R.S.V.P.

[ASPA]

Originally posted by ASPA:
Interesting!
**

But not that interesting. heh heh heh.

[Northern_Piper]

This is one of many expressions which the English language has borrowed from others, and kept hold of while the original has changed. The French no longer live in cul-de-sacs or eat hors d’oeuvres.

I don’t know about that, RussellM - both terms are in my Petit Larousse (admittedly a 1976 edition, but I’d be surprised if they’ve dropped out of usage in just 24 years).

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and the stars o’erhead were dancing heel to toe

[Kilgore_Trout_1]

I don’t know about that, RussellM - both terms are in my Petit Larousse (admittedly a 1976 edition, but I’d be surprised if they’ve dropped out of usage in just 24 years)

this is because russellm may not realise that these phrases are indeed correct french.

whether they are used by the french hipsters or not is irrelevant.

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what is essential is invisible to the eye -the fox

[RussellM]

this is because russellm may not realise that these phrases are indeed correct french.

whether they are used by the french hipsters or not is irrelevant.

The assertion that these phrases are no longer used in French - correct / hip or fuddy-duddy was not mine, but Bill Bryson’s. I will post the cite this evening (UK evening).

Russell

[Padeye]

Originally posted by tomndebb:
We’ve had discussions on ICHTHUS every so often going back to the AOL board.

I suppose it’s no more bogus than the story Southern Baptist Sunday school teachers told me, that early, covert Christians would identify one another by coyly tracing a curve in the dirt with the toe of a sandal. Another Christian would complete the fish drawing but a Roman centurion would be ignorant of the meaning. Sounds pretty fishy to me. Like a mutant version of gaydar and the phrase, “IMRU?”

Now that I think about it, would GADAR be a proper acronym? Gay Acquisition, Detection And Ranging?

[RussellM]

**Missing cite now appears **

*Mother Tongue The English Language, Bill Bryson *

Quite a number of words that we’ve absorbed no longer exist in their place of birth. For instance, the French do not use *nom de plume, double entendre, panache, bon viveur, legerdemain, or R.S.V.P * for répondez s’il vous plaît. (Instead they write ‘Prière de répondre.’) The Italians do not use brio and although they do use al fresco, to them it signifies not being outside but being in prison.

Comments from any French or Italian speakers would be welcome. Perhaps Bryson’s definition of French speaking is only the European version?

Russell

[Arnold_Winkelried]

All rightie then!
In Switzerland, I’ve never seen
“Répondez, s’il vous plaît” spelled out.

I’ve either seen “Prière de répondre” or else “R.S.V.P.” If I had to say which is more common, I would guess R.S.V.P.

Voilà!

[RussellM]

This would be a good point for Bill Bryson to reveal himself and help me out.

Russell

[zeenard]

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by RussellM:

This is one of many expressions which the English language has borrowed from others, and kept hold of while the original has changed. The French no longer live in cul-de-sacs or eat hors d’oeuvres.
As a native French speaker I can tell you that cul-de-sacs and hors d’oeuvres ARE STILL frequently used today.

[RussellM]

**zeenard **

I give up. Bill Bryson is now on his own. He said it, I believed him, now everyone is telling me non.

au revoir
Russell

[TomH]

FWIW Russell, this is not the only example of Bill Bryson being mistaken. His book, Mother Tongue, contains a number of glaring errors about the Yorkshire dialect of English, an area in which he himself lived for a number of years (e.g. he says that the pronunciation of water with a short a sound (rhymes with “fatter” in Br Eng) died out in the 19th Century).

It also contained a number of patently absurd folk-etymologies which he could have avoided if he had simply looked in a dictionary. As a rule of thumb, I’d say he’s correct about 80 per cent of the time.

[RussellM]

Ah well. Ho hum.

Russell

[Green_Bean]

I second that emotion:

I recently read my first Bryson book, I’m a Stranger Here Myself. It did contain some errors. I think of him as more of an “entertaining” writer than an “informative” writer.