Playing "Hearts": Strategies?

I once came across a book with stragety pointers for the card game, “Hearts”. But, that was awhile ago, so I’m asking if any card sharks want to share their technique? How do you when your hand is “strong” enough to try and “Shoot the Moon”? …and other such pointers?

  • Jinx

I must have Bugs Bunny on the brain. “Stragety?” Or, is it “stra-tee-gee”? Let’s try it again…strategy! :smiley:

“Tomayto, Tomahto…let’s call the whole thing off!”

  • Jinx

Are you just starting out playing? If so, I wouldn’t recommend worrying about shooting the moon just yet.

If you already have a handle on the game and feel comfortable enough (I think I’m quite a good hearts player and I very rarely have enough confidence in my hand to try): You’ll want to have a lot of high cards (Aces, Kings, Queens), especially in hearts and spades. Having the Bitch would help too. I wouldn’t try it unless you had the Ace and King of hearts at least, among others as people will eat a few hearts to stop a run). If you have a lot of one suit, that can work to your advantage as well.

If I’m not going to try to run I find picking your passing cards to be the first main strategy (shit, now it doesn’t look spelled right to me :p). Let’s assume I don’t have the Bitch. I’ll get rid of the King and Ace of spades always. I always pass the Bitch, I’ll pass a few high hearts, but I always keep on semi-high one to block a run. I’ll also try to deplete myself of one suit (except spades) right at the beginning if I can.

I also like to go fishing for the Bitch and get her out of the way early, so I have a tendancy to lay down a lot of spades (if I can) early.

I suck at it, but if you can, learn to count cards (bridge players have the advantage over me here) so you know what’s been played, what’s still out there and if a suit will still walk.

Strategery.
I’ll extend what Mauvaise said; voiding yourself in hearts or diamonds (unless, of course, you’re playing “Jack of diamonds is worth -10”) is good, but I wouldn’t try it with clubs, simply because if you have no clubs at all, you can’t slough hearts or the queen of spades on the first turn (a common rule), and you’ve got to get rid of something that can’t hurt anyone! Mwahahaha!

I actually never shoot the moon, and I’ve been playing for years. Hasn’t hurt me significantly yet; I win a lot. I’ll also second fishing for the queen, if you’ve got 5+ spades.

Oh, and I’ve always subscribed to the theory that you should play Hearts with no mercy. Just throw down on 'em. If it’s starting to look like someone’s beginning a run, hold something back for them, but otherwise, let whoever is high in suit have it with both barrels. Best defense is a good offense and all that.

Card counting is more valuable in Hearts than in blackjack…

I usually do not void spades, because if someone tosses me the Bitch/Ace/King, then I’m potentially screwed. For shooting the moon, toss out your low hearts, but keep all face cards.

Nab the queen early, if you can, before people realize what you’re doing.

well, being an agressive sort…

i will try to shoot the moon A LOT! i’m successful about 75% of the time. i will almost never ditch the bitch (unless i have NO other spades) cause i would rather have it to use againt my opponants. same with hearts.

i sluff off the “garbage suits” starting with diamonds. if i have too many (5 or 6, any more and you can use them to shoot if the rest of your cards are good), i will lose the clubs. remember, the first hand is a gimme! if you dont have a club to throw, you can toss any high non-point card, and it sends a signal “i ain’t got none of them” which messes up the others players.

very, very rarely will anyone shoot the moon against me, cause i will eat a heart to prevent it.

my 2 greatest victorys were as follows: me- 1 point, all other players over 100
me- 98 points, all other players over 100 (went about 12 hands at 98, careful not to take any points and not ending game before i could beat all 3 others. victory from the jaws of defeat!

haven’t got the perfect game yet! but im working on it! (the SDMB has cut into my playing time!)

oops! i forgot to tell you why i sluff the junk suits:

by not having any diamonds or clubs, usually I dictate who gets hit with the Q’o spades or when Hearts are broken.

also, since there is no “trump”, if you throw a 2 of clubs, and no one has any clubs, you win!

(my buddies and me play “el paso poker” which is kinda like hearts, but with trumps and bidding. it is the most diabolical game i know)

duh! the “two of clubs” of course is the first card thrown, and i was using it as a figure of speech (a real bad one!). what i mean is that a garbage card becomes valuable if no one else has that suit…meaning a 2 can beat an Ace…

im gonna shut up now

I’ve played too many rounds of hearts and found that it’s really not enjoyable unless at least a few people, if not everybody tries to shoot the moon. This may lead to a different sort of playing, so what I know may not be entirely of help.

If you’re trying to learn how, don’t try to do it with every hand you get. Some are really bad, although making it with a bad hand is more satisfying of course. I’ve only shot three times on a ‘hold’ hand.

The easiest sort to start with is the rarer hands in which you can gain control and win every trick after that. This can be accomplished in a few ways already mentioned.

If you have 6 or more of one suit, preferably with at least one high card of a different suit, and NO hearts, you don’t need much else. You can do this with one or two hearts if they’re reasonably high (like 10 or more) but you need to get rid of it early unless you have from Ace down. Even then, it’s risky since when you lead with, say the 10 of hearts, someone might play the Ace right there to stop you, or it might be their only heart. What you would do in this game is try to get rid of everything that’s not your strong suit, while still making sure you can win at least one trick. Holding one high card of another suit will usually be enough if you’re unsure. The best suits to do this with in order are Clubs (some are gone the very first round!), Diamonds, Spades (you need to have the A, K, or Q), and Hearts (you’ll need to watch the cards more unless you have all high).

The other way is to hold most if not all the high cards in two or more suits, especially hearts, and watch the cards as they play out. Once any card that can beat you in a suit is gone (or the suit is gone), you have it made. This type of game carries more risk, as if you miss you’ll probably end up with a lot of points.

I’m with Gatopescado here. I played a lot of hearts 20 years ago, and I would usually try to shoot the moon, but I was only successful about 15 percent of the time. But I would at least let my fellow players know I was trying about 90 percent of the time. Because I always played with the same crowd, they would always be on the lookout for me and ready to take a point or two for the cause, by which time I would be void in at least one suit and could dump the old maid and her courtiers fairly easily. However, I would rarely win, usually coming in second or third. While I attribute some of that to one of the players having a perfect memory for what had been played and a quick mind as to what everyone else was still holding, I don’t think that this strategy will lead you to winning and the respect of your friends. But they will definitely fear you and your “old lady” and won’t screw with you if they get used to your tightrope walk. And you will have a lot more fun.

The problem with this is that you’ve basically told to the player receiving your pass that you intent to try to shoot he moon. Anybody passes me the 3[sym]©[/sym], 5[sym]§[/sym] & 4[sym]¨[/sym], you better believe that I’m going to do my best to feed a heart to one of the other two players.

Not always the case, Lindy, I often get rid of my clubs, especially if I’m low in spades. This way if someone passes me the king or ace of spades I have an chance to get rid of it safely in the first hand and not risk having to eat the Bitch because I had no other spades to play.

I actually think this is the wrong way to go about it, unless you’re quite confident that you’ll make it. I mean, if I’m going to miss by one card, I’d rather it be someone else who gets the queen, you know? Also, it’s fairly common for the ace and king of spades to fall pretty early, and especially if you count cards, it’s not too hard to figure out when you can nab the queen towards the end of the game.

First of all, I’ll go on the record right now and challenge anyone else here to a game of online hearts… name a place and time, I’ll bring the hammer :slight_smile:
Some general pieces of advice:

-Assuming that you are playing to win, that is, playing to come in 1st, it is vitally important that you constantly bear in mind the relatives scores of you and all the other players. When you’re low, it’s a raw struggle to survive. When you’re not, it’s a team game, albeit one with constantly shifting teams and no one you can really trust. Remember, if the scores are 20 50 80 80 and you have 50, you really can’t afford for either guy with 80 to take the queen, even if it means taking it yourself.

That said, there are two kinds of hands… those in which you have the queen and those in which you don’t.

Hands in which you have the queen
When you have the queen, life is pretty straightforward. Try to dump it on the appropriate target, or, if there is no target, anyone at all. There are two tricky strategies I will suggest when one has the queen:

(1) If you have the queen and you are the low man, play deceptively. Lead spades from a short spade suit. Fool your opponents into thinking that you’re trying to drag out the queen. (This will only work if your opponents are aware enough players to notice what’s happening).

(2) Aggressively strip out all your entries. Suppose this is your hand:
Clubs: AKJ5
Spades: Qxxxx
Diamonds: xxx
Hearts: x

When you get the lead, the first thing you should do is PLAY ALL YOUR HIGH CLUBS. This may seem odd, but remember, you can’t be punished, you have the queen. Once you’ve played them all, then you can’t be stuck into the leads with clubs from then on. If you ignore the clubs and start doing other things, someone out there will probably have 346 of clubs and just screw you over and over again.

(It’s very nice in a situation like that to have one and only one heart, particularly if the rest of your cards are high. Frequently, I will take all my high cards until I’ve exhausted everyone else in those suits, then lead my single middle heart. If someone takes it, presto, I’m out of the lead. If no one takes it, presto, I shoot the moon. This even extends to having A8 of hearts or something like that… play the ace first, eat the four points, and then lead the 8.)

Hands in which you don’t have the queen

There are two stages to a hand like this:
(1) figure out who has the queen of spades
(2) make sure that it finds a good home

Basically, watch what everyone leads. If someone leads spades, that person doesn’t have the queen. If someone plays lots of high cards unconcernedly, that person probably has the queen. If someone takes the opening lead with the Ace of clubs and then plays the Ace and King of diamonds in quick succession and then the 8 of clubs, that person probably has the queen and is now void in diamonds, because why else would they play two high diamonds and then stop.

It’s a very tough balancing act between covering your own ass by pitching high cards and staying out of the lead, and being aggressive in your pursuit of the low man.

As for shooting the moon, sometimes you’ll just have zillions of high cards and a big heart suit and moon. More often, though, you void yourself in hearts and have a long suit in one of the other suits. This is the best kind of hand to have, because (assuming you have both high and low cards in your long suit) you don’t have to commit to anything until you’ve seen the first several tricks… often you can set yourself up with a good shot to moon, someone else will take a heart, and you can escape unscathed.

And this is why it’s CRUCIAL to always pass a low-to-medium heart, and to not be afraid to take the first heart trick after hearts are broken. (And, in general, if you can take the first heart that is played, for instance on a club trick, you always should, because (a) no one else can possibly moon, and (b) people will be worried about you mooning, even if there’s no chance in hell that you will, and sometimes you’ll get away with total murder because of it)

Lots of good ideas here (didn’t want to have to spell stratagies :slight_smile: ). One thing I’d like to add, if your not shooting the moon, break hearts early. Nothing screws up a run then having hearts broke early.

In hearts, I can offer you no advice other than Play To Lose. I have more fun just trying to screw everyone else than I do trying to win. No doubt about it. :slight_smile:

Oh, yeah, right. I forgot about the king and ace of spades. That is indeed a good way to get rid of them. Good catch, Mauvaise.

Yeah if I can short suit myself I really like to keep the Queen Spade if I have 3 spades to cover, because then I have more say in where it goes and I can be reasonably sure I won’t get it.

We call it going Bundle up my way and as said by a couple you should be aggressive. Be prepared to be beaten up a few times but that will teach you valuable lessons about your strengths and your opponents playing style.

You have to count the cards, bluff and play the odds.
Above all learn to read the other players. Watch the first few hands and see who ditches there Ace of Hearts and Queen and when they do it.

There are timid players who think they playing smart by ditching their high cards early when in reality they are setting you up for the kill.
I know a few players that will not shoot (Go Bundle) without having all four Aces and A couple of Kings Recognize that in others and you can prevent them from doing the same by holding back a Jack that could crash their run.

I try by Ditching my Hearts and any medium cards (6,7, 8, 9)
If you have the Queen King and or Ace of Spades Keep them.

If just the Queen, Keep a few backers so that someone short on Spades doesn’t accidentally take it from you when another is aggressively trying to draw it out.

I will throw low on the first time round on any suit (except Hearts) and watch for which high cards fall.

On Spade tricks I try to figure where the stoppers are (The cards that can be used to get that one heart you need if someone figures out what you are doing.)

If you have the lead and the Queen of spades lead a 10 or Jack, that can sometimes flush out the Ace or King by someone Ditching.

If someone has passed you a heart and it is medium high (Not Ace King, Queen) and a heart was laid on your last hand lead that heart and hope everyone ditches under.

You are going to get a Chinese bundle (all but one heart) now and then and you have to get used to sometimes losing at first but that will help later.

Above all you have to be able to make the others think you are just being screwed so that they don’t catch on.

Always count count count! Know and memorised which cards are out there so that you aren’t surprised when a Jack or 10 is played on your 9.

By the way, anyone here ever play Cancellation Hearts? It’s great fun when you have 6 or more players, although it’s pretty much impossible to shoot the moon. There is less pure skill involved and more of a social element as it’s possible for anyone to complicate a hand.

It’s simple to understand – you play with two decks. In any trick in which two identical cards are played, they completely cancel each other out for purposes of winning the trick. Those cards taken still count as points, and the suit led remains even if the lead card is cancelled.

This can occasionally lead to a situation where nobody can win the trick (say, all the cards of a suit that were led get cancelled). The usual way to continue in this situation is that those cards are left on the table and taken in the next trick, which is started in the same way. If it’s the last trick of the hand, then it’s discarded.

This leads to some pretty interesting games. We once had one player who was 2 points from going out, but the guy in the lead was way ahead. The leader led with the 3 of Spades, knowing that he was going to flush out the queen. Turned out that we all only had our high spades left. Someone played 10 of Spades, then the Q came out. The ‘losing’ player only had the A Spades, and she thought it was over. Someone else played the Q, just to get rid of it for themselves. The next player saved the game by playing the Ace (Aces cancelled, Q cancelled, 10 was going to take it). And with a great stroke of luck I had the other 10 of Spades, and played it. The leader ended up taking 26 points from the 3 of Spades.

If you do play this game, it’s highly advised that you use the J-Diamonds = -10 points. Since there’s so many points and little chance to shoot, you need something to help balance it out.