My dog plays with other dogs all the time. In fact, he goes once a week to “doggy daycare” to keep him socialized. There are occasionally other pit bulls in his playgroup as well. So far, nobody’s been kicked out of playgroup and even the staff there says that pits aren’t the problem dogs around there. I’m not saying that there aren’t very dog aggressive pit bulls out there, but the automatic assumption that pit bulls go around trying to murder every dog they see is a bit mistaken. I’ve even been to a pit bull only meet up with around 15-20 pit bulls playing with each other and it did not devolve into a murder scene. Imagine that.
Anyhow, I voted the last option in this poll. I’m not sure it completely summarizes my thoughts on the matter, but it’s close enough.
I have no idea if it’s the owners or just the individual dog’s temperament, but I don’t think they’re vicious or perfectly sweet all the time, just like with every other breed or mix.
I do know that I live with one and she’s the sweetest dog ever, but then I’ve never had a dog who wasn’t sweet. Maybe it’s because I’m so damned sweet. I just know this girl was found almost dead on a sandbar in the Mississippi River and they almost put her down because it was going to take so much effort for what might be a really vicious dog. Nobody knows what she went through before my roommate’s friend found her but she’s really skittish even now. But she’s such a sweet, loving, gentle baby who loves our cats and wants nothing more than to sit and watch them and if it’s a good day, get a chance to lick one behind the ear.
Well, that’s different than the public perception of them, which is maybe based on pit bull crosses with larger dogs. The Wikipedia page on pit bulls does say this, though (under “Other Studies”):
Of course, temperament is just as much issue as size. An Australian blue heeler clamped its jaws on my foot once when I was keeping it from going outside. It was lucky I had steel-toed boots on, but even then, the pressure I felt was tremendous for an animal that size. Without the boots, I’m sure it would have crushed some bones.
First case would probably result in the dogs playing, though some dogs like to fight for fun. Had a Cocker that would run up to a strange dog real friendly-like and say, “Do you like to fight? I LOVE to fight!” And they’d mix it up for a while, but never seriously. One time another dog cut her eyelid and my wife made me take her to the vet to look at it. She had the time of her life showing it off to everybody and other dogs.
Second case could result in a dog getting kicked in its head. Any breed of dog. We lived in horse country and our Dachshund hated horses so he would nip at their ankles. He was fast, though, and no iron-clad hoofs ever connected.
We’ve owned dogs, mostly large ones, for all our lives. FWIW, the only one deemed ‘vicious’ was a pedigreed yellow lab that became very territorial when I got pregnant. (He was rehomed to split his time between the state police headquarters and a duck hunting guide and never but anyone there).
We’ve had 2 German Shepherds, a beagle, a Yellow Labrador, 2 chihuahuas, a Dachshund, a Pekingese, and a Golden Retriever, and a pit bull mix rescue. The pit is by far the most submissive. I’ve yet to hear him growl and his tendency is to let the chihuahuas check out the situation first. He won’t go outside to pee at night without a ‘friend’, which is annoying to the little ones when it’s cold.
I once had a lady tell me that her vet said pit bulls have brain enzymes that degrade over time and make them go insane. She believed it.
I am confident that my friend did NOT lie! No, I did not go to your cite. Since you decided to call my friend a liar, without knowing him, I choose to disregard your input. If you had said that he was misinformed, I might have listen to you.
I realize that “Back East” it is normal to call a complete stranger a liar. I, as a western man, find this very disconcerting. I guess it is a cultural thing.
The dog was specifically bred for fighting (yes, in pits). It has the unique ability to lock its jaws - even killing it may not cause it to release.
My roomie spent time around a farm - they came out one day to find a cow on her side giving birth.
One pit bull was locked on her nose, the other was eating the calf as it came out.
A baseball bat had no effect. They ended up with a shotgun at point blank range.
There is no reason for the breed to exist and plenty for it not to.
And yes, some breeds do have brains larger than their brain pans - I saw a show about modern breed standards - including a Cocker Spaniel which suffered from horrendous seizures. It included footage of the surgery to remove the top of the skull. AS soon as the bone was removed, the brain popped up to a level about even with the top of the surrounding bone. It did not survive long.
The Cocker has been bred to have a rear-sloping skull - thereby limiting the space in the skull.
It would not surprise me that a breed developed for fight-to-the-death would be bred to have as small a skull as possible - to lessen the target size.
Well, if someone makes counterfactual claims to be alarmist, what do you want me to say? We know that no vet accredited by American Veterinary Medical Association would say such a thing, and we know that it’s so patently untrue that if a vet had said such a thing, your friend could easily determine that vet was not telling the truth, so even if it was said, repeating it is irresponsible.
Breed prejudice is analogous to racism in almost every way. We used to be told that black people were prone to be dangerous criminals. Is repeating that responsible?
Why is it “wrong” for me to say something about your friend, which I can back up, but not “wrong” for him to say something about my dog, which is demonstrably a falsehood?
Opinions are your right, even opinions founded on ignorance. But you really have to stop – and I mean, desist, not do, shut up about – posting rumors, lies, scare stories, and demonstrably untrue things about pit bulls, just like you shouldn’t post scary lies about Negroes, immigrants, or anyone else you think it’s OK to demonize.
Their brains do not swell.
Their jaws do not lock.
They do NOT do more damage than other dogs of their size – two studies have indicated the
The CDC and the AVMA have said it is not scientifically possible to determine if any breed bites more than any other breed, for excellent reasons I have detailed in other threads (also easily searchable online).
The National Canine Research Council has shown conclusively in two studies that the media report pit bull headlines dramatically differently than other dog incidents. I have cited the 2007 report here several times.
The total number of dogbite fatalities annually in the US is tiny. From all causes – including murders attacked by police dogs – it’s hovered around around 25-30 per year, out of 315 million people.
The National Canine Research Council says the incidence of dog bite injuries is decreasing: cite [warning: .pdf]
Scientists, veterinarians, and dog trainers agree – pit bulls are just dogs.
But that’s not what people are saying. Clydesdales ARE larger than other horses. Pit bulls are NOT large dogs – the breed startard(s) are specific.
If you’re saying “it’s what they were bred for,” let’s go there. Pit bulls were NOT bred to attack humans, or even to guard against humans. In fact, they were bred specifically to be gentle with their handlers even when they were riled up. The handlers did not want to die or be maimed.
I will never claim to be normal :D, but IME the pitbulls (and other “dangerous breeds”) I’ve met, if raised properly, were very good dogs. Friendly, affectionate, etc. I went to a lot of dog shows as a kid, and found that bigger dogs in general tended to be calmer and perhaps more intelligent. I worry more about being bitten by a dachshund or chihuahua than about most pitbulls. Of course, I do approach ANY dog I’m not well acquainted with carefully and pay close attention to their body language.
Granted, there can be problem individuals in any breed, so I won’t say anything absolute about any of them. Still, I think most of the problem with “dangerous breeds” is those jackasses who think having a mean dog increases their masculinity, so they abuse the dog into viciousness. :mad:
yes but what about the statistics that say 60 and 70% or more of death by dog attack each year are by pitbulls? it seems both sides have statistics and that it is hard to know which to believe.
As far as the safety of people goes I went with “dependent on owner”.
But I’ve read that they can be aggressive and violent with other dogs if left alone with them. I don’t know the validity of that, but it made me think.
We were very cautious when we brought our pit home, since we have two older chihuahuas. Of course we were concerned that the big dog might be aggressive, and it wouldn’t take much to seriously injure or kill an 8 lb. dog. Turns out that we had to break the chihuahuas from running behind the pit bulland biting his legs or jumping at his face and biting his flews. He tolerated it with great patience, but it certainly had my nerves frazzled.
I didn’t leave the 3 of them alone for over a year, but not because I believe the pit is aggressive. What if Rocko got mad and started chewing on the pits face? Would he at some point defend himself? Even a hard brush with the paw or a gentle nip could hurt a dog that’s less than 1/10th his size. I don’t put responsive behavior that causes injury in the same category as aggressive or violent behavior.
I wouldn’t go so far as to say that no Pits can be trusted, but they were bred for tenacity in fighting bulls and bears, so it seems reasonable that, even if they bite no more often than other breeds, they might still do more damage. But I suspect that, like Irish Wolfhounds, they were also bred to be placid around people.
Warning: Anecdotal evidence to follow:
I’ve known only two people who’ve had Pits as pets, and I’m pretty sure that those dogs were never abused of even handled poorly. One was very friendly toward people, but ferocious toward other dogs. The other was afraid of strangers, but friendly toward other animals, until one day it suddenly decided to disembowel the family’s other dog, a Golden Retriever with which it had shared a life long bond.
A friend of mine, a very large guy, tells a story of how he tried to stop his neighbor’s Pit from killing a cat. He says that it’s impossible to kick a Pit hard enough to make it let go, once it’s got a cat in it’s mouth. He thinks they have a higher pain tolerance than other breeds. Naturally, the cat moved on to a higher plane of existence, while the dog’s owner disappeared inside the house.
And dachshunds were bred to hunt badgers, which are quite tough. I don’t notice much hysteria about the evil weiner dogs, and those suckers have NASTY little personalities.