RO: Palestinian jailed for being Palestinian

[Damuri_Ajashi]

@Bryan_Ekers

If you know of someone in the middle east who is friendlier to U.S. interests, feel free to name them.

Turkey, maybe, though it’s on the edge of the region.

Or just go ahead and chortle, whatever.

Why do we need them again? It was one thing when we were supporting a nation besieged on all sides by enemies that had the will and (seemed to have the) ability to destroy it. Now it is a dominant regional military power that is oppressing a minority.

I know its not like we’re supporting Hussein’s Iraq or Noriega’s Panama but at least those relationships had the benefit of providing some short term global political gains. I don’t really know what purpose Israel serves in our global strategy.

I don’t think that this is a necessary precondition for supporting Israel but if you want to defend Israel its going to have to be something better than “its the best we can do in the region”

@newcomer

@Damuri_Ajashi

Perhaps there is more to this story but I would still like to hear about the particulars of the other cases where Jewish men went to jail under this law.

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You are correct that the Israeli judicial system is respectable in most instances but as you point out in the post below, the judicial system is not immune from the societal racism against Palestinians.

On a 1st point…

Before providing name of the Jewish man who was prosecuted based on this law let me just state that most legal experts agree that the purpose of the law was not meant to be used for these cases of minor lies in which there is no indication or a hint of coercion or other type of authoritarian pressure. And this is where a case of a Jewish man Zvi Sliman is perfect for illustration of a true purpose of this law. In 2008 Zvi was convicted for impersonating an official in the housing ministry and promising women help and benefits in exchange for sex. So, one can find this law useful and applicable when deception is used as a vehicle of psychological pressure in a given context.

When one examines the facts of this case and the key lie that this Palestinian man claimed to be Jewish, one cannot construe any reasonable basis for coercion or any other type of pressure that would “force” this woman to have sex with respect to her situation.

Which means, any analysis that simply insists that he lied, i.e. did not tell truth and that led to sex act is not sufficient. One has to prove, beyond reasonable doubt, that the lie was a intended as an element of coercion and not simply a dishonest reply to a woman’s sexual preference.

Well that’s what I meant. I didn’t know the particulars.

2nd point…

Is this the same juidical system which approved that relatives of the alleged terrorist are as guilty as the terrorist himself?

God, sometimes one can get a real good laugh here :rolleyes:

Like I said, I was mostly talking about their high court.

@FinnAgain

You can’t find one single post where I called you an anti-Semite. And you know it.

Of course you call me an anti-Semite. You call half the people who criticize Israel anti-Semite. You may not use the word anti-Semite all the time (or even any of the time) but you are still calling them anti-Semites. This is the nitpicky sort of shit that makes people :rolleyes: at you.

I’ve read people say that you used to be a thoughtful poster. WTF happened? What finally made you crack?

How does it feel to know that nobody takes you seriously anymore?

As for why your pattern of lying isn’t pointed out by others, I’d posit that it’s probably for the same reason that the world was up in arms over the war in Gaza and then when Lebanon used indiscriminate artillery fire on a Palestinian refugee camp nobody cared, or how every year we have memorials to Deir Yassin while nobody can quite manage to remember Hama, ever.

And what reason is that? Is the board bigoted against Israel or anti-semetic in a way that makes them keep quiet as I spread lie after vicious lie about Israel?

My cause is honesty and factuality.

If it is then you are camoflauging it as a crusade to defend Israel.

(Leave your admitted anti-Israel bigotry aside for a moment and try to answer it yourself). Why is “black people” not acceptable, but “Israel” is?

Because I am usually criticizing Israel for things that it has done not things that I believe they will do because they are Jews. I am against their policies and their practices, not their people.

Again, forget that it’s you saying it, and try to wonder how you’d react if I said the above. Would you be fine with it, or would you think that there was something wrong with being reflexively anti-Palestinian?

Its not happening in a vaccuum. Its you dude, you’re the reason that people are OK with it. If I had said any of that about Malthus after having a debate with Malthus, then I’d be the one getting shitted on in this thread but when I say that sort of shit about you, everybody just nods their heads and thinks “well SOMEONE had to say it”

Why is it that people routinely lionize people like Jimmy Carter

Nobel Peace Prize, only President to make and advance towards peace in the middle east. Shit like that.

Would the same people who lionize Jimmy Carter be totally fine with him if he flipped his tactics and applied them against the Palestinians instead? Why do people, by the tens of millions accept anti-Israel lies?

Maybe because they aren’t lies. They may overstate things sometimes but a lot of people honestly believe that there is racism against and oppression of Palestinians. If you want to dissect Jimmy Carter’s book, I am sure you can find things in there that are incorrect but you use language that assumes evil intent right out of the gate.

Can you approach this honestly?

I’d like to think so.

@FinnAgain

Let’s start with a real blatant example: was anybody actually jailed for being a Palestinian? No? then the OP was lying. Gee, that’s one bit of dishonesty I pointed out.

The reason people don’t think that was lying is because they read the actual post and while the OP could have titled this thread some other way, in the context of his post, its not the sort of thing that would cause most people to start their response with “So the OP starts by lying about the basic facts of the issue, this is good.”

You just throw that shit around without realizing that every time you use it in cases like that you undermine your own credibility.

@Cort

As of this moment, FinnAgain has used the word ‘bigot’ seventy one times in this thread, although I may have missed some. As a public service, here is a brief list of synonyms for ‘bigot’ which will hopefully make his posts a little less tiresome.

He uses that term so that he can claim that he never accused anyone of racism or anti-semitism I suppose.