So, I realize that this trilogy of X-men movies made over the last few years probably isn’t considered canon, and that there are doubtless thousands of incontinuities to be considered. However the third installment, X-Men The Last Stand, or whatever cheesy subtitle they put on it, raised an interesting question, at least for me.
The premise of the film is that the government develops a sort of “mutant cure” which “fixes” the mutant genes and thus takes away any powers the mutants have, essentially rendering them “normal” humans, yes? So, what would happen if Wolverine were to be struck by one of the cure-bearing darts? I mean, he would lose his regenerative capabilities of course, but would he then be unable to live with his skeleton basically encased in adamantium? Would he just die? Is he in a constant state of regeneration with his bones covered in this metal?
He is indeed in a constant state of regeneration, which allows him to survive having metal-coated bones, as well as heal the holes in his hands whenever he snikts. IIRC, his claws as well are in fact part of his mutation; when he’s had his adamantium removed at times, he still has his claws, though they’re left as just bone (and his regeneration ramps up, since it’s no longer continously running).
Would he die? Well, there’s the question. Would the cure affect him before his mutation stopped it working, or would he defeat the cure before it removed his mutation?
I’d guess it would depend on whether his immune system interpreted the “cure” as an injury or infection. Can Wolverine benefit from vaccines or other shots?
Don’t vaccines work by infecting you with a little bit of the disease in question? I’m sure they would work in Wolverine by prompting his body to make appropriate antibodies, but his mutation means a normal contraction of a disease would in effect be a vaccine.
How so? I’ve had vaccinations for polio, but that doesn’t really make me a superhuman. I think all it would do would be to stop Wolverine’s mutation from being affected by that particular form of tampering. I don’t think it would mean he’d keep his powers in any type of situation (for example, if Rogue touched him, and no I don’t mean like that).
He’s pretty much functionally immortal from what I understand anyway. Immune to all disease and injury, aging process slowed down pretty much to nothing. He’s well over 100 years old already.
In the animated series, there is a virus that Apocalypse creates to destroy the human race. Cable goes back in time to infect Wolverine with the virus because he figured that Wolverine’s healing factor would kick in and he could get the anti-bodies. It worked. I don’t know how much sway the tv show holds.
When he lost his mutant powers in some arc of the comics. (Don’t remember which one) he lost his keen sense of smell and I think super-vision as well. He became weak from adamantium poisoning. (I much preferred the storyline where he lost the adamantium.)
I have most of the comics so if you know of any storylines I can look that address this issue let me know.
Well, yeah, that was my point. It depends on whether the cure can beat his mutation or vice-versa. If the cure does have an affect before it’s totally destroyed, then certainly death is on the cards.
Edit; just remembered Professor X’s plan for how to defeat Wolverine should it become necessary. Wikipedia’s got it up, handily, because I couldn’t remember it exactly;
The two big questions on whether or not he could survive if he lost his healing is:
How much adamantium is on his bones? and
How biocompatible is it?
If it is as bio-inert as the types of metal that current implants are made out of (mostly either a titanium of cobalt-chrome alloy, a few are still 440 stainless steel,) then he won’t be suffering from his blood clotting and his immune system fighting the metal. However, if literally every surface of his bones his covered, then he will die, because people make new blood cells in the marrow of bones, and if the bones are all covered in metal, then the new cells can’t get into the blood stream. This wasn’t a problem for him when he could heal, because in theory all his blood cells could individually heal themselves. Of course, even then, one would think that he could lose enough to blood loss to need more, so let’s say the scientists did leave the blood vessels that go into the marrow intact.
So if his immune system won’t attack it, and he still has blood flow to his bones, then the big issue is how much there is, because even a lot of something that’s bio-inert will still cause problems. Small particulate matter will break off and accumulate in the joints and lymphatic system, inflammation can occur, etc…
Also, I seem to think that adamatium is very heavy, so I doubt he would even be able to move. So, pretty much, he would be on the ground, in lots of pain, and will die a fariyl slow, probably pretty painful, death.
The Handbook to the Marvel Universe (at least the first one and the follow-up series) explicitly tied his heightened senses to his healing factor. The explanation was that his healing factor continually repaired his sensory apparatus so that the normal degradation that comes with aging doesn’t happen to him. Which I guess means that all human infants have superhuman senses as well, at least in the Marvel Universe.
In X-Men 142 (I think) the “Days of Future Past” storyline, his flesh was completely vaporized by a Sentinel and the remaining adamantium skeleton was complete and recognizable as a human skeleton with claws. This was of course well before the notion that for example his claws were actual bone sheathed in metal and was an alternate future, so the reliability of the information currently is suspect.
His head would have to be severed, and removed utterly from the vicinity of his body to prevent swift flesh and nerve regrowth."
I don’t think this would work because when Wolverine was reduced to a skeleton, only his brain survived and he was still able to regenerate himself.
bouv, in the comics he is running around and fighting after his powers were removed. It is killing him slowly rather than quickly.
Here’s what can be done:
Magneto takes out the adamantium before the virus is given to Wolverine. If Wolverine beats it, they stick it back in. If he doesn’t, he lives a life as a normal man, albeit one with bone claws.
Or… have Rogue grab Wolverine long enough to absorb his power (in x-treme x-men no need for this step) and then give her the virus. There is a chance that it will just remove Wolverine’s ability but even if it does remove all of her powers I think she would miss it less than any other X-men (she seemed very happy without it in x-treme x-men).
As kimera points out, there’s actually a recent example of what it looks like; Wolverine reduced to a skeleton, something he survives (interestingly, his teeth are apparently coated, too). They’ve really ramped up his healing factor these days…
I suspect the whole “remove his head and keep it away from the body” thing is more to keep him pacified than to outright kill him. Ultimate Wolverine has survived being ripped in half by the Hulk, but he didn’t appear to start growing a whole new waist-down set. Can’t really judge Ultimate to normal, I guess, but it’s possible that both his head and his body would remain alive if he were decapitated.
I believe canon states that when they bonded adamantium to his skeleton, his healing factor combined the metal and bone into something of an alloy that made his bones unbreakable but also allowed new red blood cells to be made and released into the bloodstream. My impression is that they made up a vaguely plausible explanation long after the fact.
As for what the vaccine would do…given how quickly we’ve seen it work, I’m inclined to think that he would lose most, if not all, of his healing factor. However, would it make his claws fall out, since they are also a mutation?
The problem is that we can’t really go into an in-depth biological study of this when we don’t know how his powers work or how the vaccine works. Obviously a single ‘mutant gene’ is absurd, but how does the soi-disant cure actually operate?
This question has also been bothering me. How exactly is it possible for one vaccine to “cure” the same genes that give Wolverine his regenerating power, Jean her telepathy slash telekinesis, and Magneto his metallic manipulation, just to name a few?
I was thinking that perhaps it blocks the awareness of the power; instead of not being able to lift a car, you’re deeply convinced that you’ve lost the ability. This has the benefit (literarily speaking) of allowing stronger characters to will themselves into recovery, especially with the aid of a psychic, and leaving lesser ones out to dry. We saw that Magneto made that chess piece wobble at the end, so clearly this isn’t perfect.
In the real world, yes. Not in the Marvel Universe. Mutants are born with a specific genetic oddity, called the X-Factor, that gives them access to powers, without the necessity of being exposed to an external stimulus - gamma rays, irradiated spider, etc… It also allows for identification of mutants - separating them from mutates, Celestials, etc.
Going by the movie, I’d guess so, as it was distilled somehow from the little bald kid the military had locked up on Alcatraz. When Beast got to close to the kid’s anti-mutant field, his hair fell out. Seems to me that the vaccine would function similarly.
