Raging douche or "Esquire". Is there a difference in title?

Factual Questions
21

[QUOTE=Captain Amazing]
In a lot of southern states, people of local distinction, like newspaper editors or lawyers, tended to be given “Colonel” as an honorific.
[/QUOTE]

A notable example, IIRC, was the “Kentucky Colonel” himself, Colonel Sanders, who took to adressing himself as “Colonel” after being given the honorary title, as well as dressing up like a stereotypical southern gentleman in order to help gain more attention to his resteraunt (which evidentally worked).

For what it’s worth, the highest actual rank he attained in the military was “Private”, but hey, the man made some tasty chicken. :smiley:

22

Interesting. In a Canadian court, we just refer to the opposing lawyer as “my friend” (or “my learned friend” if he/she is a Q.C.).

23

[QUOTE=Arnold Winkelried]
To summarize: according to the Staff Report, for proper usage, the OP could only use Esq. if he were an attorney or an English nobleman, otherwise he will have to content himself with “raging douche” after his name. Right?
[/QUOTE]

Umm, not quite "The answer is that any snob in the world (or at least in the U.S.) can use the title. " (GB has some exceptions, ect, YMMV)

But in general, one does not refer to themselves as Esq., just others.

I have no problem with lawyers using the term, however.

OTOH, I don’t like “non-medical-professionals” calling themselves “Doctor”. If you have a PhD. , sure yeah, put it on your business card, but you are “Hi, I am Bob Smith” not “Greetings, I am Doctor Smith”. Then again, if someone else introduces you as “Shirley, this is Doctor Smith, a Professor at ACME Univ” I am fine with that. But if you don’t treat patients*, don’t call yourself “Doctor”.

(I understand this may sound hypocritical of me, but the “DrDeth” appellation is a joking nickname the dudes at work call me, and I also use it for gaming. I introduce myself as “First name, last name, call me “xxxxxx””.

*Yes, this includes Dentists, Vetinarians, Eye Doctors, Chiropractors and the like)

24

[QUOTE=DrDeth]
OTOH, I don’t like “non-medical-professionals” calling themselves “Doctor”. If you have a PhD. , sure yeah, put it on your business card, but you are “Hi, I am Bob Smith” not “Greetings, I am Doctor Smith”. Then again, if someone else introduces you as “Shirley, this is Doctor Smith, a Professor at ACME Univ” I am fine with that. But if you don’t treat patients*, don’t call yourself “Doctor”.

(I understand this may sound hypocritical of me, but the “DrDeth” appellation is a joking nickname the dudes at work call me, and I also use it for gaming. I introduce myself as “First name, last name, call me “xxxxxx””.

*Yes, this includes Dentists, Vetinarians, Eye Doctors, Chiropractors and the like)
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Well, like it or not, “Doctor” is part of their title, which they’ve earned by getting a PhD or whatever kind of doctorate. They probably can’t use the expression “Trust me, I’m a Doctor” however, as I’m fairly sure THAT’S limited to medical professionals. The main thing that is different is which flavor of alphabet soup they can put on the other end of their name.

Of course, it probably all depends on context. On most college campuses, all the PhDs are going to be “Doctor so-and-so” whether or not they know which end of a stethescope to shout into, while in a hospital, the title probably just doesn’t come up very often.

And in response to the topic: a thought randomly occured to me: “Wouldn’t they only be a raging douche if they were like, foaming at the mouth angry?”

25

[QUOTE=DrDeth]
OTOH, I don’t like “non-medical-professionals” calling themselves “Doctor”.
[/QUOTE]
I recall in another thread (the exact topic of which I cannot remember and therefore cannot find via search–maybe someone else knows) some mention that the title of “Dr.” was used for PhDs long before it was used for medical types. An MD is not a terminal degree. You need a PhD in medicine for that.

There’s a chem prof at the University of Illinois who insists on being addressed as “Professor Douchebag,” because “anyone can be a Dr.”

26

[QUOTE=Ruken]
There’s a chem prof at the University of Illinois who insists on being addressed as “Professor Douchebag,” because “anyone can be a Dr.”
[/QUOTE]

Wow, that sounds like probably the coolest college professor I’ve ever heard of, and I’ve had some pretty cool ones. A close second would be the history prof I had who said that you could have your cell phone on in class, but if it rang he would answer it. One day, a phone rings in the back of the class, and he stops in the middle of a sentence to sprint up the steps and snatch the phone out of the girl’s hand before she can turn it off then answers it, having a short (and apparantly pleasant) conversation with her boyfriend, before handing the phone back and saying “Tom says he’ll pick you up for dinner at 5. If that’s not OK, call him after class.”

What made it funny, was this wasn’t a slim athletic guy. This was a man who appears to have enjoyed MANY good meals in his life. And of course, as soon as he gets back to the podium, he picks up exactly where he left off. :smiley:

27

You use Esquire if your name is Ebenezer Dorset.

28

[QUOTE=DSYoungEsq]
(just how does a douche rage, anyway??).
[/QUOTE]

add 1 tsp. baking soda

29

I have heard the use of Colonel as an (albeit antiquated) honorific in Georgia and at one time heard an explanation that memebers of the bar were indeed colonels in the local militia, or somesuch. I don’t have the cite, but a guy I work with does. I’ll try to post it tomorrow.

I don’t use Esq. ever and instead opt for Mr. or Mrs. on the basis that some perceive the use of Esq. as sexist – not that I share this perception, or that I’ve even bothered to think about it much, just that, why borrow trouble? Besides, I think it looks silly.

alphaboi867 wrote

This has come up before. I have never once heard a judge say this. Without fail, every judge I have encountered has addressed lawyers as “counselor” or “Mr./Mrs.” I have heard maybe one or two attorneys use the word “attorney” as a prefix. In every instance, the speaker is black. The use of attorney as a prefix is, in my experience, common in the black community.

DrDeth wrote

What did you call your college professors? And your dentist or vet, really? Even at his or her office? Whatever. Why borrow trouble? They have a doctorate.

30

[QUOTE=whole bean]
What did you call your college professors? And your dentist or vet, really? Even at his or her office? Whatever. Why borrow trouble? They have a doctorate.
[/QUOTE]

In the case of college professors, I’d be willing to bet that, from time to time, he’d be tempted to address them as “Hey, Jackass!”

I know I’ve felt that way once every couple of semesters. :smiley:

31

[QUOTE=DSYoungEsq]
For what it is worth, I never used the title in my real world signature, instructing my secretaries not to use it. I simply didn’t consider it necessary. It made its way into my online screen name at AOL because it was a very handy way of identifying my email address as related to the Douglas Young who was an attorney.
[/QUOTE]

I think it’s quite unnecessary to explain an anonymous screen name on a message board where many screen names, if used in real life, would identify the bearer as illiterate, insane, or evil, much less a pompous ass.

32

[QUOTE=OneCentStamp]
add 1 tsp. baking soda
[/QUOTE]
And a Mentos.

33

[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves]
And a Mentos.
[/QUOTE]

Ah, yes. The “Ouchmaker.” :eek:

34

OK, I am going to add one thing: whether or not signature lines add the abbreviation (as opposed to the address) tends to be a regional thing. In my area, it was common, though not universal by any means, to see it added to the sig. Which is why I always had to train newly hired secretaries to remove it from my letters. :slight_smile:

Another common way to sign is to append in a line under the signature: Attorney at Law

35

[QUOTE=whole bean]

DrDeth wrote
What did you call your college professors?
And your dentist or vet, really? Even at his or her office? Whatever. Why borrow trouble? They have a doctorate.
[/QUOTE]

“Professor” or, “Bob” depending on what they asked for.

“Doctor” or “Doc” or “Shirley”. Did you read my post carefully? “Dentist or vet” treat patients.

36

[QUOTE=DrDeth]
“Professor” or, “Bob” depending on what they asked for.

“Doctor” or “Doc” or “Shirley”. Did you read my post carefully? “Dentist or vet” treat patients.
[/QUOTE]

:smack: no, I didn’t. Sorry.

As for addressing professors: In law school, I called my professors “professor [whatever],” but in undergrad, without fail, if the professor in question had a doctorate, it was “Dr. [whatever]”. My mother is a professor, and I know her students refer to her as “Dr. [her last name].” This has been the case at the four different universities she’s worked at since receiving her doctorate. It is undoubtedly the custom, and after all, that is what any sort of honorific is, a custom. By not following suit, whether you realize it/like it/ believe it or not, you’re making a statement that might be perceived by some as a slight. You mention referring to your professors by first name, are/were you a non-traditional student?

37

here’s a cite re the use of colonel as an honorific generally in the South, and for lawyers specifically in Georgia

38

The governor of Kentucky is empowered to bestow the honorary title of Colonel .

I have never used “Esq.” myself and when I was in practise, I always deleted it when my secretary inserted it on my behalf. Really, it makes no sense to me.

Sunspace, I think you’re right – “Attorney X” refers to the role that the lawyer is playing in court (attorney = representative; attorney-at-law = legal representative).

I’m with BMax on titles being a violation of American egality. In fact, I resent the fact that the president is addressed as “Mr. President” and members of Congress are addressed as “Senator X” and “Congressman Y.” President, senator, representative, justice, judge – these are just jobs in our democratic republic and should not carry with them any titles. In my view, these people should be addressed and referred to with no greater honorific than Mr. Bush, Mr. Kennedy, Ms. Pelosi, Mr. Roberts.

39

[QUOTE=acsenray]
I’m with BMax on titles being a violation of American egality. In fact, I resent the fact that the president is addressed as “Mr. President” and members of Congress are addressed as “Senator X” and “Congressman Y.” President, senator, representative, justice, judge – these are just jobs in our democratic republic and should not carry with them any titles. In my view, these people should be addressed and referred to with no greater honorific than Mr. Bush, Mr. Kennedy, Ms. Pelosi, Mr. Roberts.
[/QUOTE]

Well, the titles in their cases indicate what their job is, similar to a surgeon being called “Doctor Allcome”

That said, I always found “Mr. President” to be a vaguely peculiar way of addressing the President.

40

[QUOTE=whole bean]
This has come up before. I have never once heard a judge say this. Without fail, every judge I have encountered has addressed lawyers as “counselor” or “Mr./Mrs.” I have heard maybe one or two attorneys use the word “attorney” as a prefix. In every instance, the speaker is black. The use of attorney as a prefix is, in my experience, common in the black community.
[/QUOTE]

I think that this varies by jurisdiction. In New York, it is virtually never done, but it is common in Connecticut to refer to another attorney in correspondence (and I believe in person) as Attorney John Jones.

A lawyer that I used to work with was a Kentucky Colonel. He had handled a legal matter for the State of Kentucky in the New York courts, and when it was done, he got a certificate from the Governor naming him a Kentucky Colonel, which he hung in his office. I thought it was a nice touch.