Run For the Hills! (Government Shutdown in Effect)

[Donald_Rump]

oops

[Siam_Sam]

BBC was just interviewing an ex-Bill Clinton aide, Sidney Blumenthal. He reckons this will kill any Republican chance at winning the presidency in 2016.

[BlinkingDuck]

@MsWhatsit

To be fair, if we didn’t have federal bureaucrats curating the place, it would have been paved over and turned into a Walmart by now.

Yea…thanks the heavens it is theirs!

[Donald_Rump]

@Debaser

Go ahead and post a cite from anyone dying from spoiled food or anything else during one of the other government shutdowns that happen quite regularly.

The truth is that most people get along just fine without the government guiding their every decision and watching over their every move.

Go ahead and post a cite from anyone who has had the government guide their every decision and watch over their every move.

[elucidator]

Anybody here posting from a Federal prison?

[Debaser]

@iiandyiiii

I think you’re wrong about this. Right now, because of the shutdown, my government customer is at home. That means some Navy submarines are not getting the technical documentation for new systems, which means they can’t train their crew on the new systems, which means they’re less effective and more likely to risk injury or death when operating the system.

I’d say that’s a proper role of government. And you’re ignoring the many, many other examples brought up in this thread.

I can’t be wrong about that, because my position is that I don’t know. That’s why I asked what Dinsdale did. Maybe it does have value. Many government jobs do. But many also don’t. Some are the proper role of government and some are not.

[Debaser]

@Donald_Rump

Go ahead and post a cite from anyone who has had the government guide their every decision and watch over their every move.

Post #62.

[Pashnish_Ewing]

@El_Kabong

Traffic was even worse than usual this morning. You’d think with at least a third of government employees staying home, you’d catch a break on the commute.

I blame Obamacare.

[Debaser]

@NotfooledbyW

If that is your obscure objective you need to argue its merit, convince people that you have a plan, run serious candidates focused on that plan and win control of the White House and a sixty seat majority in the Senate and keep the House. Once you accomplish that then begin to do whatever you want to get rid of Federal Employees and raise employment in the private sector.

But until you have proven yourself and can manage to do it the right way, stop attempting to achieve your objective by holding government employees hostage and threatening to blow up the full faith and credit of the USA to block a law that you could not block through the normal democratic process.

Listen to the people like Ted Cruz told you. 72% don’t want Republicans to shut the government down to block implementation of Obamacare.

Yes, this is a good point and you are probably right.

But you’re leaving out that Obama could end the shutdown immediately by allowing the defunding of Obamacare, so he’s not entirely without blame for this.

[NotfooledbyW]

@MsWhatsit

Leaving 28%. Remarkably close to the crazification factor, like I said.

I use as a baseline to determine crazy irrational responses to poll question. The baseline question is

Looking back do you think it was a mistake to send US troops to fight in Iraq?

42% say it was not a mistake.

That is a lot of irrational Americans.

March 18, 2013
On 10th Anniversary, 53% in U.S. See Iraq War as Mistake
Republicans most likely to say conflict was not a mistake
by Andrew Dugan

WASHINGTON, D.C. – Ten years have passed since the United States and its allies invaded Iraq, and it appears the majority of Americans consider this a regrettable anniversary. Fifty-three percent of Americans believe their country “made a mistake sending troops to fight in Iraq” and 42% say it was not a mistake.

[elucidator]

They may be saying it was not a “mistake” because they believe that it was deliberate.

[Czarcasm]

@Debaser

But you’re leaving out that Obama could end the shutdown immediately by allowing the defunding of Obamacare, so he’s not entirely without blame for this.

How about a reasonable tradeoff: Obama agrees to the 1 year delay…on condition that every single member of Congress agree to support it wholeheartedly when the year is up. Prove that a one year delay is just a reasonable request and not a free pass to do as much damage as possible during that break.

[Czarcasm]

@Debaser

But you’re leaving out that Obama could end the shutdown immediately by allowing the defunding of Obamacare, so he’s not entirely without blame for this.

You would advise him to pay the Danegeld?

[Lobohan]

@Debaser

Yes, this is a good point and you are probably right.

But you’re leaving out that Obama could end the shutdown immediately by allowing the defunding of Obamacare, so he’s not entirely without blame for this.

That’s a profoundly absurd point.

If you just let me take your car, it’s not stealing. :rolleyes:

[Dinsdale]

@Debaser

I can’t be wrong about that, because my position is that I don’t know. That’s why I asked what Dinsdale did. Maybe it does have value. Many government jobs do. But most also don’t. Some are the proper role of government and most are not.

Corrected that for you. You’re welcome.

[iiandyiiii]

@Debaser

But you’re leaving out that Obama could end the shutdown immediately by allowing the defunding of Obamacare, so he’s not entirely without blame for this.

And the parents of the kidnapped child could end the kidnapping immediately by agreeing to the kidnappers demands, so the parents aren’t entirely without blame for this…

Nope, doesn’t work there either.

[NotfooledbyW]

@Debaser

Yes, this is a good point and you are probably right.

But you’re leaving out that Obama could end the shutdown immediately by allowing the defunding of Obamacare, so he’s not entirely without blame for this.

Do you know the precedent it sets if one part of Congress can stop a law that has withstood constitutional scrutiny at the Supreme Court by issuing ultimatums under the threat of shutting the government down. A government that is operating under the laws and funding that that very same body has passed into law.

It is outrageous on the continuing resolution. It is terrorism, hijacking and piracy to do it over raising the dent ceiling.

This had to stop. The only way to try to stop the next one is not to negotiate with hijacker.

The debt cieling does not allow that be done, however the President I believe has special powers to take extreme measures on his own to protect the national security of The USA.

Preventing a deliberate crash of the economy and harming the nations credit has a real disastrous impact on America’s well being and security.
No negotiating with hijackers. Do what you have to do Mr President.

[Debaser]

@Czarcasm

How about a reasonable tradeoff: Obama agrees to the 1 year delay…on condition that every single member of Congress agree to support it wholeheartedly when the year is up. Prove that a one year delay is just a reasonable request and not a free pass to do as much damage as possible during that break.

Not reasonable. Why should they pledge to support something they disagree with?

How about this: Obama agrees to a one year delay on the condition that congress votes up or down on funding Obamacare again after the 2014 mid terms.

Obamacare passed, but just barely. It was a completely partisan vote and is now a very unpopular law. It’s not the usual blocking and tackling of government we’re talking about here. It’s a major change.

I see no problem with the Republicans fighting it any way they can.

Of course, as has been pointed out it should be up for a vote, and given the current situation I’m sure it wouldn’t pass again like it did the first time. Also, as has been pointed out it’s likely that the shutdown is a strategic blunder that will blow up in the GOPs faces.

[Ravenman]

@Debaser

But you’re leaving out that Obama could end the shutdown immediately by allowing the defunding of Obamacare, so he’s not entirely without blame for this.

The House has voted 42 times to cancel the ACA and failed. They Republican controlled House has approved 9 short term funding resolutions to keep the government running over the past two and a half years, and none of those had controversial policy provisions.

They can vote on a 10th uncontroversial funding bill and end the shutdown today. Republicans are the one who decided to change the game, not Obama. That means they deserve the blame for not doing once more what they have done nine times in the past two years.

[Debaser]

@Dinsdale

Corrected that for you. You’re welcome.

Edit that if you can! The mods won’t like it. But I won’t report you. No harm no foul! I can’t disagree with your correction.