Hello Dopers. I am currently applying for a PhD program, and part of the application requires three recommendations. I don’t really know anyone who could provide a quality recommendation. I don’t work with academics, and being active duty military, the majority of my supervisors only have a Bachelor’s degree. I’ve been around the boards for 20 years, so I’m hoping there are some Doctors here who would feel comfortable providing a recommendation for me. It would be greatly appreciated.
Wait, recommendations are needed from people with advanced degrees? I would have thought a current or former supervising officer would be fine.
I always expect to get references from someone who knows you. Even in faceless academia, I want to hear that you’re a hard worker with character and leadership capabilities. I would NOT care what initials come after someone’s name. I’ve gotten references from ministers, Scout leaders… and a commanding officer or fellow serviceman would carry MUCH more weight than a Ph.D.
I just went back through some applications and one of the strongest tributes to a guy’s character was from a teacher who only had an Associate’s Degree.
…
Oh, and by the way, everyone on the committee can tell when someone doesn’t really know the applicant. We pretty much laugh at those… and then ignore them (and try to be charitable so they don’t count as a negative).
That’s a good point and a fair question. The application doesn’t specify anything about the recommenders, other than they should be able to comment on my ability to perform well in a PhD program. I don’t know how much weight the recommendation holds from someone who doesn’t have an advanced degree, or may have no degree. I’m kind of stuck between using people who know me well (but have limited formal education), and people who don’t know me as well but are more academically accomplished. I just want to have the strongest application possible. My Capstone professor from my graduate school has already agreed to be a recommender. I’m just trying to find two more. I posted here in the hopes that there is at least one or two PhD holding Dopers who have interacted with me enough over the last couple decades to offer an endorsement. They’ve at least seen my writing ability (or lack thereof) and possibly my ability to think critically, etc. It’s worth a shot. I can always just use a current or former supervisor as Plan B, of course.
Thank you for that information!
Ahhh, then they want to see how well you work under pressure. The military perspective would be very valuable there.
ETA: And how good your attitude is when a supervisor says you have to start a whole section over…
If you are active duty military, use your chain of command!
Military officers have all kinds of titles and initials.
~VOW
As someone who once chaired the grad admissions committee, I can only confirm what the previous posters have said. It is crucial that the recommender knows you.
Thanks. I really appreciate all the feedback. In retrospect, it seems like this should have been obvious. I think I may be a bit warped from experiencing how the military often treats recommendations. For example, to apply for Warrant Office school, one needs a recommendation from a Warrant Officer. This is kind of ridiculous when you think about it. Most people applying don’t even know a Warrant Officer, and fewer still have even worked with any. Yet, they still need a letter of recommendation from a Warrant Officer. So there is this process of Soldiers just finding random WOs, having a brief talk, and then getting a letter from them. Other times, Soldiers might need a letter of recommendation from a battalion commander or higher. That battalion commander likely has no idea about the character or soldiering ability of that private. So, the BC is writing a recommendation based off 3rd hand information from lower level commanders who themselves only know the soldier from what an even lower ranking officer and/or NCO have mentioned.
Anyway, that’s explains where my head was at. I’m looking at this requirement for three people to be recommenders for the PhD program, and I immediately think I need them from PhDs.
What about using my previous professor? Was that a good idea? She agreed right away, and looking at the online application, it appears the school has already received her recommendation. Do you think that is a good person to use as a reference? She doesn’t really know me, but she is probably the most knowledgeable person to rate my academic abilities. During my thesis defense last year, she even mentioned that she hoped I would be continuing on toward a doctorate. But maybe she was just being nice.
Now I have to write a “Statement of Personal Goals”. I really wish they’d be more specific. I’ve been reading online about what this usually entails, how long it should be, etc. Can any of you offer your experience or guidance on this thing? I don’t even know how it should be formatted! I mean… do I put my name at the top? At the bottom? Do I date it? Double-spaced? Is it like a letter? More like a memo? I have no idea. Do I address it to someone or some group? Do I sign it?
Absolutely a good idea, and the absence of such a recommendation could be a problem.
I’d say that if you are doing anything like advanced work in your job, the highest officer who could be convinced to write your letter - no, make that sign your letter, since someone lower who might know you better could write it - would help.
My grad school application was almost 50 years ago, so no help. But don’t they have an example online?
BTW, when II write recommendation letters I use specific examples, so I’d guess the advice of the academics about not getting one from a stranger is good.
Hari, did your graduate admissions committees require resumes? I have to submit a resume as well. I don’t have much experience with resumes. Looking online, it seems everyone has a different opinion, especially about whether to use military terminology or a civilian equivalent job title… plus experienced focused vs timeline/employment focused. I hear horror storries about how one little wrong thing with on a resume gets it sent to the trash or ignored. Thoughts?
Oh god. And small paragraphs are out? Has to be bullets?
Not sure exactly what you mean by a resume. My resume consists of a list of degrees (just AB, and PhD), positions held (academic only; no need to mention my job as a 15 yo soda jerk), invited talks given and published papers. For a newly minted MSc, the only relevant positions would be something like TA or lab assistant. Some students already have publications although I certainly didn’t when I was applying to grad school. I don’t think there is any standard format for this. But things may have changed in the 25 years since I was in charge of graduate admissions.
Applying students are asked what their ultimate goals are. The answers are generally a load of BS. I never paid any attention to them. The marks and recommendations are the only things that we paid any attention to, to be honest.
I am not in academia, but I would think that one academic, one supervisor, and one additional person who can speak to your intelligence, hard work, and motivation would be okay.
Thank you. That’s exactly what I went with, actually. Finding that “one additional person” turned out to be harder than it should have been. I think I was putting too much emphasis on them, instead of me; caring more about who they are and what they’ve accomplished instead of what they’d say about me and what I’ve accomplished. Once I got over that, it was pretty easy.
Admission Requirements and Application Documents:
Master’s with at least 3.25; Complete transcripts; Statement of personal goals; Professional resume; GRE General Exam (no mention of required score); and Industry Experience preferred.
I assume the resume is supposed to help them assess your industry experience. It’s comforting to hear that you pretty much ignored the statements of personal goals in the applications you reviewed. Somewhere on the admissions website, it mentioned that the statement of goals is really just to judge the applicant’s writing ability. But, that and the resume are the last two steps, and again I think I’m making it harder than it should be. I’ve convinced myself that my acceptance hinges on these two documents.
Right now I have two resume drafts. One is strictly a chronological list of work experience, and the other is instead separated by category, with industry-related positions firsts, then leadership positions, then teaching & instructional related positions next. I’m leaning more toward the latter one, I think. It doesn’t help that I don’t really have industry experience. I’ve worked alongside the industry, as Defense and Aerospace cross paths often. I think I’m suffering imposter syndrome. lol
Defense is an industry. Whatever you do, don’t discount the time you’ve spent in the military – that absolutely counts as experience.