Honorifics in America

Factual Questions
1

The recent thread on the use of “Esq.” and comments in there both snarky and not on such things as “Colonel” prompts me to ask:

In 21st Century America, what honorifics are commonly used with names in the U.S.? As I see it, there are three categories:
[ul][li]Titles proper, preceding a name, like “The Honorable Joseph Smith, Judge of the Superior Court”[/li][li]“Tails,” like Esq., M.D., Ph.D., P.E., which follow names and convey information on skill sets and professional status[/li][li]Salutations, like Colonel Sanders, Judge Smith, Doctor Kvack, Bishop O’Malley, Pastor Brown, that replace Mr./Ms/Mrs./Miss[/ul][/li]
I would imagine some usages are still very common, and some are becoming obsolete. Certainly an etiquette or style guide would give me the complete list, but I’m wondering what one is apt to encounter on a typical business/personal basis if one is not accustomed to hobnob with cardinals, judges in admiralty, ambassadors, legislators, and other Establishmentarians.

What would you consider a minimum knowledge for polite business/personal usage in an average community?

2

Aren’t Mr./Ms./Mrs./Miss themselves honorifics?

3

I wonder. The only place I see them used consistently these days is a) in the New York Times and Wall Street Journal and b) among college music students.

4

I had Quaker friends in college who wouldn’t use these terms.

5

Yes and in most K-12 schools, public & private, students are expected to use them when addressing faculty or staff. At some schools it may even by taboo for faculty to refer to eachother by their first names in front of students. Nurses are sometimes addressed as “Nurse X”. Mayors and judges are addressed as “Your Honor”. Elected and appointed officials are often addresed by Mr/Madam followed by their office eg Mr President, Madam Speaker, etc. Governors are simply “Governor X”.

6

Rev. (Reverend), as in Rev. Jesse James.

Jr. isn’t as common as it once was but it’s there.

What are you talking about? I don’t read the New York Times or Wall Street Journal and I don’t talk to college music students, but I hear all of the above mentioned honorifics all the time. Is this some strange joke?

Mayors? In this town, Mayor Jerry Sanders is referred to as Mayor Jerry Sanders. Then again, I haven’t actually watched any of his press conferences.

Members of both the House and the Senate are of course referred to as Sen. (Senator) whoever. “Retired” presidents are still referred to as President Whoever.

7

A list from Answer . com.

Wiki has some.

Jane Austen’s hononifics.

8

When my sister worked in a daycare center, the kids addressed the workers (mostly teenage girls) using “Miss” and the girl’s first name. ie, Miss Jenny or Miss Becky. She said it was really cute :slight_smile:

9

Actually, the Mayor of my town goes by ‘Moon’. His last name’s Mullen and we all call him that. He introduced himself to my six-year old yesterday that way.

And you might be surprised that there are some assigned honorifics for government offices.

Members of Congress (both houses) get to use ‘The Honorable’ in front of their names “The Honorable Jonathan Chance, Member of the House from Ohio” for example.

Also, Ambassadors, active or not, get to place ‘Amb.’ in front of their names if they so choose.

10

Foreign ambassadors (& American ambassadors overseas) are styled His/Her Excellency. As are some governors (Mass, VA, etc). Catholic bishops and archbishops are also excellencies, but it’s rarely used.

11

Military ranks give me no end to headaches. Sometimes, it’s not readily apparent to me (not having memorized stars and bars, or when they’re dressed in civvies) what rank I am talking to, if they’re a Major or Colonel or Lieutenant, for example. The papers that I get before talking to them will often just say “Officer,” and it’s a crap shoot to know what level. And some of them can be very touchy about being called by the proper rank. Granted, I understand where they’re coming from, that they have earned that rank, especially in the current atmosphere, likely through actual martial sacrifice.

And with the hassle are the abbreviations and how to expand them. LT is lieutenant. LTJG is lieutenant junior grade (but when addressing them, still call them lieutenant). LTC is lieutenant colonel, but be sure to address them as colonel.

12

The WSJ is notorious for using “Mr.” to refer to its subjects, where a paper like the Washington Post would just use a last name. This lends a certain air of distinction and class to the Journal. However, it seems very odd when they accord that honorific to someone who doesn’t really deserve that level of respect.

In an article in today’s Post, for example, the following sentence was used; each of the people mentioned was previously identified using their proper title or full name, but aftewards note that the two highest-ranking officials of the country are mentioned only by last name:

I’m not a WSJ subscriber so I can’t get an example, but I believe they have been known to refer to convicted felons as “Mr. Smith.”

I have no idea what the music school reference is all about. :confused:

13

I seem to remember **His Eminence ** John **Cardinal ** O’Connor.

14

Many years ago, I was dating a hairdresser.

Apparently it starts in beauty college, but they all referred to each other (to customers) as Miss (or Mr.) Firstname, as in “Miss Liz is ready for you now.” I understand this is pretty common in the Southern US. I know a friend of mine refers to his (still married) mother as Miss Firstname, as does his entire family.

15

Here’s what I think one might commonly encounter:

Before the name:

“The Honorable” (Hon.): all judges, elected officials (except for those elected to local boards or committees, like school boards, zoning boards, etc.), and very senior appointed officials (for example, cabinet secretaries). Judges are addressed as “Your Honor” (or sometimes “Judge”) in court, but no other official is addressed as such. Other officials may sometimes be addressed by title (Mr. President, Senator, Mr. Mayor, Madme Secretary, Governor) and sometimes by name. They also may be referred to by title (i.e. Mayor Bloomberg, Chief Justice Roberts). The general rule is “once honorable, always honorable”, so any official retains his or her “honorable” designation after leaving office, with possible exceptions for those leaving office in great disgrace (i.e. it isn’t The Honorable Inmate Number 239543).

Military/quasi-military ranks: Military members and those belonging public organizations arranged on quasi-military lines (e.g. police/fire departments) are given their rank title before their name (e.g. General Jones, Sergeant Smith, Inspector Green, Firefighter Brown) and addressed by title or abbreviated title (e.g. lieutenant colonel as colonel, deputy inspector as inspector).

Religious: “Father” for Catholic (and some Anglican) priests, “Monsignor”, “Bishop”, etc. for ranking clergy, and “Deacon”, “Brother” and “Sister” where appropriate. (I know that there are formal titles for Bishops, etc., but I strongly doubt that any Bishop would object to being called such by a non-Catholic or an ordinary parishoner.) Usually “Reverend” for Protestant ministers, though this may vary. “Rabbi” or “Cantor” for those Jewish clergy. I’m not sure about Moslem or other clergy, which can vary.

Medical/Adacemic: “Doctor” for medical professionals with doctoral degrees and some academics with doctoral degrees who wish to be referred to as such. “Professor” for professors (whether full, associate, or assistant) who wish to be referred to as such. Note that the title Doctor (or Dr.) is never used before a person’s name when that person’s academic degree is listed afterward (e.g. M.D., Ph.D., D.D.S.). Note that lawyers with a J.D. degree are not referred to as doctor unless they otherwise would qualify for the title (medical degree as well, etc.).

Everyone Else: Mr./Miss/Mrs./Ms., as appropriate, except that a person may be referred to by a specific title given by an organization (e.g. President, District Chairman, Vice Commodore, etc.) within the context of that organization.

After the name: (note that with any titles listed after the name, you omit Dr./Mr./Miss/Mrs., but retain other pre-name titles)

Academic degrees: Most commonly Ph.D., or a health care degree like M.D., D.D.S. M.S.W. (master of social work), etc., and sometimes M.B.A., but in academic situations, all degrees may be listed out.

Licensed Professionals (other than attorneys): Designation from state licensing agency: C.P.A., R.N., P.E. (professional engineer), R.A. (registered architect), etc.

Attorneys: Commonly given the honorific “Esq.” in the U.S. In some jurisdictions (not all) professionally referred to as Attorney John Jones.

Organization giving rank: When someone has a rank title before his or her name, one may abbreviate the organization in which that person holds the rank (and designate retired, if appropriate) after the name (e.g. Capt. Jane Jones, U.S.N. (Ret.), Inspector Samuel Smith, N.Y.P.D.)

Designations given by private organization: Many professional organizations give titles and designations with abbreviations that one may use professionally such as C.F.P. (certified financial planner). One would generally not need to know what these are except within one’s field.

16

And keep in mind that it’s completely-different for people outside the US.

Does that carry over then? Should you always refer to a foreigner by their foreign title, or by the domestic equivalent? For insitance, let’s say that mayors of cities in Canada are referred to as ‘Your Worship’ (I think this is the case). Would an American greeting a Canadian mayor in the States use ‘Your Worship’ or ‘Your Honor’?

17

I’d think the title would travel with them, so you’d refer to a Canadian mayor on U.S. soil as “Your Worship” (also the honorific of magistrates in the UK, if memory serves). To add to Billdo’s summary, magistrates in the U.S. are also entitled to the prefix “The Honorable.”

If the links provided upthread are insufficient, there are several books out there that go into honorifics and protocol in varying (and dizzying) degrees of detail. The various editions of Emily Post that are out there will get you through 99.99% of most social situations, though.

18

This construction is because bishops and cardinals follow the old rules for feudal peerships. IIRC, a bishop is considered equivalent to an earl/count, and a cardinal is equivalent to a duke. So in the same way as you might have a lord named “John, Earl Westchester”, or somesuch (a person named John, who happens to be the current Earl Westchester), you have “John, Cardinal O’Connor”. The only difference is that there’s no continuity of cardinals, so each one has his own title of nobility. There won’t be another Cardinal O’Connor; the next cardinal along would have his own title, made from his own name.

19

Most of the MSM has dropped the “John Cardinal Smith” format, and have gone to “Cardinal John Smith” instead, from what I’ve seen. I think the NYT did it with some hoopla a decade or so ago.

I always liked the name of the senior Filipino Catholic cleric, though: “Jaime Cardinal Sin.” :smiley: