Well put.
More info on the rift between Quincy and Michael Jackson, including info that Jackson lobbied the Grammys to not award producer credit to Jones on Thriller. Also Jackson’s family is puffed.
He did a long Playboy interview in 1990. Might be interesting to compare them, if you can find it.
Went looking for the Playboy interview and got hung up on this GQ interview from Jan 29th. Only just started it but it looks great. Here tis:
Ah. I hadn’t appreciated that Michael had lobbied for full Producer credit on Thriller. That puts any issues waayyy back in time. I have heard a few demos of Michael’s where he had drafted songs from Off the Wall and Thriller on his own - and yes, they sound very much like the final version. Michael was excellent in the studio. But a freeze-out on the guy who actually brought the songs home, told Michael he needed one more hit and got Beat it out of him, and asked Eddie Van Halen to play, etc.? C’mon - that sounds much more about Michael being a jerk vs. having a legitimate solo producer claim.
I also didn’t know about Quincy approaching Prince to duet on Bad. Who’s singing “Your butt is mine,” indeed.
Fascinating, thanks. That snark by one family member about Quincy not being able to deal with Michael’s talent, when Quincy produced Sinatra, Aretha, Miles, etc., is just hilarious.
I agree with every point. Thanks. It was quite a surprise to find out that Jackson had tried to squeeze Jones out on the production award. Jones has been known as the producer for as long as the album has been out. I seem to have a vague recollection also of Jones about what what he got paid too, mentioning something about other producers getting paid more for rap albums. But again, the memory of it is vague. I may try to find it later. And yeah, the comment from Jackson’s family re Jones not being able to handle Michael’s talent almost ruined my keyboard.
The mental image created by the story on Prince and Michael Jackson questioning which one would sing “Your butt is mine” was worth the read all on its own.
I simply hadn’t realized there was an attempt to get them into the studio together. I just could never, ever imagine that anything could work. The passive-aggressive genius-ness on display would make each discussion a mini-gladiator fight between Peter Pan and The Purple One. Your butt is mine. Oy.
Yep. No idea what Q was thinking. Could be he’s prone to overestimate his admittedly Herculean abilities. (Speaking of which, in the GQ thread I linked to he states he currently has 22 girlfriends scattered around the globe, ranging in age from 28 to 42.) He’s 84.
And now I’m out for the night but I’ll look forward to any comments you might have re the GQ interview. And for that matter, I’ll look forward to reading the rest of it myself. 
Yeah - some pop culture site had summarized this interview’s big highlights, but I hadn’t read the whole thing. Say whatever you want about Quincy Jones, but damn, he’s done it all. Telling the Pope he’s wearing pimp shoes - oh, man, how can you not love that?
Kids these days, get off my lawn, etc. I’ve been listening to rock/pop music since 1965, and I don’t have much trouble finding new music that feels fresh compared to the thousands of tracks I’ve already heard across the decades.
I agree that you won’t find much of it on the stations that play Taylor Swift, but most of the stuff on Top 40 radio 50 years ago was dreck, too.
Indeed, if there’s a position that makes my eyes hurt from rolling, it’s that music stopped being good at some time in the past. I don’t have much time for Jones, and far less for Jackson. To hear Jones trot out that tired old nonsense makes me have even less time for him. It implies that he didn’t understand something fundamental about music as I see it, no matter how much money he made in the industry.
And the serious art world never thought too much of Dali - not necessarily a position I share, but it’s true. He’s much more important as an example of being at the forefront of self-promotion, rather than being at the forefront of painting.
Cites?
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For “pop” records from 2015 or later that are “fresh”;
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For any reason to believe that the “dreck” ratio was the same in 1965, as 2015.
You’re young and spry. It should be easy. Please hurry up. I’m going into the nursing home next week.
You left out your explanation of what is fundamental about music. You’re saying you have it but you’re holding out? It’s the thing QJ didn’t have. We know that much.
Do you have a “smooth” market vision where all songs are in a big uniform cultural stream that never stops, or changes qualitatively. You would have to cite for that. If music changes it can be better or worse. Or the same for a few data points. But it won’t be identical. So the idea that music is always partially good to a similar ratio is ridiculous.
Tired old nonsense comes in many forms.
Dude.
Can’t you just stick to the topic. Quincy Jones says that there is music today he likes and does not like. Please just leave this there and don’t act like you have every right to demand that others do your bidding.
The topic was QJ not knowing what he was talking about, in his field. It led into the old tired “There is always pop that’s good. You are just old.” thing that you can see here all the time, that is meant to end discussion about quality, and that I am frankly tired of. That was my reason, and my topic, which was adjacent to the OP and in response to someone’s post, and not you incidentally.
What the heck is my “bidding”?
You are asking people to “prove” to you that there is current music that is worthy. That is “your bidding” and yet another example of you making a thread about…you.
Quincy Jones cited folks he thinks are good today and not so good. You, and anyone, are welcome to disagree with whom Quincy Jones cited. And if you want to use that to frame a debate about the state of Current Pop, start a thread and see how it goes.
But instead, you are hijacking this topic. You can’t cite whom Quincy Jones liked and disliked today as evidence that he’s senile or “doesn’t know music - certainly not today” - because: A) it’s all subjective and anyone has every right to say there is Good music today also those who say there is not; and B) He’s Quincy Fuckin’ Jones.
Dunno that I can provide cites for things that are a matter of opinion, but here are a few songs from 2015 that I regard as ‘fresh.’ I’m sure you’ll find reasons to dis them, and that’s your prerogative. But there’s good music out there, and if you want to tell it to get off your lawn, that’s too bad for you.
“Ship to Wreck” - Florence + the Machine
“Sedona” - Houndmouth
“My Sweet Summer” - Dirty Heads
“Uma Thurman” - Fall Out Boy
“Lampshades On Fire” - Modest Mouse
“Cigarette Daydreams” - Cage the Elephant
“S.O.B.” - Nathaniel Rateliff and the Night Sweats
These are all from 2015, they’re on a playlist of mostly 2015 stuff that I listen to a lot, and I’m nowhere near getting tired of any of them. Enjoy. (Or not.)
Sedona was great! I remember that one well.
I think Take it or Leave It was better than Cigarette Daydreams, from Cage the Elephant. The former was really a unique pop song, the latter was more derivative of other influences, but it was still pretty good.
Yes, there’s absolutely good pop music still being produced.
Sort of a modern-day Herman’s Hermits type thing.
While we’re around that same time period, I never dug Gotye’s big hit. But Pharrell’s Happy was a bit of pop genius. I hated Hozier’s overwrought Take Me To Church but I thought Someone New was a good piece of musicianship.