I do it without realizing.
I don’t think the people doing this are conscious of the sign being a “peace sign” as such, but I suspect that’s where it originally came from. Maybe back in the 60s-70s John Lennon or someone did it, some Japanese idol of the time copied it, and kids started to do it.
It signifies happiness or fun. Japanese girls, in particular, don’t like to laugh of smile in such a way as to show their teeth (it’s considered unladylike), so perhaps this is an alternative gesture. Just a guess.
Yeah, I think you’re both on the right track, Osiris and Shibb. It probably is just a cool or fun thing that all the young’uns do. But I’m just wondering if there isn’t something more to it or now. If someone knows if it has some meaning to it and how long its been a trend.
And as clever as I think The Ryan’s Verizon idea is, it suddenly hit me that I dont believe the “V” sound exists in the Japanese language. I don’t see any words containing V anywhere in my flimsy li’l Japanese-English dictionary (though it came with a basc introductory “Learn Japanese” book and only lists words you learn in there, so it’s hardly complete). Anyway, point is, the V shouldn’t have any significance just as a letter since it’s doubtful one would make a gesture in the shape of a letter that had no place in your language.
Just as a side note, I suddenly realize I’ve also seen the “victory sign” in Japanese animation. I’m pretty sure that I’ve seen a character or 2 do it on Pokemon (un…not that I watch that with any regularity). It’s got to be fairly embedded in culture if they copy it in a cartoon (unless the cartoon came first?!)
By the way, I’d love to see that Thai picture…I wonder how many youth in other countries all have their special “camera pose?”
Sorry for all the little side questions and theories regarding this. I guess there’s a lot of little thoughts I have about it (but no definitive answers).
I’ve wondered about the origins of this gesture too. I know that currently it is only an automatic reaction to having ones picture taken. It also indicates a certain kind of picture - fun, lighthearted, and group oriented.
I always assumed that the origins of the practice dated to the occupation. Does anyone have old pictures with this sign in it?
I’d have to agree with Osiris. I asked a few people (japanese) if there were any other meanings, but nobody seemed to know of any. On Monday I’ll have some older (40-60) students in, so I’ll ask them if they made the “peace” sign when they were kids.
According to my Japanese friends, this practice first became popular in the 1980s. It may go back a little farther than that, but probably not by much. I think it was inspired by the Western peace/victory sign, but in Japan it seems to have no significance beyond “Hey, I’m having my picture taken and I’m cool!”
My Chinese friend says it’s common in China as well and tells me the origin is the V for Victory and the meaning is a very general “I (we) are great, we are the best, etc” and now it’s just something they do because it’s cool and because everybody does it and because what else are you going to do?
WAG, but it might have originated with the Tiananmen Suqare protests in 1989. I vaguely recall video of student protestors flashing the sign at every camera they could find. It seemed to be a way of covertly expressing that you supported the protests.
My wife is Thai, and she does the “V” thing with her fingers whenever I take a pictures she’s 22. So does her nieces and nefews. I’ve been to thailand a couple of times and I do recall the thumb and fore finger thing. If you want I’ll ask my wife about it, and maybe she’ll do it and snap a shot with my digital camera and post it for anyone to see what it is.
Funny thing, I went through my photos last night, and I do have a couple with the thumb/forefinger thing, but I noticed just as many with the “peace sign” gesture. I will post them later since I am having some troubles to do this with my computer at home.
Also, appropos of nothing, there is a Thai character that transliterates as a “V”, but it is pronounced as a “W”*. So as far as I can think of off the top of my head there is no “V” sound in Thai.
[sub]*I have no idea why they do stuff like this, it only adds to the confusion.[/sub]
The problem with this is that saying “cheese” does serve a purpose – your mouth approximates a smile when you say it, making you more photogenic (hopefully). But the “V” sign seems to be purpose- and meaningless.
