Quebec - French/English signs

Factual Questions
1

Under what circumstances is the Quebec government and are Quebec businesses allowed to have signs in English?

Yesterday, as a reward to myself for going smoke-free for a month, I took a road-trip to the Granby Zoo. A bastard of a trip through Montreal (at 10:30 am on a Sunday) may or may not have been helped if I could have understood the words on the road signs. Speed limits I got; no right turn I got; route 10 est I got; anything more complicated than that I don’t got.

Then, at the zoo, there was some English on the exhibits. Way less than there was French. It was clear that I was missing out on knowledge that I would have gained could I read French. In the restaurants - no English at all on the signs. Fortunately, “cheeseburger and french fries” turns out to be cross-cultural, but my whim for a chicken salad sandwich went unfullfilled.

Even given the political reasons for throwing French in the face of fellow Canadians, it would seem to me that there are very practical reasons for allowing English in Quebec.

What’s up?

2

[QUOTE=Frank]
Under what circumstances is the Quebec government and are Quebec businesses allowed to have signs in English?
[/QUOTE]

It is illegal for businesses to have signs in any language other than French, unless it’s also in French and the French words are more prominent. English only signs are strictly forbidden.

The government generally will not post anything in English without a pressing reason.

3

[QUOTE=RickJay]
The government generally will not post anything in English without a pressing reason.
[/QUOTE]

I guess the word “parking” is officially French, or a “P” with a slash through it has become the international symbol for “we will ticket you”.

4

[QUOTE=Frank]
…Fortunately, “cheeseburger and french fries” turns out to be cross-cultural, but my whim for a chicken salad sandwich went unfullfilled…
[/QUOTE]

FYI sandwich a salade de poulet. :wink:

5

[QUOTE=Bryan Ekers]
I guess the word “parking” is officially French, or a “P” with a slash through it has become the international symbol for “we will ticket you”.
[/QUOTE]

The latter.

I’ll learn French at some point, especially given my name, it just really seems to me that Quebec is biting off its nose and discouraging Anglophone Canadian and U.S. tourists. It was a very difficult and confusing drive and a somewhat lessened attraction of the zoo, and I’ll think twice before I visit any museums or historical sites in Quebec until I have learned French.

6

This wikipedia article might be a good place to start learning about the French language laws in Québec : Charter of the French Language - Wikipedia

In terms of government services, pretty much any I’ve ever encountered will provide them in English if requested, but will default to French unless asked otherwise.

I’m surprised the Granby Zoo had so little English, considering that it is a fairly large zoo and located in the Eastern Townships, which has a large anglophone population. I haven’t been to the Zoo since I was little, though - I’m sorry it wasn’t as fun for you (though I do agree, crossing Montreal can suck, at any time of day!) I wonder if they might have an English guidebook available, with translations of the signs used for the animals and attractions, even though they haven’t bothered to post in English? Maybe worth asking at your next museum!

I think museums and attractions in Montreal tend to be more bilingual, since the city gets the majority of the province’s tourism and it would be pretty silly to alienate everyone who came to visit! I don’t know for sure, though, because I can read (and speak!) French, so I sometimes don’t notice what language I’m dealing with!

7

My experience has been that Quebecois have no problem talking English with tourists - as long as they know you’re American. They don’t expect us to speak French. But they resent any Canadians who aren’t bilingual.

8

[QUOTE=Frank]
… it just really seems to me that Quebec is biting off its nose and discouraging Anglophone Canadian and U.S. tourists…
[/QUOTE]

Preach it, bro. The Francophone majority in Quebec is so uptight and has such a siege mentality that that’s exactly what they’re doing. And they keep losing secession referenda; serves 'em right, sez I.

9

[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir]
Preach it, bro. The Francophone majority in Quebec is so uptight and has such a siege mentality that that’s exactly what they’re doing. And they keep losing secession referenda; serves 'em right, sez I.
[/QUOTE]

Well, yes… but they still want the tourists to come! They just want you to learn French first! Quality tourists, that’s what Québec wants! The rest of you sub-par tourists can just go visit Old Orchard or something.

(I wouldn’t be surprised if there were court cases regarding Bill 101 and it’s effect on tourism…!)

10

[QUOTE=Frank]
It was a very difficult and confusing drive
[/QUOTE]

It is the policy of Transports Quebec to use as little language as possible on signs, prefering instead pictograms.

In your case, the issue wasn’t one of language (as far as traffic went) but rather that signage in Montreal is terrible. I’m a native French speaker, I know the city very well, and yet I still frequently get lost or make dangerous last-minute lane changes when driving in the city.

In my experience, major museums have descriptions in both French and English, I think your experience in Granby was probably the exception rather than the norm.

[QUOTE=Little Nemo]
My experience has been that Quebecois have no problem talking English with tourists - as long as they know you’re American. They don’t expect us to speak French. But they resent any Canadians who aren’t bilingual.
[/QUOTE]

That’s not true. A common gripe of Canadians visiting is that as soon as Quebecois hear a hint of an English accent in their French, they’ll switch to speaking English. I can assure you that francophones who do this do it to be nice, but several people take it to mean that their French (which they’ve spent many years to learn) isn’t good enough for them.

11

[QUOTE=mnemosyne]
Well, yes… but they still want the tourists to come! They just want you to learn French first! Quality tourists, that’s what Québec wants! The rest of you sub-par tourists can just go visit Old Orchard or something.
[/QUOTE]

They tied that with immigration, giving preference to French-speakers. They were hoping for an influx from France, Belgium and Switzerland. What they got were Haitians. Lots of Haitians.

Or so my mother describes it.

12

[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir]
Preach it, bro. The Francophone majority in Quebec is so uptight and has such a siege mentality that that’s exactly what they’re doing. And they keep losing secession referenda; serves 'em right, sez I.
[/QUOTE]
Well, in Montreal, at least, I’ve never seen any issue with speaking English. I would often try out my high school French, and when I got stuck, the Montrealer would immediately switch to English without a problem.

13

[QUOTE=Frank]
Under what circumstances is the Quebec government and are Quebec businesses allowed to have signs in English?..

Even given the political reasons for throwing French in the face of fellow Canadians, it would seem to me that there are very practical reasons for allowing English in Quebec.

What’s up?
[/QUOTE]

What’s up? What’s up? Dude, what’s up is welcome to Canada. I remember those threads you started about moving up here, and I’m surprised you weren’t ready for this sort of thing. I’ve lived in a few countries now, and Canada is bizarre. Let’s take everything you could ever want in a country, and instead of prospering, let’s see just how miserable we can make each other. Wait, hold on – let’s not waste all our energy doing just that; let’s spend a fair amount of our time sanctimoniously pointing our smug little fingers south, blaming stuff on Americans.

But to cough up a semblance of an answer to your question, there was a time in Quebec when English ruled. My FIL can tell tales of the shop floor in the sixties and seventies, for example. And now the pendulum has swung. You would doubtless argue that it has swung foolishly, stupidly, wrong-headedly, and in some instances you’re correct.

My worthless advice is to learn Mandarin, and get ready for the next swing.

14

I always giggle at the signage in Ontario - both French and English, in most cases (at least for road signs.) But when you get into Quebec, the road signs are strictly French. Which province is bilingual again?

15

New Brunswick.

16

[QUOTE=jovan]
It is the policy of Transports Quebec to use as little language as possible on signs, prefering instead pictograms.
[/quote]

True enough, and I think this is actually the case in most Canadian provinces. I’ve often heard Canadians here say that they were bewildered by the amount of worded signs in the US.

I too went to the Granby Zoo a few weeks ago, and I think I remember noticing that the signs in English were in fact few and far between, for something that prides itself as an international tourist attraction. But in any case that’s the decision of the zoo’s administrators. I guess they thought there were enough English signs for non-francophones to get by. Frank, maybe you should consider complaining to them, it’s possible that they just don’t realize that they’ve made it hard for you to visit.

Ha ha, that’s true, I do that, and that’s why I told Frank that he’ll need a lot of willpower if he wants to practice his French in Ottawa, or even Gatineau. I wonder if it’s easier or harder than to quit smoking? :wink:

[QUOTE=Bryan Ekers]
They tied that with immigration, giving preference to French-speakers. They were hoping for an influx from France, Belgium and Switzerland. What they got were Haitians. Lots of Haitians.
[/QUOTE]

I don’t mind Haitians. I think it’s a good thing that Quebec encourages immigration from French-speaking countries; it’ll be a lot easier for them to integrate. Easier than it was before, when the vast majority of immigrants to Quebec (and Canada in general) were from English-speaking countries, anyway.

[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir]
Preach it, bro. The Francophone majority in Quebec is so uptight and has such a siege mentality that that’s exactly what they’re doing. And they keep losing secession referenda; serves 'em right, sez I.
[/QUOTE]

Care to explain your thoughts further, Elendil’s Heir? (PM me if you don’t want to derail the thread.) In any case, it’s easy to get a “siege mentality” of sorts when until recently, despite the fact that you’re a majority, you had second-class citizen status, your language had no place in business or in the decision-making circles, and the vast majority of immigrants saw no need to ever learn it (and that’s still the case to a certain extent).

[QUOTE=Little Nemo]
My experience has been that Quebecois have no problem talking English with tourists - as long as they know you’re American. They don’t expect us to speak French. But they resent any Canadians who aren’t bilingual.
[/QUOTE]

Maybe that’s the case with some people, but personally I don’t expect Canadians to know more French than what they can find on their cereal boxes. But that’s another debate.

This said, try to get by speaking only French in the rest of Canada (even Ottawa!)

[QUOTE=Athena]
I always giggle at the signage in Ontario - both French and English, in most cases (at least for road signs.) But when you get into Quebec, the road signs are strictly French. Which province is bilingual again?
[/QUOTE]

That depends where you go to in Ontario. In Eastern Ontario (and presumably Northern Ontario, but I’ve never been there), road signs are in fact bilingual. But in the rest of the province, they are usually English-only, with the possible exception of large, important roads.

And in every province, federal roads (for example, roads in national parks) have bilingual signage.

17

[QUOTE=RealityChuck]
Well, in Montreal, at least, I’ve never seen any issue with speaking English. I would often try out my high school French, and when I got stuck, the Montrealer would immediately switch to English without a problem.
[/QUOTE]

I have never had any trouble in my many trips to Quebec either, and my way of communicating in French is to speak English with a bad French accent. Think Inspector Clouseau. They even pretend to believe I can speak French, which is a laugh, and then switch to English for my convenience.

18

I wonder what’s going to happen when a sizeable population of (monolingual Spanish) Hispanics moves into Canada.

19

[QUOTE=severus]
I wonder if it’s easier or harder than to quit smoking? :wink:
[/QUOTE]

Anything is easier than quitting smoking. I’m very proud of myself.

I didn’t make it clear that I had no problem speaking with people. As others have mentioned, French speakers will switch to English at the drop of a hat. I just didn’t want to make an idiot of myself by asking what every item on the menu was. :stuck_out_tongue:

I’m surprised to hear that the bilingual signage I see all over the Ottawa area is the exception rather than the rule. One more thing I didn’t know.

20

[QUOTE=severus]
That depends where you go to in Ontario. In Eastern Ontario (and presumably Northern Ontario, but I’ve never been there), road signs are in fact bilingual. But in the rest of the province, they are usually English-only, with the possible exception of large, important roads.
[/QUOTE]

I can attest to Northern Ontario having bilingual road signs. We’ve driven from Sault Ste. Marie to Quebec City and back, and all through Ontario the signs were in English and French.