It was a joke too. That’s not what he said at all. But everyone I spoke to agreed there was an ethical obligation as a result of the oath and rules of professional responsibility to aspire to do pro bono work. That even included a friend who has not done an hour’s pro bono in his whole time here.
Couldn’t Rand Rover find an extremely rich and powerful corporation willing to let him fulfil his hours of pro bono work just for them ? To ensure they pay less taxes or something ?
You know, Randy, it may come as a shock to you, but I don’t applaud when my boyfriend’s cat pukes on the carpet, either.
1.) Did you stop raping your daughter yet? That’s really fucking sick, what you’re doing to that girl. She may be your spawn, but she’s still human, and nobody deserves that–especially a child.
2.) Since you’ve forgotten already and I’ve been meaning to remind you of this, from your O fucking P:
That’s where the goalposts *were *before you started moving them to “responsibility that I will be punished if I don’t fulfill.”
It’s actually a structure with *two *refrains.
Always fun the first time I open my mouth on Vent.
“Hey, does Shot From Guns know his girlfriend’s playing his toon?!”
You do realize that nothing I’ve said n this thread contradicts that, right? If anyone wants to think that I have a moral/ethical obligation to do anything, then that’s super for them. Doesn’t mean I actually have an obligation to do tjhat out here in the real world.
Cute voice, too.
You wanna tell that to the bar?
You swore an oath to act ethically. Acting ethically involves the pro bono obligation. By failing to aspire to provide service, you are acting unethically, and in violation of your oath, which is an oath you freely took. While there is no official sanction for this violation of your oath, it is a reflection on your character. He who steals my purse steals trash, and all that.
SFG:
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I like how when I say something about Dio’s daughters being sluts, everyone jumps down my throat, but they don’t say shit when you say something much more offensive.
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I admit to being guilty of using loose language, in the OP and in my last post. Some people use the term “ethical obligation” to mean “an actual real-life obligation that is imposed by ethical rules.”. Others use it to mean “an obligation imposed by a cosmic incorporeal sense of ethics.” To be clear, I don’t care if someone thinks I have an EO in the second sense, but thwy are simply wrong if they mean it in the first sense.
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With respect to my conversation with you, point 2 above doesn’t really matter. You were clearly arguing that I promised to do pro bono (thus imposing on myself a real-life obligation). You have failed to demonstrate I made any such promise.
By agreeing to act ethically, I did not agree to do erverything that villa agrees is necessary to act ethically. My bar association is apparently fine with lawyers who don’t aspire to do pro bono because they don’t sanction those lawyers. Therefore, the issue has been decided. You are perfectly free to disagree with them, but your opinion of what it takes to act ethicallý has no effecþ on my reali-life obligations.
When I was hired for my current job, I didn’t promise that I wouldn’t play Minesweeper for four hours a day instead of working. Most days, I could probably get away with it.
But I don’t. Some obligations are implicit; yours is spelled out for you, and you still insist it doesn’t exist.
It’s because I put out.
Saying “NUH UH” over and over again doesn’t make it so.
If only they had given some sort of explicit commentary on exactly this subject! If only there were some way we could know what they really thought! If only multiple people had quoted this information over the course of this thread! Oh wait, **Rand **is a fucking tard. Here, I’ll quote it AGAIN:
Please explain what you believe this passage to mean, since you apparently disagree with every other person on the fucking planet.
Do you feel the same way outside of work? A promise isn’t a promise unless there are explicit penalties for breaking it? Do you tell your wife you’ll take out the trash, then not do it and say you never had an obligation to do it because there are no penalties for not doing it? Do you tell your kid/s that you’ll take them to Disneyworld, and then not go and tell them you don’t have a real-life obligation to take them?
He still hasn’t explained why tipping is different from pro bono work, either.
Same to you.
Where’s the sanction for not doing pro bono?
What I think that language means is this: “We don’t want to require lawyers to do pro bono, but we want to pay lip service to the idea that doing pro bono is a good thing. So, we think lawyers have a moral obligation to do pro bono. But they don’t have an actual obligation to do so (because there’s no sanction for not doing it.”
We’ve been over this. I never promised to do pro bono.
Actually you are wrong in saying they don’t sanction them. It may not be a sanction you think of as worthy of your consideration, but they sanction them all the same.
The sanction is that you have failed to fulfill an ethical obligation you freely accepted. I can udnerstand that is meaningless to you. It isn’t to other people.
If you want a more practical sanction, it comes with disciplinary proceedings. Lawyers who fail to fulfill the obligation to perform pro bono work cannot use pro bono work as a sign of good character. Now that may only be a peppercorn worth of sanction, but it’s there.
Ah, but we’re providing actual refutations instead of just declaring victory.
If only I had quoted something a couple of posts ago that explicitly stated that “this responsibility is not appropriate for disciplinary rules because it is not possible to articulate an appropriate disciplinary standard regarding pro bono and public service.” Oh wait, no, you’re *still *a fucking tard.
You might as well say “I think it means all lawyers are required to dye their hair the color of cotton candy.” You have as much evidence for it, assuming you like the color pink. Because this is about completely removing the explicit meaning from a set of instructions that you agreed to abide by simply because they don’t fit your personal preferences. Honestly, you’re such a fucking dickgarage. No balls at all–I’m surprised you managed to get your wife pregnant. (Assuming the kid is yours, obviously.)
She’s pretty, I’ve heard, so… probably not.
That is some shittastic analysis.
First off MRPC 6.1 is not imperative - you should aspire. Whoop de doo. Not aspiring is not an ethical violation.
Additionally, Illinois (IIRC where RR practices) has some very interesting footnotes about exactly why they declined to incorporate MRPC 6.1 in their official rules of conduct.
RR…
On so many levels you incite many negative “vibes”… you create controversy wherever you post (shit)…you DO NOT represent your professional community well…:mad:
I have watched this thread…waited for “cites” and hoped that you would show some form of being ETHICAL, LEGAL or MORAL…sadly, none have appeared. :smack:
In short RR…you are an ass…
Warning PDF file
http://www.ilnd.uscourts.gov/public/Forms/tbarin99.pdf
WARNING PDF file
http://www.pili-law.org/documents/PILILawStudentBrochureFINAL.pdf
You…Range Rover, may operate withing the letter of the law but you are not either …
Moral…or Ethical!
That is all…
ymmv
tsfr