Rental "clean up" question

I am moving (YEAH!).
When I gave my landlord my notice, he handed me a “new and improved” moving out checklist.
I still have the original one from when I moved in 4 years ago.

The new list is twice as long and almost twice as pricey ($3.00 for a lightbulb? $50.00 to clean windows?).

Also, the damage deposits are now $200.00 more than when I moved in.

Which list trumps?

Another question in this realm:
When I moved in NOTHING had been done. No painting, no carpet cleaning, NOTHING. All of this is recorded.

We are repainting (covering nail holes) and cleaning the carpet.

Can this work be used to offset what I know my landlord will nail me with (he has stated that since I have cats he will have to replace the carpet. The carpet was 20 years old to start with!)

BTW, I am in Minnesota.

Thanks!

You have a contract (the rental agreement). The checkout list is part of the contract, and the contract is binding as written. Make sure you state in writing that you are holding him to the original agreement.

I would say that you’re in the right (having just left a similar apt. situation). But really, it’s pretty much just who has the chutzpah to say they’re not budging. Lay it out in writing, as nametag said, that you’re going by the original rental contract. Document the repairs you have made, etc., and simply refuse to pay anything above the original amts. if he bills you.

If you haven’t paid additional damage deposits with each term of your lease (which is effectively a new contract) and likewise haven’t been supplied with new checkout list prices each time, then it’s your landlord’s problem, not yours. In my last apt., we had one month’s rent as a security deposit. So every year, when we renewed our lease (for 2% more rent each time, of course), we had to also pay the additional security (an additional 2%). If you’ve escaped this, your landlord screwed himself.

Alot depends on your state laws. Maybe Nolo.com (Nolo Press) has a Tenant book for your state? Your library might also have some of those books, they are easy reading. This all sounds pretty weird.

I’m a renter (and mover!) of long and storied experience, and I’m hoping to catch you, MissTake, before you get too deeply into the patching/painting/carpet cleaning gig.

STOP!!!

Unless your landlord is a congenital idiot, after four years he has to expect to 1) patch and paint the walls and 2) replace or at least thoroughly clean the carpet. In most states, the landlord/tenant laws spell out pretty clearly what consists of “normal wear and tear” over a year (or four) of occupancy, and the routine patching of nail-holes and repainting generally is accepted as the landlord’s responsibility or option after a year’s tenancy, and at no cost to you. It might be different if you, say, installed a wall safe, the removal of which leaves a window-sized chasm.

A few years back, I was forced to break a lease on a very nice apartment I had rented for nearly three years on Ohio’s “North Coast” (Lake Erie), and despite leaving behind a LOT of nailholes (from pictures and such), the only thing deducted from my deposit was an $80 charge for shampooing the (very nice) carpets. More recently, after a 14-month stay, I vacated a lakeside townhouse near Columbus after a routine but thorough cleaning, but no patching of walls or shampooing of carpets. This case, like yours, was well-documented at move-in time, in terms of pre-existing flaws and stains and problems. I very much enjoyed receiving that check for the full deposit refund.

It is difficult for me to imagine that any court in any state would uphold any “new and improved” move-out requirements that are handed to you at move-out time after four years of residence. I’m with toadspittle here – sounds like your landlord’s trying to up the ante in a cheap ‘n’ dirty way, and it’s up to you to hold him to the original agreement.

Thank you for the info, folks!

We are painting just to get it over with (and it is an activity that I actually like-go figure). I did have numerous mirrors in the living room with their accompanying large nailholes. I could be an ass and just paint that wall, but figure painting the whole place would be easier than washing the walls.

The carpeting? Well, he can kiss my ass if he thinks he is going to take the whole damage deposit because if having cats. The “new” clean up list specifies costs for pet damage. The old one doesn’t. So, we’ll steam clean (one cat did have an accident that did not come entirely out) and that will be that.

Again, THANKS!

On the cat thing, I had a male cat that sprayed and I mean to tell you that carpet will never be the same again. I am not sure the extent of your cat’s “accident”. But you can steam clean to your heart’s content but the landlord may reasonsably think carpet needs to be replaced. However, that does not mean he can charge you the full cost of the replacement. Depending on the laws in your area, he really should only be able to charge you the value of the remaining life of the carpet. If the carpet was literally 20 years old, then he has really no position to charge you at all for carpet damage.

I had a tenant with a dog who ruined the carpet in one bedroom (clawed a corner to shreds). The carpet was 8 years old, so I assumed a life of 10 years and charged her 1/5 the cost of the carpet, just in the one room. I am sure I was far more reasonable than other landlords would be, but I was also sure there was no way to challenge it.

The checkout list is not necessarily part of the contract, it depends on how everything was written. Is it labelled as at Attachment or an Exhibit to the lease? Or did he just happen to hand it to you at the same time you signed the lease? It may be mandated by law in your area for a checklist of be part of thelease, but it wasn’t when I was a landlord and I did not provide a checklist at all. The charges on such a checklist generally need to be reasonable and customary (remember, the charge for the light bulb is the cost of the bulb plus the labor to do it, although $3 is still too high). I charged a tenant actual expenses for things that I had to hire someone to do, plus a nominal $7.50 and hour for cleaning even though I did it myself (like cleaning the oven). Just because the landlord hands you a list of charges doesn’t mean you’re stuck, you can always challenge it, possibly offer to negotiate; going to court would be a last resort. There might be a tenant advocacy department of your county government that could help you with this with a phone call. However, if the charges are less than the deposit you stand to lose, the landlord has the upper hand.

Also, a tangent:

IANAL but I was a landlord, and a new term lease is not a new contract. A lease usually states that the term renews in teh absence of written notice a certain number of days before the end of the term, and allows for a rent increase up to some maximum each time it renews, or provides for month-to-month tenancy, or some such. But it is not a new contract. However, that is admittedly nitpickish since toadspittle’s point does not hinge on that.

A couple of questions.

  1. I paid my “security deposit” to the Miller & DeSatnik when I moved in. They later sold the building to C&S Enterprises. Who has my security deposit?

  2. I heard that in the city of L.A. landlords are required to pay interest on security deposits to the tenants. If true, who is supposed to may me? Miller &c. or C&S? If true, when was the law passed?

CWG: The accident was one cat urinating on the carpet in the back of a closet. LilMiss didn’t know she was in there and closed the door. IMO, not enough to snatch my entire deposit.

Johnny: Here in Mn, interest does accrue on all deposits. Also, when your building is purchased, ALL that goes with it is purchased, including your damage deposit. That occurred at the last place I rented and received my damage deposit from the new owner upon leaving.

In New York State the security deposit for an apartment in any building over six units must be placed in an interest bearing account. The landlord is entitled to only PART of that interest, the rest is yours.

IANAL, but I used to rent.