Questions Regarding African-American and Stereotypes

Factual Questions
1

DISCLAIMER: It seems that, when talking about racial subject matter, the person talking is open to charges of racism. Therefore, let me state for the record that I ask these questions out of curiosity, NOT racism.

  1. Why is it that many African-Americans tend to give their children exotic names such as DaShonte or Shaniqua?

  2. I’ve noticed in my travels that, in the South, blacks tend to live in both urban areas and rural areas. However, in the North, they tend to stick mainly to urban areas. Is there a socio-economic-political reason for this?

2
  1. Turn that one around. Most blacks have average hohum names,just like most any group you’d pick by any ctiteria. But many “exotic” names belong to afro-amers. Some of them are of African origin,sometimes handed down,more often an affirmation of heritage. Some are ‘creative’ in spelling, pronunciation,or just plain created. Not to long ago a name was about the only way a person of color had of saying I am somebody, an individual.“Unusual” became more accepted in some quarters than others.So you got names influencing others.
    2.Don’t know what “North” you are comparing to which “South”,but there is more rural in general in the south than the north.A higher ratio of African-American in general in the South and people gotta live somewhere. Up till the 30’s there just weren’t a lot of blacks in the north, most Northern ones were urban. Back then there was a higher rural pop. in general in the US. The southern rural black pop. goes back to emancipation,well ,before, but they had no choice. At the time of emancipation, farming was the main ‘industry’ of the south,more so than the north anyway,so that is wher the work was. In the depression the Southern pop.,Black and White, went north looking for work ,they went to the citys where the work was ( Detroit auto industry in particular, as a start). It wasn’t all that easy for a poor southerner to buy farmland.
    You could just as easily say,In the South people of “Southern” heritage seem to live in both rural and uran areas,while in the North, people of “Southern Heritage” seem to live mainly in urban areas.

“Pardon me while I have a strange interlude.”-Marx

3

rastahomie,

In answer to question number 2, until about 1940, the vast majority of American blacks lived in the South. (In fact, a bare majority still live there - 55% according to the most recent statistics - and there’s no longer any clear trend about whether American blacks are moving north or south.) During the '40’s, '50’s, and '60’s, there occurred the Great Black Migration (to use the terminology of The Promised Land by Nicholas Lehmann_ (1991), which is probably as close as you’re going to get to a standard history of this event). Most blacks had lived in the rural South and most were renters.

By 1940 though, the mechanical cotton picker was reducing the need for agricultural labor. Simultaneously, World War II had created the need for factory workers at plants in (mostly) northern cities. A lot of the blacks who moved north at that point were happy to do so. Their new neighbors might not like them very much, but at least there were no Jim Crow segregation laws.

Hardly any of them moved to small towns or rural areas. It was uncomfortable being the only blacks in the area, even when they could get someone to sell them a house. Mostly then they moved into the same neighborhoods that the small number of blacks who already lived in northern cities lived in. These neighborhoods then began swelling in size.

By the early '60’s, the neighborhoods where blacks lived were substantial portions of the cities. In some cases, they were even majorities in those cities. Because of this and because the automobile had made it possible to live a fair distance from one’s job, whites began moving out of the cities into the suburbs.

A large number of northern blacks had moved up into something close to confortable middle-class status by that time. By the late '70’s they had begun moving out of the cities into suburbs too. Most of them moved to suburbs that quickly became majority black, but a fair number moved into mostly white suburbs too. (Many blacks in these cities stayed there even after becoming middle-class, I should note.)

It might seem that the cities would have been left mostly to poorer blacks at that point, but then there was another turn-around. Many young, single, upscale whites looked at the downtown neighborhoods where the properties had become reasonably cheap again, so they began moving into these neighborhoods and turning them into hip places to live. (This is the process called “gentrification”.) So many of the big cities are now actually whiter than they were 20 years ago.

4

Naming your kids after your culture is not new. I know white people who name their kids:
meadow, rocket, moon, etc.

5

Somehow, I doubt if names like ‘Latisha, Lawanda, Latrisha, Latrish’ EVER had any African roots.

I have noticed in the Black race that when they live in ghettos or close density groups, the insanity seems to run high i.e.: high crime, racism, gangs, the exaggerated language, Black-isms, Nation of Islam ideology, and the raising of poverty to a deliberate, high art.

When there are no high concentrations, and all races are mixed together, this stops. I first noticed this in Port St. Lucie, Florida where there are no race sections. Interestingly, one of the neighboring cities, Fort Pierce, has a huge Black section, with the above mentioned problems or ‘typical Black traits’ so often portrayed in the news and movies.

A further interesting note here is that no White company may have anything publicly designated for Whites – like White television programming, magazines with anything in the title designating it for Whites, all White organizations or products designed for Whites. However, Black people can, like Black Entertainment Television, Ebony Magazine, All Black movie productions (including workers), beauty products designated strictly for Blacks, and organizations indicated to be for Blacks. (I once brought this up on a designated BLACK MESSAGE BOARD and was promptly harassed from the board as being a racist, a wannabe slave owner, anti-black, obviously White, a White Devil wishing to hold the Blacks down, a bigot, a trouble maker, and assorted unprintable titles were given to me. Plus, I was E-mailed nasty letters. I was threatened and obscenely jeered and all of this from the Black members and when I snapped and lost my cool and insulted one writer directly by calling him a rabid racist of low intelligence, which was much gentler than what I had been called, they promptly contacted AOL and filed a Terms of Service violation against me!!)

I found it very interesting that each felt they could freely insult myself, my race, my attitude in colorful ways, including slander, but when I chose to respond in kind, they took insult and reported me.

The attitude of many Black people is sometimes hard to understand, though from past experiences on Black boards, they have given me scores of reasons why they have it. While most have assured me that they do not want special considerations and wish to be just like anyone else, all strongly defend their right to special treatment like Black oriented products, affirmative action, Black television programs, Black radio stations, and an astonishing number agree with the warped and insane view of Whites the Nation of Islam preaches.

Even though crime statistics from the Federal Government show that 80% of the national crime is caused by Blacks, they insist that the figures are ‘manipulated’ because Whites mainly keep the official records and mainly are the police.

As I have said in a previous post, I’m a bigot for various reasons in that I will not intermarry or date Black people but choose to live and let live and find it against my grain to go out of my way to cause problems for a Black person but, I see what I see from personal experience without paying attention to any White empowered anti-racial groups. Nor do I find any reason for an average Black person to be treated any less than anyone else BUT I do take offense when any Black person demands special consideration because he or she is Black.

NightGirl mentioned the difference between English and American Blacks and there actually is. The few Black people whom I have encountered from England, to simply put it, are not as hateful or overtly belligerent, which seems to characterize most American Blacks. Plus they do not seem overly concerned with dredging up their African Roots, whether accurate or fictionalized, like so many American Blacks seem to be preoccupied with.

What? Me worry?’

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Rainbowcsr, reminds of me Whoppee, she said she went to africa, saw real africans & said they don’t look nothing like her.

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Quote - "Somehow, I doubt if names like ‘Latisha, Lawanda, Latrisha, Latrish’ EVER had any African roots.

I have noticed in the Black race that when they live in ghettos or close density groups, the insanity seems to run high i.e.: high crime, racism, gangs, the exaggerated language, Black-isms, Nation of Islam ideology, and the raising of poverty to a deliberate, high art."

I have noticed that in areas of intense White ghetto-ization that the same thing happens. Palm Springs CA is a good example. Rampant with White trash, the middle class Jewish element is gone (only one good deli on the strip), drug use, bigotry, alcoholism, gambling, lust for money etc. are RAMPANT. I agree that any ghetto can do this.

As far as NAMES - more my speciality. “Kadija” is Islamic, Ayesha is African too, it means “Lioness”, LeRoy, is French for “king”. These are “real” names. Should we contrast the recent totally white names like “CODY”, “KAITLIN”, “KAYLA”, etc.? Just as inane. As most whites have no clue what the names mean, they are for all practical purposes as inane as any “made-up” African American ones, no better no worse, but definatlely a lot “crustier” (ie the white ones sound like what an old prospecter might name his kids). In fact African Americans seem to have the extremes - new fangled on the one side, and if you are so offended by these, very tradititional ones on the other, Grover, Cassandra, etc. (Did you know that the latter where traditional - or do they sound “exotic” to you too?).

The problem here is that many Whites (perhaps the poster), because of their OWN socio-economic staus do not rub shoulders with affluent Blacks, and get a distorted view.

8

Hey, that’s almost MY name! And it’s not inane! It means “Harborina”!

~Kyla

“Anger is what makes America great.”

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To the OP - I might suggest that with a handle like that you ask your Black brethren (whether you are white or black).

As to the observations above about English Blacks - gee what could be the difference - from your own analysis it is obviously not genetic (thank god), so what gives? Is it perhaps the conditions in which people live? The fact that slavery was abolished in even the British colonies in 1833 and not legal in Britain itself EVER? Gee, I dunno.

As far as British Blacks not “dredging up” African culture. Is that why dance hall reggae is the hottest music trend in the UK? hmmmm

Whites “dredge up” European culture all the time in more meaningless and innacurate ways.

For example-

Tacky post-modernist Roman style buildings

The Third Reich (remember, meant to be the heirs of Rome - a culture totally unrelated to Germany - if American blacks aren’t Egyptian, Nazi’s certainly weren’t Roman Centurians)

Endless revivals of anything French, especially from the 17th century, namely the “barbizon” look. Bleached hair (then it was powdered), heavy make up, high heels and stockings for women - this is done by woman all over the world who have not the faintest relationship to anything French, except in their imaginations.

10

Nothing personal meant Kyla, just stacking your great name up against African American ones - not better no worse. :slight_smile:

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Just a WAG on #2:

People typically, when given a choice, form communities based on commonality. When Blacks started migrating from the South, they clumped together for that reason/

#1 I think you find that typically with the lower-income Blacks. Giving that typical (wow, used that word three times!) three-syllable, middle-accented, sounds exotic and (upper) classy. None of the middle-class Blacks I know of use those kinds of names.

For the same reason, I believe, you find low-income honkies giving names like Tiffany, Hillary, and Brittany.

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Number 1 name last year for girls - SAMANTHA

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To the OP, I think it was Eudora Welty who said poor Southerners gave their children the most wonderful, elaborate names they could think of because that was all they had to give.

Rainbowcsr - you really shouldn’t take movies and TV as reality.

It is extremely unbecoming of a member of the dominant white boy culture to whine “that’s not FAIR” when someone else gets an advantage for a change. Oh, boo-hoo. And all those horrible handicapped people get all the good parking spaces, too - while poor little you has to walk an extra 20 feet. It’s so unfair! Grow up.

Mjollnir - you said yourself, “when given a choice”; I doubt black Southerners moving to the North had much “choice” about where they could find a place to live.

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Kyla, dear–“Harborina”? You have an…interesting…idea of what is and is not inane. :stuck_out_tongue:

With magic, you can turn a frog into a prince. With science, you can turn a frog into a Ph.D, and you still have the frog you started with.

15

BIG SIGH!

It is, in my experience, virtually IMPOSSIBLE to have a White/Black general discussion without pointed sarcasism and assorted slams popping up. I find that real curious because I’ve had many a polite discussion concerning differences with American Indians, Chinese Americans, Hispanic Americans and even people from what can be called the Middle East.

In a White/Black discussion SOMEONE is going to start shit in one form or another and it usually, in my experience, is the Black person or Black sympathizer (for want of a better term) who starts it.

RobRoy;

*As far as British Blacks not “dredging up” African culture. Is that why dance hall reggae is the hottest music trend in the UK? hmmmm

Whites “dredge up” European culture all the time in more meaningless and inaccurate ways.

For example-

Tacky postmodernist Roman style buildings

The Third Reich (remember, meant to be the heirs of Rome - a culture totally unrelated to Germany - if American blacks aren’t Egyptian, Nazi’s certainly weren’t Roman Centurians)

Endless revivals of anything French, especially from the 17th century, namely the “barbizon” look. Bleached hair (then it was powdered), heavy make up, high heels and stockings for women - this is done by woman all over the world who have not the faintest relationship to anything French, except in their imaginations.*

Reggae is not African based though it was created by Black people in Jamaica. (And I absolutely hate that music – but then I absolutely loath Polka also.)

Europe consists of a variety of independent nations of various races NOT a continent essentially consisting of 90% of one race. PLUS the trends you mention are NOT all based on the desire of the White Race to have roots in a bygone era. In the Black race it is a stubborn movement not only to find a so-called identity but to create a separation of racial identification instead of blending in with the general society.

I have found it pathetic that suddenly, Black leaders glorify the trappings and attitudes of old Black religions and tribes, create mystical Black oriented religions and holidays and suddenly have to parade around in so-called ‘traditional’ dress just to boost up flagging ego systems instead of leading their people into the world community as part of the universal whole, of which they are.

The again, in retrospect, I might have a personal block here concerning that form of thinking. My ancestors are from several countries and I suppose I could trace them back even further, but, unlike some people I know, I never have found any need to look up and identify with any ancestral culture nor any interest in doing so, being content with the one I am in now. Having a ‘traditional’ name, wearing ‘traditional’ clothing or understanding ‘traditional’ religions, if different, or even knowing ‘traditional’ history has never turned me on.

Of course, I do know that my ancestors, at one time or another, were slaves, JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER RACE in the whole world. To the best of my knowledge, NO race of any color has not enslaved others and been enslaved themselves eventually, so Black people do not have the monopoly on slavery or being treated, in the past, like animals or being discriminated against.

I seem to recall some pretty nasty things being done to Jews, the Irish, the Italian, the Chinese, the American Indian, the Scottish, French, Spanish and so on. I think the British recall their treatment of the Indian ‘little brown men’ where everyone in India was a barbarian, uncivilized and ‘native’ was a dirty word.

Personally, today, the way I look at it, names really don’t have to mean anything. They’re just a handle for the persons wearing them. (Still, now, Shawanda, Latisha, Lawanda, Lasraha? Get real!)

By the way, if you REALLY want to have an eye opening experience, compare the socio-emotional attitudes of the general White population in America ranging from as close as the 1800s to the current times and SEE if YOU can see MANY similarities between the ‘acceptable attitudes’ among Whites THEN and Blacks NOW.

I’ll give you a clue. Ghetto dress = rapper outfits = early 1900 lower income White dress = knee pants = in-family hand-me-downs. Tough ‘Black’ attitude (everyone a gangsta) = early 1900 White ‘Thug’ attitude fostered by the glorification of gangsters who came into power after the crash, when poverty was nationwide.

16

Ten points each to mrjohn, Wendell, and Rob Roy for reasonable posts. Comment on “LaTisha” type names: I wouldn’t name my kid either Cody or LaTisha. I would choose a name that wouldn’t come in or out of fashion and that wouldn’t identify him as a member of a particular ethnic group. Like, say, James or Mary or David or Susan. For American kids, that is. Geez, have you ever met an Aunt Lois or an Uncle Homer or an Aunt Lucille or an Uncle Clyde? I have. Don’t stick your kids with names like that.

–Lawrence, your Barcelona correspondent from a semi-redneck Kansas/Texas family

17

Apparently I haven’t done a good job of making this clear enough:

My username is in no way related to reggae music, the Rastafarian religion, ganja, Jamaican political activism, or anything similar. It’s a nickname I had in college. I’m white, for Pete’s sake.

As far as names are concerned, I’m only speaking of general trends. Yes, there are whites who make up names for their children: I lived in Joplin, MO (white-trash central) for seven years, and I can tell you confidently that Jace, Chase, Colton, Dakota, Lakota, and Shawnee were quite popular (seems Native American tribes are popular in that part of MO, even though the native Osage population had been eradicated a century ago).

And, RobRoy, where did you get that I was offended by those names? I’m just curious about them. And, yes, they are “exotic.” By golly, if you have a child and then make up a name for him/her out of whole cloth, then his name is exotic.

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1: Black people were historically forced to adopt European names. Their surnames, and therefore identity, became that of those who held them in bondage. When given the chance to be able to break that pattern without the dangers of not doing so, fairly recently, people have chosen to name their children names they enjoy. LaTonya, Shaniqua, etc., are beautiful melodious names, to my ears. Thought is given to that present beauty when naming a child. Now that it’s possible, why should European tradition be considered? Out of respect for a culture that never let you keep your own name to begin with? I think that one of the best traits of Americans is to be able to create new ways of living, apart from the shackles of the past, and new names go along with that. And, hopefully, we live in an age where people don’t have to drop the “sky” and “witz” from their names to “pass” as well.

19

Pont still stands about whites glorifying a European past that has as little connection to them as Black glorifying Egypt, when most are from West Africa. Most white Americans are of German origin, yet the continual harking back to our “cultural” ancestors in Greece and Rome. Fashion layouts seldom feature clogs and dirndls, architecture rarely copies moss huts (northern European) - Yet both rehash empire waists (Roman), Corinthian Columns (Greek), etc.

Same phenom. A continent picks it’s supposed best culture and everybody from that continent claims direct descent, culturally or otherwise.

20

“Europe consists of a variety of independent nations of various races NOT a continent essentially consisting of 90% of one race.”

Scientifically, Europe is primarily ONE RACE - Caucasian. Previously this was divided into: Celtic, Nordic, Tyrolean, Pictish, Italic, Hellenic, Slavic, Norse, etc. These divisions are not given much weight anymore, as nearly all are hybrids at this time anyway.

Scientifically, Africa is primarily ONCE RACE - previously, it too was divided into: Ibo, !hosa, Hutu, Tutsi, Yoruba, Zulu, etc.

The observations about Italians being gangsters, etc. is well taken, but not an eye opener. Disenfranchised groups often turn to what is essentially a black market. Nothing new. It still doesn’t explain why blacks are still disenfranchised except that they will never be white and we seem to let all the groups (none of whom were enslaved in America …hello?) slip bast them into the middle class. It’s not some nebulous “attitude” thing or resentment - it’s about money and opportunity.