When the police first started using tasers they were justified to the public as a way to avoid using deadly force - that is, as a way to avoid shooting violent suspects. Now it seems that the police use tasers not to avoid deadly force, but as a tool to gain compliance of uncooperative suspects. There are far too many instances where people have been tased when they posed no threat at all. People have been tased for trying to walk away or for talking back. As used by many police, the taser is not an alternative to the firearm, but to the billy club.
Per the above: New Times article about an 82 year old man in Grover Beach, CA involved in an alleged kidnapping. Note the video camera is embedded within the Taser.
I know I don’t have the whole story with respect to the police. It was a tense situation, but it seemed the guy was compliant and was doing what he was told. It looks like the use of excessive force to me–but can anybody give me a good argument as to why tazing would be justified in this situation? Not trying to be inflammatory, just trying to see the cops point of view.
The best argument is that police don’t need to justify using force. Using force justifies their mission, their training, their culture, and ultimately, itself.
I couldn’t tell all that was said from the audio track. I did hear, “Get out of the car”, and then “all right”, and then the cop said more that I couldn’t decipher. So perhaps he was not complying in some way.
It is also possible the guy was resisting and refusing to comply for some time – until the taser got pulled out. But if that’s the case, and he then started complying, that means the cop tased him as payback.
I saw nothing to suggest why he should be tased, but I know I’m missing parts of the narrative.
Thanks for the info and links. I had no idea I could decine a search by saying, “I don’t consent to searches”. “Also was Am I free to go”. They can still search my car but they have to show just cause in court.
Or they’ll just do what they usually do, which is make you wait two hours for a sniffer dog unit to show up.
God, some of you people are pathetic. In that reptile part of your brain you actually attempt to justify police misconduct by simply, and in a casual manner state apparently asserting your rights is JUSTIFICATION for a beat down.
What is wrong with you people?
Are you actually saying that “disrespecting” some ass–hat cop’s AUTH’ ARITY, is valid reason for a beat down? 'cause that is what it seems some of you are saying.
It’s so backwards. If some stock boy at the A&P beats the crap out of someone for putting something in wrong shelf no one starts saying: “Well he shouldn’t of talked back!” Or “You don’t know how difficult it is to be a stock boy at the A&P”, or, “You don’t know the whole story! That A&P guy just broke up with his girlfriend and was having a bad day!” Or “Stupid customer shouldn’t of have raised his hands to protect his face, JUSTIFIABLE!”.
But cops can do no wrong. Even if they are doing wrong, well… the victim had it coming, that’s the ticket!
I agree with the overall advice however. Don’t fight the police, unless you reasonably believe your life to be in danger. Better to be in jail than to be dead. But better to get beat that to get dead.
Some personal anecdotes:
Had some cops threaten my mom with physical violence because she had the temerity to say that the guy who rear-ended her looked drunk. Turned out he was a police officer.
Another cop threatened to kill me because I was playing guitar in a PUBLIC park with three friends in the middle of a Saturday afternoon and didn’t immediately haul ass when he told us to get the fuck out with our “noise”. Instead we looked confused because none of us believed what we had heard him say to us.
Another cop followed my Arab friend from his school to his house WITHOUT ever turning on his siren or lights. Upon parking at his house and leaving the car non-chalantly, cop knocks him to the ground, pulls out gun and places it to his head, uttering at least 2 racial epithets at him, then lies on the police report saying that he didn’t respond to his siren (which he never turned on until AFTER he parked his car and was getting out).
Got more where that comes from. But, one of my sensei’s back in the day was a cop. That guy gives me hope that not all cops are that way. He was the most down to earth, nice and professional guy I’ve ever met. I saw interact with down right ass hole kids and not once resorted to violence of macho posturing. And yet, when he said to do something, they did it. this guy could be having the worst day of his life, and be facing the most disrespectful asswipe in the world, and I have no doubt he’d remain as professional as my boss would when dealing with irate customers. If all cops where like him, the world would be a better place.
In my experience, and the experience of everyone I know save one, the odds are 100%.
And the one time was the cop being condescending (hence no respect), but no beatings, tickets or even asking the driver to leave the vehicle ensued.
I said something similar, yes - but I really only meant it in a philosophical sense. I don’t fundamentally believe in it.
However, there is a certain usefulness to such a position. With legal precedent and street procedure as they are today, the cops hold all the cards whenever they interact with civilians.
To paraphrase Col. Jessup in A Few Good Men, they don’t give a good goddamn what you, the citizen, are entitled to.