Self-loader, or Bolt-action? Why?

In My Humble Opinion
41

I voted for the 3rd option, because my preference depends upon what I want to do with the rifle.

If I am hunting at long range I want to use a bolt action. There is a certain amount of ‘slop’ in the action of a self-loader. Some of the explosive power is used to work the action, expel the used cartridge and reload. This is power lost.

With a bolt action more of the propulsive power is focused on pushing the bullet out of the barrel. No further movement is needed until you decide to load the next round. This is why most long range ‘scoped’ type high power hunting rifles are bolt action. Less accuracy is lost by the mechanical cycling of the gun. I believe you will find that most sniper rifles used by the military are bolt action for this reason.

If you are hunting things in closer quarters a self-loader or lever action rifle is just fine. If you just want to have fun and fling a lot of ammo out, self-loaders are the tool. Shot guns are for duck hunters and I do not include them in the same discussion of rifles.

So, you should keep a variety of both kinds, small and large caliber, fast and slow, fun and business.

Or else it is like trying to become a great chef but all you have in the kitchen is one pan and a spoon. And trying to make that work for everything.

42

I voted #3 because I like them both (and lever action, too!)

That said, if I’m hunting large game like whitetail deer or elk I’m going to have a bolt gun with me. As ZonexandScout noted, there is a certain focus that comes with knowing that your first shot has to count. Same thing for when I used to shoot competitively, although now that I think about it, that focus might be a remnant of my training and practice from the old days.

Now you’ve got me in a chicken-egg quandary. Am I more focused because it’s a bolt-action, or does shooting a bolt-action trigger old muscle memory and habits? Maybe both?

I own a Win 94 carbine in .32 Winchester Special that is a family heirloom, purchased by my great-grandfather when he got home from WWII. Love that old girl.

43

As noted, they’ve fallen from favor. I own a few, but they’re in a distinct minority. Mostly, they’re pistol-caliber rifles these days, though yes, the 760/7600 rifles can come in any of the major calibers, and are serious game rifles. I’ve looked at few, and liked what I saw, but they fall outside my primary collecting scheme.

That said, I DO have an IMI Timberwolf in .44 Rem Magnum - And THAT is a go-getter for whitetail. Light, handy, and hard-hitting. I’ve got some low-mag glass on it, and at distances up to 150 yards, there’s nothing in North America but elk, moose, or bear that I wouldn’t try taking with it. It’s definately a favored rifle, if not at the same level, say, as my Swedish Mauser.

Oh, of course. I think that the only centerfire rifle type not represented somewhere in the collection is a single-shot, and (currently) a lever gun.

August West, I find myself in the same boat. I really learned how to shoot a rifle on a Ruger Ranch Rifle (Mini-14), but increasingly the Zen aspect is the big thing, and really, I don’t know if it was shooting a bolt gun lead to me discoving the Zen, or if the need for zen made me concentrate on the bolt gun.

Or, maybe it wa teaching my daughter to shoot - That might have opened me up to bolt guns.

Shrug. Dunno. But it is an interesting conversation… and it looks like a surprising (to me) percentage of people in this unscientific survey are in a similar place. :slight_smile:

44

Once upon a time I had a H&R Handy-Gun/Handy-Rifle that got way out of hand. In the end, between factory and aftermarket, I had two shotgun barrels for it, 5 centerfire rifle caliber barrels, and 4 “pistol”-caliber rifle barrels. I was like someone with a TC Contender who just couldn’t stop adding tubes to it. Some I regret getting rid of (the .45-70 actually shot exceptionally well) some I don’t. But I have avoided getting anything like that ever again.

45

I own a couple semi’s, a .22 and a.30 carbine but everything else is bolt action, even my freakish 20ga. Just feels “right” to me.

46

Probably wise to avoid that - It’s like some folks with their rifle accessories (or me, with German battle rifles*) - Always just one more thing…
Damn, ryan! You KNOW you’re hard-core when even your shotguns are bolt-action. Don’t hardly see those any more; not even on GunBroker.

*Just landed me a Gewehr '93, 7mm Mauser, and an 1890-manufacture Commission rifle (Gewehr '88)…

47

Now you just need a Chiang Kai-Shek Rifle, a Yugoslavian M48, one of the Turkish Enfausers (Lee-Enfields captured at Gallipoli and reconfigured to look like a Turkish Mauser)…

Or you could get into British rifles. :smiley:

48

I love my commission rifle; it loves PPU 200 grain. My shoulder isn’t entirely fond of either. :slight_smile:

My one other pride and joy though is the Carbine (Kar 88) version. The stock was refinished but other than that it functions well and is all matching.

49

The Yugo M-48, I have. And the Swedish M-38. The others… Hmmm. Maybe add a Peruvian Contract VZ-24… :smiley:

That’s likely next. Martinis and Metfords and Smellies, Oh, My! :smiley:

kopek; this one is in… Marginal… condition*. Going to need a visit to the gun doctor to make sure it’s good to go; hairline crack in the wrist, mis-matched bolt (Austrian markings, Turkish bolt) - But I have the orginal parts, too. Going to need to check the headspace, and generally give it a good going-over.
THEN we’ll see how much pain my shoulder wants to take. :smiley:
*Paid wall-hanger prices for it.

50

Don’t forget the Swedish M96!:smiley:

51

Never!

Also, got a line on some Chilean M1912s about to come on the market…
:cool:

52

A friend of mine picked up an FR-8 a few years ago - he often got some odd looks with it at the range!

53

Hah!
Yup, I own one as well - Looks like a Garand and an '03 Springfield had a bastard love-child. I’ll tell folks at the range that it’s a “Rare Bolt-action M-14” and more than a few will swallow the hook. :smiley:

54

Those were a topic of intense discussion on gun boards a decade or more ago when huge numbers of them were imported and sold for cheap. Much of the discussion centered around whether they were safe to fire with commercial .308 ammo. People whose opinion I trusted indicated that the rifles had originally been expected to handle the lower pressure 7.62 CETME round. Never heard of one actually letting go, but I do remember more than a few reports of sticky bolts. What do you feed yours?

55

Commercial .308 :smiley:

M1916 (small-ring, two-lug) Mausers are rechambered for .308 and swallow it just fine. Indeed, Classic Arms just sold off a large batch of them - The 1916 is an update of the '93 “Spanish Mauser”. The FR-7 is based off the M1916.

The G98 (large ring, three-lug) was designed to handle 8mm Mauser - Commercial .308 is just fine. The FR-8 is based on this rifle.

The original CETME (spanish) 7.62x51 cartridge had all the same external dimensions as the NATO round, but the bullet had a plastic core. Franco was still in power then, and none of the NATO countries was willing to share techincal data about loading, so they went and did their own ‘best guess’ thing. Later, Spain obtained the data, and tested theirr firearms (successfully) to the higher standard pressures. BUT - because there was the original ‘light’ cartirdige, and because the firearms world is full of self-appointed ‘experts,’ well, urban legends become accepted as fact. :stuck_out_tongue:

If you still have concerns, just use MilSurp Nato Ball - It’s cheap anyway, and will work just fine.

56

OK — since we’re sort of drifting Mauser anyway ----- one of my other favorite toys right now is a Mitchell’s Mausers “Tanker” model

OK – it is basically a fantasy gun more than an actual battle rifle. But its a ton of fun to shoot.

Although again my shoulder may have a different opinion from my brain

I got mine MIB way under list to I don’t hate myself for buying it.

57

If you’re going to build or buy a fantasy rifle, you could do a LOT worse. :slight_smile: Though yes, you may pay for it in bruises… :stuck_out_tongue: I recommend a good shooting jacket, or a slip-on recoil pad. :stuck_out_tongue:

58

This thread has served a useful purpose, as all the talk about Swedish Mausers led me to discover that one can purchase a Tikka T3 (one of my favorite hunting rifles) in 6.5x55mm (one of my favorite hunting calibers).

I already own a T3 in 30.06 and am trying to justify in my brain why I would need one in 6.5. The answer is that I probably don’t, but I might buy one anyway!

59

:slight_smile:

The 6.5x55 Swedish cartridge is an under-known wonder. High sectional-density combined with a generous propelling charge means high velocity, flat shooting, deep penetration, and modest recoil. It’ll take any game found in North America, and is an excellent distance-shooting caliber, if you’re into that kind of thing. I came to it VERY late (like in the last few months) and I’m a convert. .30-06 is a reliable heavy game taker, yeah, but the 6.5 can show it a thing or two. Having one of each means you’ve got ALL the bases covered. :smiley:

60

I’m not in the market for a centerfire bolt, but if I did get one in the future, it’d be 6.5. Aside from the T3 (it’s T3x now), the other major rifle is the CZ 550/557. Looks like Howa makes low production numbers, and you may be able to find a Remington, Winchester, or Ruger a couple years old if you’re lucky.

How does the 6.5 recoil compare to say, .243?