Thanks for the suggestions. Maybe we ought to discuss abortion in another thread since it seems to be prompting its own discussion, and it annoys a lot of people. As to Obamacare, since I’m discussing it in a context of right-wing nuttery, my assumption is that there are several positions to the right of, “Shaddup, it’s the law” that can be discussed and the positions to the left of it (like single-payer, which I favor) all get lumped under “1” --I’d describe “5” as “Despite what the Supreme Court says, it’s unconstitutional, and Obama must be impeached over it.” There are more moderate ways of voicing opposition to it.
I posted this once and you didn’t respond. Let me state it again. You have ten categories and are asking people to rate themselves in relation to others. Therefore if a lot of people took the test and answered “correctly” as far as how they relate to others 30 would be the average. Most people would be around 30.
What you are saying is that in order to be worthy of speaking with you, people must share your views almost entirely because you are so extreme on one end of the scale.
If I were you I’d be disturbed by this. It might be worth giving some thought to your lack of open mindedness.
This is a scale measuring nuttiness. To score 30 is the margin of sanity, since I’m so extreme in the other direction. For one example, I’m a 1 (actually, a negative 6 or 7) on “The US as a Christian nation” but I can talk to someone who’s a 2, even though I’m offended by some of their positions on this issue, and I can sometimes learn from a 3, though a 3 will mostly be believe in certain principles that I hold in comtempt. But a 4 or 5? Total waste of time for me and for them. Might as well talk to an inanimate object.
You go ahead and be disturbed by whatever you choose, though. And don’t forget to have a super-nice day! And if you get the chance let me know what you think on these issues.
There is a lot more to determining whether someone is worth listening to than whether they’re on the edge or middle on an issue or whether they agree with you or not. I don’t care at all to listen to most people that agree with me, and even fewer of those that don’t. Most people have totally stupid reasons for their conclusions. Some that disagree completely with me have logical reasons for doing so that I want to hear. If someone just agrees with my position because they’re a democrat and support all things blue well then they’re a moron not worth talking to. (If they’ve just replaced democrat/republican with the think-tank manufactured sales pitches my conclusion about them is the same).
Debt ceiling : 3? We should control our debt, but we should not default on our obligations. Also inflation needs to be considered as well as economic conditions. I generally prefer cutting back on a lot of wasteful spending such as tax breaks for off-shoring and all non-defense military spending (The vast majority of it). I don’t support cutting any social safety net programs whatsoever unless its to curb inefficiencies like incentives to add unneeded tests, allowing monopoly prices for pharmaceutical companies ect, allowing food stamps to be spent on processed foods ect.
Immigration - 3, If someone has been here for 5 years mostly working they should be allowed to stay and become citizens. It’s our fault for allowing them to work without punishing employers to prevent that. As far as the rest goes we have plenty of poor people that need jobs and should cut immigration down to almost nil until we have close to full employment.
Taxes - 1, taxes should be designed to promote good behavior and reward hard work and risk-taking in real ways instead of the manner they do now which is to reward illusory risk-taking and illusory hard work. Or simply allowing large business to channel profits into a few hands far out of line with their contributions. Inheritance taxes should be at nearly 100%. Rewards for being born to this person or that person should be minimized. High taxes on unhealthy behavior should be used to offset general income taxes.
Gov’t spending 3, The government should be highly regulatory while allowing most things to be done by private organizations. They should ensure that companies do not profit by net negative activities and that workers have the ability to negotiate with employers while rewarding cooperative arrangements that do not encourage inefficiency (such as keeping jobs that have become obsolete due to technology to appease a union or not rewarding exceptional workers wit better benefits than mediocre ones.)
US as Christian country 1, The government and religion should be completely separate except where religion becomes a strong danger to children.
Abortion 2, The medical, economic, educational and social environment should be such that women rarely have to make a decision to have a baby or go without food/shelter/opportunity, rarely are unaware of their pregnancy after the first trimester, rarely unable to access birth control, and feel able to find a non-judgmental environment to have a baby to keep or give up for adoption if they choose to. If all that fails in those rare cases that a woman’s life is in danger or they slipped through the cracks somehow they should be able to get an abortion in any state up to the first trimester no question asked and up to the state after that except in the case of danger to the mother or certain major disabilities detected and then again it’s no questions asked. (It gets pretty complicated at 7-9 months so I’ll leave that unaddressable for now).
Obamacare 2, Should just be universal healthcare and teh protections for pharma profits should be gone but this system is better than not having people covered ect ect.
Birtherism -100000000000000, No one who takes this seriously should be taken seriously.
Racial equality/ civil rights -1000000000?, Not really sure how to approach this one, businesses should not be able to discriminate if voting is more difficult for one race over another systematically that should be stopped ect, affirmative action should just be based on economics and would still be doing what you want it to do.
English as official language of US 4, We should encourage more strongly multilingualism but every American with perhaps rare exception should know english, it’s just a good idea to all understand each other. Discouraging (in the tax code) ghetto formation and suburban isolation helps reduce this.
Dont think we disagree much here. Recognize that the extreme positions I find not worth engaging in, as in Birtherism, so do you. I disagree with people who score 30, but I’ll still talk to them. It’s just the irrational nuts I’d just as soon skip talking to…
Missed edit window. Not sure how to parse this: do you think that eliminating the minimum wage would benefit African Americans? Do you think that the portions of the Civil Rights Act mandating that businesses owners could not exercise judgment based on race should be excised?
I don’t think eliminating the minimum wage would help anyone but the rich, the small business owner would lose more to reduced purchasing power than he’d gain by being able to get a floor sweeper for 2 dollars an hour. As far as I understand from my friends and family that own businesses the racial discrimination on hiring is barely enforceable, only when all other factors other than race are the same or poorer for the unhired group systematically does it become a workable case in court, and that when I think it should be in any case. The burden of proof is very high I’m told.
Macb. Thou loosest labour
As easie may’st thou the intrenchant Ayre
With thy keene Sword impresse, as make me bleed:
Let fall thy blade on vulnerable Crests,
I beare a charmed Life, which must not yeeld
To one of woman borne
Macd. Dispaire thy Charme,
And let the Angell whom thou still hast seru’d
Tell thee, Macduffe was from his Mothers womb
Vntimely ript
OK, OK, I admit–there have been eight cases of uncertainty since we began monitoring human births closely, three of them fictional. I lied.
The larger point on this idiotic topic is that it really doesn’t matter to me, as it’s strictly a matter to be decided by woman and her doctor, and I don’t think many abortionists are going to perform a procedure on a 9-months pregnant woman, but if there are, and if the woman’s willing, so be it. None of my beeswax.
What if, due to shock, a baby were born prematurely? What about if a doctor knocked a woman out and performed an abortion on a nine month pregnant woman: would that be treated in the same way as an illicit appendicitis?
Also what about if an angel dancing on the head of a pin has an illicit abortion? You want to start a “what if…?” abortion thread? be my guest.
Yeah we probably have no need to ever talk to each other. I got a negative 54 and your positive 10 is just way too extreme for me.
Debt ceiling - a distraction from Gov’t spending issue. These should be combined. Middle here - 3?
Immigration - Need a path to legalization, simplified temporary worker system, eliminate the underground illegal economy, secure the borders. 3?
Taxes - should be periodically completely re-written. I have always liked Hall & Rabushka’s flat tax plan. I have no issue with taxing the rich, but don’t like the concept of something for nothing. You want more student loans? Everyone gets a .001% tax increase. Probably makes me a 4.
Gov’t spending - I would love to take a chainsaw to Federal spending, including and especially the military. Over cuts puts me at 4/5, but my desire to also cut military probably drops me to a 2/3
US as Christian country - we are a majority Christian nation, but we are open to all faiths (or lack thereof). I think that the drive to eliminate religion completely from the public square is a bad thing, but I don’t vote based on this. 2 would be my guess (1 is reserved for Hitchens, Dawkins and Der Trihs)
Abortion - I am pro choice up until a child is 18 years old. 0
Obamacare - Shit law trying to do a good thing. Solved little, devil in the details, waiting to see the impact. I want the right to purchase superior care than the minimum the government provides, and I should be able to combine my cash with the government care to do it. I think that makes me a right wing European. 3
Birtherism - If the Clintons couldn’t find anything, there ain’t nothing to find. 0
Racial equality/ civil rights - I believe in using SES as a measure, not race. Obama’s kids don’t deserve a hand up. At the same time, poor white trash could use some assistance. 4
English as official language of US - We need a single primary official language for the courts, voting and contracts. That language is English. After that, I don’t give a damn. 3?
I live with a large concentration of faculty, but I keep in touch with some trailer park friends in the Bible belt. My perspective of myself as a “3” might be a tad bit skewed.
Debt ceiling – 2 – only an issue if we fail to raise as we promised
Immigration – 1
Taxes – 2 – I could pay more in all honesty but as someone else upthread pointed out, living overseas puts me in a unique position
Gov’t spending – 3 – I think it’s actually not too much now but the funds incoming could be better allocated maybe?
US as Christian country – 1
Abortion – 2 – Not a 1 because I think there should be SOME sort of regulation of it
Obamacare – 1
Birtherism – 1
Racial equality/ civil rights – 2 getting better I hope …
English as official language of US – 2
Total 17
Is it possible to be lower than 10?
Maybe I’m an 11, really. I might be a 2 on one of these. I’m willing to be moderate on abortion. But I think I’m to the left of most Americans on all this stuff.