Funny, you must’ve missed the word “essentially” in my post.
Please cite your references on this one.
While this is true in good part, there were plenty of NO citizens who said they gambled that they would NOT be hit head on by Hurricane Katrina and assumed not much destruction would happen if they did not leave. From what I have read, half of the Jewish population of New Orleans also voluntarily stayed and did not evacuate.
No, I didn’t. Where did I “essentially” say I blame the racist White House for this? I remember saying that I’d love to be able to blame them, but couldn’t because it doesn’t make sense. Again, the point I made in the OP: if there’s blame to be assigned along these lines, then it goes way beyond the White House or even the government.
Cite?
It not as hard as you seem to think. We (USS RANGER) could take a helo and get it from the hangar bay to Flight Deck and launch for short missions in 10 minutes. (mission being sea rescues)
Let’s see Class 5 hurricane is coming close to New Orleans.
Lets get Emergency services at the ready at least.
Levee Breaks. Start moving everything you can towards NO, even if it can’t get in, stage it nearby.
We used to have such central supply depots. They were called Armories. In the last 15 years they have been getting closed down and store a lot less supplies.
Your thesis is that it’s racism at the hear of it. You cannot honestly deny that after you entitled the thread the way you did. I prefer to deal with honest debate. Good day.
Correct: racism is at the heart of it, and the thread was titled that way on purpose. That’s still a far, far cry from AFAIKnow’s summation of what he considers my thesis. Some people here–maybe it’s our emphasis on the scientific method and hard evidence and concrete cites–seem to think that unless you’ve got signs saying “whites only” that there must be no racism. We’ve gotten rid of the signs, we’ve passed all the right laws, ergo, we’re color-blind and how could I possibly argue racist undertones without clear, sparkling evidence. So Monty, if you need to see the KKK marching down Canal Street to have an “honest debate” about racism, I submit you don’t know what racism really is.
That’s as dishonest a description of my attitude as has ever been made.
Couldn’t agree more.
Could not agree less.
If THIS prophecy is self-fulfilling, then simply stop phrophesizing!
AFAIKnow’s comment was a sarcastic depiction of what some third party might be saying or thinking.
Your comment which prompted me to ask you to tone it down appeared, to me, to be aimed at your opponents in this thread. The issue is sufficiently passionate that a certain number of posts are going to test the limits. I am more interested in reducing direct personal conflict among posters in this thread (and all the other heated threads addressing the disaster) than I am in vetting every post for the exact point at which it may cross the (subjective) line.
Oh for Pete’s sake! Common sense is my cite; use your brain.
The fact that there were people with the ability to leave who didn’t leave does not mean everyone had the ability to leave. If it makes your nit-picking little heart feel better, please feel free to alter my statement appropriately.
I see. Your concerns are well-placed.
The comment was actually an agreement (as in, yes there are plenty of people to blame)…but I see how you could take it the wrong way.
How do you air drop material in a flood situation? Seriously, describe how its done starting with the type of aircraft used.
Also, how do you drop material in where people are rioting and not exacerbate the rioting?
For those that weren’t with us during the very earliest Katrina discussions, I want to repost what the National Weather Service advisory said on the morning of 8-28 well before the storm even hit. It is taken from http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=332063&page=1&pp=40 and we discussed it at length. If a few Dopers can read a government website, understand the plain language, and figure out what the implications are, then I think it’s not too much too ask to ask the government at all levels to act and respond on what they wrote:
Originally Posted by National Weather Service
A MOST POWERFUL HURRICANE WITH UNPRECEDENTED
STRENGTH…RIVALING THE INTENSITY OF HURRICANE CAMILLE OF 1969.
MOST OF THE AREA WILL BE UNINHABITABLE FOR WEEKS…PERHAPS LONGER. AT
LEAST ONE HALF OF WELL CONSTRUCTED HOMES WILL HAVE ROOF AND WALL
FAILURE. ALL GABLED ROOFS WILL FAIL…LEAVING THOSE HOMES SEVERELY
DAMAGED OR DESTROYED.
THE MAJORITY OF INDUSTRIAL BUILDINGS WILL BECOME NON FUNCTIONAL.
PARTIAL TO COMPLETE WALL AND ROOF FAILURE IS EXPECTED. ALL WOOD
FRAMED LOW RISING APARTMENT BUILDINGS WILL BE DESTROYED. CONCRETE
BLOCK LOW RISE APARTMENTS WILL SUSTAIN MAJOR DAMAGE…INCLUDING SOME
WALL AND ROOF FAILURE.
HIGH RISE OFFICE AND APARTMENT BUILDINGS WILL SWAY DANGEROUSLY…A
FEW TO THE POINT OF TOTAL COLLAPSE. ALL WINDOWS WILL BLOW OUT.
AIRBORNE DEBRIS WILL BE WIDESPREAD…AND MAY INCLUDE HEAVY ITEMS SUCH
AS HOUSEHOLD APPLIANCES AND EVEN LIGHT VEHICLES. SPORT UTILITY
VEHICLES AND LIGHT TRUCKS WILL BE MOVED. THE BLOWN DEBRIS WILL CREATE
ADDITIONAL DESTRUCTION. PERSONS…PETS…AND LIVESTOCK EXPOSED TO THE
WINDS WILL FACE CERTAIN DEATH IF STRUCK.
POWER OUTAGES WILL LAST FOR WEEKS…AS MOST POWER POLES WILL BE DOWN
AND TRANSFORMERS DESTROYED. WATER SHORTAGES WILL MAKE HUMAN SUFFERING
INCREDIBLE BY MODERN STANDARDS.
THE VAST MAJORITY OF NATIVE TREES WILL BE SNAPPED OR UPROOTED. ONLY
THE HEARTIEST WILL REMAIN STANDING…BUT BE TOTALLY DEFOLIATED. FEW
CROPS WILL REMAIN. LIVESTOCK LEFT EXPOSED TO THE WINDS WILL BE
KILLED.
AN INLAND HURRICANE WIND WARNING IS ISSUED WHEN SUSTAINED WINDS NEAR
HURRICANE FORCE…OR FREQUENT GUSTS AT OR ABOVE HURRICANE FORCE…ARE
CERTAIN WITHIN THE NEXT 12 TO 24 HOURS.
ONCE TROPICAL STORM AND HURRICANE FORCE WINDS ONSET…DO NOT VENTURE
OUTSIDE!
In this thread and several others there has been discussion of the racial makeup of New Orleans.
To bring some facts to the situation, here’s a good website, which highlights the Lower 9th Ward which was one of the hardest hit areas as 98.3% black.
http://www.gnocdc.org/orleans/8/22/people.html
http://www.gnocdc.org/maps/race/maps.cfm?nbhd_code=n22&nbhd_encoded=Lower%20Ninth%20Ward
Since he’s the one with actual experience in the matter, I’ll defer to jrfranchi.
When it’s a choice between possibly exacerbating the rioting and simply doing nothing and letting people die, you take the chance. When you know you can’t make it into the area for two more days, then you can be certain doing nothing **will **exacerbate a number of problems, including the rioting.