Project Runway, Season 4 Ep 2

Cafe Society
21

[QUOTE=Miss Purl McKnittington]
Yes, I do think the fact that she hasn’t shown she can construct structured garments is a serious blow against her integrity and ability as a designer. (Not integrity in the sense that she’s a liar, but that it leaves her resume as a designer with major holes.) I think her inclusion in this program cheapens the work of other designers who have abilities she doesn’t possess.
[/QUOTE]
And yet she came second in the second challenge, and actually put together a beautiful dress is the first one, but fucked it up with that ridiculous tail. In fact, every criticism you’ve leveled at her says nothing about her actual abilities. Sure, her strategy and technique might be different, but isn’t it the final garment that counts? The fact that the other designers see her as an outsider is one thing; the fact that people act as if she is from Mars or something says more about them than about her.

And “cheapens the work” of the other contestants? Jesus Christ, give me a break.

These people are talented game-show contestants. Nothing more. They are willing to go on TV and whore themselves out to a slew of advertisers for some extra fame and money. They are already cheap; nothing in Elisa’s resume can change that.

22

[QUOTE=Miss Purl McKnittington]
Yes, I do think the fact that she hasn’t shown she can construct structured garments is a serious blow against her integrity and ability as a designer. (Not integrity in the sense that she’s a liar, but that it leaves her resume as a designer with major holes.) I think her inclusion in this program cheapens the work of other designers who have abilities she doesn’t possess.
[/quote]

No offense, but I don’t see how someone else’s perceived incompetence cheapens your work. At all. In fact, if you were in an elimination competition, you should be overjoyed that your competitor is so obviously not up to par, because she’s not going to stand in your way for very long. Making fun of her, undermining her confidence, and being a bitch to her (especially considering that she doesn’t get bitchy back, she just seems to internalize it) is just juvenile crap. I think behaving like a teenage girl in the high school cafeteria is what cheapens the other designers, not anything Elisa is doing.

Sure, being different always alienates mainstream people. But mhendo’s point was, the fashion industry is full of people, like Christian and Sweet P, who claim to be “different” unique snowflakes with a free-spirited perspective, so weird, so avante garde. Then, when confronted by a person who really IS different, they fall to cackling and teasing like the Gossip Girls. It’s pretty obnoxious, since Elisa certainly never approached any of them, trying to force her ways of doing things on them. We always see them asking snotty questions and making little judgmental comments to her, not the other way around.

Yes, she was intimidated by their nastiness. Yes, she feels badly about it. She realizes she does things differently. None of this is justification for how she’s been treated, but then again, this show is all about the cattiness, so I shouldn’t be surprised.

Let’s see if she can do a tailored garment that requires use of sewing equipment beyond needle and thread. If she can’t then she’ll be out and that’ll be the end of it.

As for Jack, I have a possible spoiler:

Jack uses his boxer shorts as the basis for a pattern for the upcoming challenge, and I think the other competitors think that was cheating. At least, that’s the impression I got from the clip I saw on Project Rungay.

23

[QUOTE=Rubystreak]
As for Jack, I have a possible spoiler:

Jack uses his boxer shorts as the basis for a pattern for the upcoming challenge, and I think the other competitors think that was cheating. At least, that’s the impression I got from the clip I saw on Project Rungay.

[/QUOTE]

Awww, but we already had

a cheating scandal last season!

24

[QUOTE=Zoggie]
Awww, but we already had

a cheating scandal last season!

[/QUOTE]

Didn’t we have one second season too?

Kara Saun and the free shoes? Maybe it’s going to be a running theme in this show.

25

[QUOTE=Rubystreak]
Didn’t we have one second season too?

Kara Saun and the free shoes? Maybe it’s going to be a running theme in this show.

[/QUOTE]

Oh yeah, except that was season one.

Actually, season three almost had two cheating scandals. There was the actual cheating scandal when Keith got kicked off the show, and then Laura thought that Jeffrey had cheated because his garments were completely finished and looked way too good–but Tim Gunn said that everything checked out with Jeffrey.

26

[QUOTE=Zoggie]
Oh yeah, except that was season one.
[/quote]

:smack: So there wasn’t one in season 2. But 2 in season 3, to even it out.

27

I thought most of the garments looked kind of strange - and obviously, the designers have no idea what would work on women larger than a size 4.
It was strange how many said “it’ll look great on women of all sizes,” when clearly, clearly it wouldn’t. I hope they do a plus size challenge this season - just to give the remaining ones a chance to see what happens when you inflict some of those designs on a larger frame.

Spit girl is weird, and clearly doesn’t quite understand what “polymorphic” means, it was almost as though it was on her word of the day calendar and she felt she had to use it over and over again. Also, you can’t hand sew for a $15 mass produced garment. You just can’t.

SJP annoyedme less than I thought she would. She didn’t make that screeching noise she often did on the the show. That helped.

28

[QUOTE=Rubystreak]
No offense, but I don’t see how someone else’s perceived incompetence cheapens your work. At all. In fact, if you were in an elimination competition, you should be overjoyed that your competitor is so obviously not up to par, because she’s not going to stand in your way for very long. Making fun of her, undermining her confidence, and being a bitch to her (especially considering that she doesn’t get bitchy back, she just seems to internalize it) is just juvenile crap. I think behaving like a teenage girl in the high school cafeteria is what cheapens the other designers, not anything Elisa is doing.

Sure, being different always alienates mainstream people. But mhendo’s point was, the fashion industry is full of people, like Christian and Sweet P, who claim to be “different” unique snowflakes with a free-spirited perspective, so weird, so avante garde. Then, when confronted by a person who really IS different, they fall to cackling and teasing like the Gossip Girls. It’s pretty obnoxious, since Elisa certainly never approached any of them, trying to force her ways of doing things on them. We always see them asking snotty questions and making little judgmental comments to her, not the other way around.
[/quote]
Exactly.

Couldn’t (and didn’t) say it better myself.

29

[QUOTE=amarinth]
I thought most of the garments looked kind of strange - and obviously, the designers have no idea what would work on women larger than a size 4.
It was strange how many said “it’ll look great on women of all sizes,” when clearly, clearly it wouldn’t. I hope they do a plus size challenge this season - just to give the remaining ones a chance to see what happens when you inflict some of those designs on a larger frame.
[/quote]

Well, they had serious trouble last season when they were designing for family members. They weren’t sure how to design for larger women, and it was freaking them out. It is kind of hard, admittedly, to make something that will look good on everyone though, isn’t it? Different things do look good on different people…

Yeah, she definitely cultivate a different persona than Carrie. She came across as critical but not mean about it…and she was very polite when talking to all the designers about their ideas.

30

Christian and Carmen’s outfit was hideous - 80s indeed.

I would wear Victoria’s dress (without the vest) in a minute - I loved it.

As for SJP, I do hate her but they didn’t show enough of her to ruin this episode for me.

31

I’m seriously impressed this season by the designers’ technical chops. I hate Christopher and I hate his outfits and I want to punch him in the nose, but I can’t imagine the (extremely talented even then) season 1 designers daring to make fitted jackets with a metric asston of pleats and such. As I recall, they rarely made sleeves.

32

[QUOTE=mhendo]
And yet she came second in the second challenge, and actually put together a beautiful dress is the first one, but fucked it up with that ridiculous tail. In fact, every criticism you’ve leveled at her says nothing about her actual abilities. Sure, her strategy and technique might be different, but isn’t it the final garment that counts?
[/QUOTE]

Sort of, but not completely. Designers don’t work in a vacuum. They need to know how to communicate with the people around them. It’s not all about a subculture that is “conformist.” It’s about having a common vernacular.

Elisa may be able to come up with something nice when she is doing all the designing, sewing, and fitting herself, but how will her methods work when doing anything but a one-of-a-kind piece? If she can’t even read a pattern, how can she make a pattern? If she can’t use a sewing machine, how can she reasonably assess whether a design is viable for production? If she has a seamstress working under her, how can she even explain what she wants her to do? I mean, we saw two other designers talking–(paraphrased) “Okay, so the straps should be an inch?” “No, an inch is too big. Make it 7/8.” What’s Elisa going to say? “Make it yay big?”

Maybe she actually does know what an inch is and her unusual methods are being emphasized by editing, but from what we’ve seen, she isn’t a reasonable candidate to win Project Runway, no matter how pretty her garments turn out.
And on to Christian’s monstrosity–One thing that surprised me was that the judges didn’t seem to discuss or consider whether the designs could actually be produced for the $40 price point. (If they did, we didn’t see it.) Even if the fabrics for Christian’s design could be gotten very cheaply, I’d guess that the consruction of that jacket would drive the cost way up. All that pleating? Oy! Most of the other designers seemed to take the cost of actually making the thing into consideration–like Rami’s somewhat detailed shirt-jacket over very simple leggings–but I would have liked to hear some commentary on this issue because I really have no clue how it all works in real life.

33

[QUOTE=Green Bean]
Sort of, but not completely. Designers don’t work in a vacuum. They need to know how to communicate with the people around them. It’s not all about a subculture that is “conformist.” It’s about having a common vernacular.
[/QUOTE]
Right, but the fact is that Project Runway is—with the exception of the occasional pairs challenge—a competition among individuals who design and make their own creations for the judges. I agree with you that Elisa’s techniques and strategy might not serve her very well in the industry more generally, but they need not necessarily hamper her very much in this competition.

And even if she might not share the common vernacular of the industry, the sniping and insults directed against her so far have appeared, to me at least, to be more about her personal quirks and idiosyncrasies than about the way she goes about her craft.

34

I definitely agree that the comments are more personal than specific to her methods. (Her methods do provide plenty of ammunition, though!)

But while it’s an individual competition, I do feel that the designers are judged in part on how well their stuff will work in the “real” world of fashion. The extent to which this happens varies depending on the task, the reward for winning the task, and the particular judges. It does become more important later in the competition, though.

And I forgot something in my above post–Elisa does seem willing (and able) to learn. If her garments keep turning out well enough to keep her from being the “worst” in each episode, she’ll be in for a while. It will be interesting to see how she develops.

35

[QUOTE=Rubystreak]
As for Jack, I have a possible spoiler:

Jack uses his boxer shorts as the basis for a pattern for the upcoming challenge, and I think the other competitors think that was cheating. At least, that’s the impression I got from the clip I saw on Project Rungay.

[/QUOTE]

This shouldn’t be a problem since, last season, Vincent used his own pants to create a rub-off for the Jet-Setter Challenge.

36

Some more Project Runway fun.

37

[QUOTE=amarinth]
I thought most of the garments looked kind of strange - and obviously, the designers have no idea what would work on women larger than a size 4.
It was strange how many said “it’ll look great on women of all sizes,” when clearly, clearly it wouldn’t. I hope they do a plus size challenge this season - just to give the remaining ones a chance to see what happens when you inflict some of those designs on a larger frame.
[/QUOTE]
That smock-looking dress that won is a perfect example. If I wore that, I would look like I was still pregnant. And I’m what I would consider reasonablely trim (hovering between an 8 and a 10 since I had the baby). When very skinny young girls wear stuff like that, it looks cute. Anyone else, and it just looks silly.

38

Well, the thing about making assumptions about Elisa’s construction abilities is that she’s not Wendy Pepper - like most of the other contestants this season she’s already well-established and successful in the fashion world, and has designed for celebrities and I think showed at Bryant Park too (I personally think people with that kind of acclaim shouldn’t be on this show, but I hold that against the producers, not the contestants). So I would assume that at some point in her career she learned how to use a sewing machine, unless she is religiously against it or something. I’m betting the editing was geared precisely towards making people ask these very questions - “can she really sew?” I may be wrong, but I think she can.

I personally like her a lot and hope she makes the final three, because her pre-show mini-collection showed the most distinct point of view out of all the designers (I loved the first look in that) and she makes me smile. Like Jay McCarroll said, she must have studied at the Moonbeam Unicorn Academy of Fashion for Magical Fairies (well, paraphrased). I think spit-marking is kind of icky, but nothing to execute anyone over, and the other contestants (and Heidi too) seemed to really just be picking on her. Her famous artist father (who may have contributed to her growing up in an artsy, nonusual environment) died pretty recently too, I think, which I would imagine leaves her in kind of a sensitive state - I’d have kept my mouth shut for that if regular cordial decency hadn’t kept it shut already (But I don’t expect too much of that on tv nowadays).
I thought her design came out great (I really didn’t get it from the drawing). I agree that the hand-finishing would realistically take it out of the required price range, though. I see it makes sense that Victorya’s won, and it was kind of cute. I thought Rami’s design was pretty boring but that the whole Bitten line looks pretty boring so it fit in in that sense. Chris’s team’s sweater was totally cute and I’d buy it myself in a heartbeat, though I hate leggings. Christian annoys the shit out of me and I thought his design was ugly, dated, hard to fit and not echoing the Bitten aesthetic at all, so I’d have been happy if he’d gone home. Marion messed up on fabric choice big time, I feel bad (Mood seems like the local Britex, only worse, and if I’m right about that, I’m actually wondering how any of the designers was able to get fabric at all). The fringe would have been ugly either way, though.

The styling on almost all the models has been way off this season, and has been hurting the designs on the runway. The models mostly look either blah or hideous, I don’t know whether it’s just the designers’ bad choices or what. And I know it’s early in the season, but not one model yet has been memorable to me to the point where I remember her name.

I hate SJP myself, but admit she didn’t make herself obnoxious here, and I respect that.