just have to let you SUV drivers know how false this is. you all make it a lot harder for us to drive safely–seems like the size issue is always compounded by tinted glass. we can’t see past you, and this is coming from somebody who drives like the proverbial little old lady–no tailgating happening in my car.
Jesus H; I ignored this thread for far too long, but it’s late and things have been on my mind for far too long.
I fucking hate SUVs. I fucking hate them with a passion. I hope every godforsaken bastard who willingly gets behind a wheel of one of them rolls over on a turn and dies a horrible flaming death, pounding on their window as they burn.
Yeah, I know I’m generalizing and being very hostile.
But it’s been four years, two weeks, and seven hours since my girlfriend and I were hit by an SUV and she died.
Goddamn maggot-sucking donkey-raping shit-eating SUV drivers. Pieces of decaying rat shit, they are. “Save my family’s life”, you fucking shit-for-brains. “I can afford it so don’t complain”, you slimy fucking son of a Dutch whore. (No offense to the Dutch.) Erin would still be alive if it weren’t for that oversized behemoth that you fucking love so much. I wouldn’t be bitter this time of the year, every year, if it weren’t for that fucking SUV four fucking years ago.
Seethe. Seethe. Seethe.
Y’know, in driving school, we’re taught to react to the objects on the road. If there’s a big car in front of you that prevents you to see around it - say, an 18-wheeler big rig, for example - you’re to slow down until you CAN see around it.
The whole “three car lengths” thing isn’t a requirement, you know. You can make it (gasp) four, or even (for the true rebel)… five!
Seems like you should be angy at the person driving the car, not the car itself.
Which brings up an interesting point… it’s always seemed as if few people who get an SUV know that you have to drive an SUV differently than a car. It’s big, it’s lumbering, it’s… well… big. But people, stupid people, idiot people, don’t adapt their driving style. Either they’re too accustomed to their station wagons or sporty lil’ Jags, but they don’t learn how to drive an SUV.
I haven’t read the entire thread yet, but I had to throw in.
I used to drive a Chevy Sprint Metro (Chevy sold the Sprint, which became the Sprint Metro, which became the Geo Metro). My dad and I had three of them. Now I drive a Jeep Cherokee. I used to own, and am currently in the market for, a '48 Willys CJ-2A. So I think I’m qualified to comment on the merits of each type.
FTR, my dad was critically injured (and died three years later) and his neighbour was killed when dad’s Sprint lost control in the rain and hit an abutment. A Metro is not the car you want to be in in a crash.
For Los Hideous, a Metro is a very capable car. It gets great mileage and has a surprising amount of room for its size. It handles very well, and accellerates nicely. It’s easy to park. It will go fast enough for the freeway (I twice drove from L.A. to Salt Lake City in a Sprint at 90mph and the car performed perfectly.)
But what about hills? There’s a long grade between near-sea-level L.A. and Lancaster in the high desert. It was impossible to maintain a reasonable speed in the Sprint. If I didn’t have to slow down for other cars, I could have made it with only a loss of five or ten mph and gotten to the top at 65mph. But any loss of speed would be difficult or impossible to regain. That was a pain in the arse.
I used to go skiing (I need to get back into it – it’s been about three years since the last time) in the local mountains. I had chains with me of course. It was snowing a lot for California. I was going to pull over and put the chains on as soon as I started sliding around or losing traction. I kept passing people who were putting on chains. Finally I made it to the top of the hill. I credit the Sprint’s light weight and front-wheel drive for getting me to the ski area without having to use chains.
There are more good things about the Sprint/Metro than there are bad. If you drive one, more power to you. (No pun intended.)
So now I drive a Jeep Cherokee. Even though it’s a “station wagon”-type SUV and not a “real” jeep-type (ala the CJ-series) I do take it off-road. I would not want to try this in a Metro. I also enjoy the occasional camping trip. It’s nice to have the cargo bay filled with gear and still have room for my friends and their dog. I shoot films and videos. I went to Las Vegas earlier this month with my light kit, two cameras, a grip bag, tripod, a couple of laptop computers, and clothes for two people for four days. And my friend’s luggage, as he was catching a plane home from McCarran. This would not have been a good trip for a Metro, based on the load alone. Add to that the long grade after Baker, and the Jeep makes sense.
But I don’t go off-road or climb grades or carry a lot of stuff every day. How can it be useful in city driving? I often drive when my co-workers and I go out for lunch. Five of us fit nicely. Parking? Maneuvering? The Cherokee is a “compact” SUV. I’ve found that when I park the tail-end of the Cherokee does not stick out as far as a sedan. Although it doesn’t handle as well as the Porsche 911 I used to have, the Jeep does well in traffic.
But here’s the difference between me and a lot of other SUV drivers: I’m a pilot. That means I’m full of myself. Pilots naturally believe they are better drivers than non-pilots. When I was training, the instructor beat it into my head that I must always “fly the airplane!” He also said, “Look outside!” and “Plan ahead!” These lessons transfer nicely to driving. That is, “Don’t daydream. Drive the car!” and “Be aware of traffic around you and your position in it!” Yeah, I’m one of those guys who actually realizes my head is mounted on a swivel. Believe it or not, I actually look before I change lanes. I use my rear-view and side-view mirrors. I move over when a motorcycle is trying to get by (even if it’s a Harley 
). I use my directional indicators.
The point is, it’s not the vehicle; it’s the driver.
Is it dumb for Maggie Soccer-Mom or Joey Bank-Teller to drive around in an SUV that will feel naught by asphalt under its treads? Probably. Would their load-carrying needs be served just as well or better by a mini-van? Probably. Would there be fewer collisions if they paid attention to driving and situaltional awareness instead of reading the paper or talking on the phone? Definitely. Do I need a Jeep (as opposed to a mini-van, pick-up truck or sedan)? Only when I go off-road or when I feel like going up to the snow.
IMO, the problem with SUVs is that too many are owned by people with poor driving skills. (And IMO, most drivers in this country have poor driving skills.) When you have a large, heavy vehicle your mistakes are amplified. I take pride in my driving skills, and I practice them every day. I drive an SUV, but please don’t lump me in with people who drive them like boneheads.
Okay, I’ve read most of the thread now.
As you may have guessed by other threads, I like Jeeps®. But I’m not a “brand-buyer”. I like to compare competing products. One of the things that “sold” me on a Cherokee was a report I read in a magazine. It said the Cherokee’s handling was the most like a truck of all of the current SUVs. Then engine is also truck-like. In my mind, an SUV is a truck, and it should behave like one.
FWIW, I rented a “Grand Vitara” when the Jeep was in the shop for a minor problem. (I’ve been told by mechanics who work on Jeeps that the engine and drivetrain are excellent, but that minor problems are a pain in the arse.) I saw the badge on the back of the rental that said “V6”. “Oh boy!” I thought, “I’m not stuck with an anemic Solara!” Wrong! It was amazing how little power the Vitara had. No accelleration, no torque.
The Cherokee (being a compact SUV) is not the most powerful truck on the roads. But I’ve hauled a 5,000 pound load with it and it did just fine.
I agree with all of your points Mr. L.A., except one. I do not feel it is necessary for me to justify my ownership of ANY fucking kind of vehicle to ANY-fucking-body. You don’t like SUV’s? Tough shit, assface. Who the fuck are you to make any judgements on me based on my god-damned VEHICLE! Jesus! You want to know why I drive an SUV? Fuck off, that’s why. Why do you drive a Neon? Why do you drive a Aerostar? Why do you ride your felching donkey to your therapy sessions? I don’t give a fuck.
I’ve never seen such small-minded claptrap in one thread in my life. I can not believe the vitriol aimed at a class of vehicles.
I used to drive a sporty little cavalier. It was pretty close to half the size of any SUV on the road. And you know what? I was an absolute dick. I cut people off, I sped like a bat outta hell,I rode people’s asses, and when pissed off, I’d make it a game to get back at them. I went as far as 10 miles out of my way on interstate one day to repeatedly switch in front of this lady and then slow down to a good 45 mph in a 65 zone. She had switched lanes without a turn signal.
Yeah, I was a bitch. But I’m also 18, and stupidity comes easily to me. I’ve seen plenty of SUV drivers who act mature and responsible, even more than most because they don’t want to kill themselves more than anyone else does. Two of my best friends used to drive their family Explorers, and they both drove awesome. So before you go dissin on the SUVs, just remember. It’s not the vehicle, it’s who’s driving it that counts
Uh… ChiefWahoo? I don’t think I said that I hate SUVs. That would be rather hypocritical of me, since I own one. Nor did I say that one must justify one’s ownership of one. I may have made it sound that way when I said, “The problem with SUVs…” My entire point was that there is a vehicle for every mission and a mission for every car. It’s the drivers that make whatever type unsafe. When people drive a vehicle that is much heavier than what they’re used to, their mistakes are amplified.
No, I don’t hate SUVs. I like SUVs. There are just so many bad drivers on the road that drive SUVs that the vehicles get a bad rap. And I think it’s a shame that so few are used for their intended purpose. If I didn’t like getting muddy every now and then, and if I didn’t have a need to carry stuff, I’d be driving a Honda. If you want to drive an SUV to the local market for a week’s worth of groceries, and you never intend to use it as a cargo hauler or off-road vehicle, that’s your choice. I have no problem with that.
But whatever you (not you, specifically, ChiefWahoo; but to anyone who operates a vehicle) choose to drive, be it a Cadillac Esplanade, a Geo Metro, or a bicycle, learn the-fuck how to operate it safely!
BTW: That’s MISTER Assface! 
This whole SUV thing is just another manifestation of John Kenneth Galbraith’s warning of “Public Squalor vs. Private Affluence.” The tax dollars you don’t spend to fill those potholes are well-spent on rugged vehicles that can stand up to potholes. What about those folks who can’t afford SUV’s? Hey, this is America - if you can’t afford something it’s your own godamned fault (that’s not true, but it’s The Great Utilitarian Lie of our nation). And what about those people whose social convictions oppose them to owning SUV’s? Like I said - this is America. Historicaly, social convictions don’t draw much water here until they can classify as witch-hunts; and I don’t anticipate SUV drivers in the 00’s being targeted like Japanese-Americans in the 40’s, Communists in the 50’s or accused child molesters in the 80’s. That being said, we Americans do have the right to be jackasses, and the majority of you SUV drivers do seem to cherish that right dearly.
I was afraid that would happen. Johnny only the first sentence was directed to you, the rest of my rant was directed at the sniveling flab-bags that get their rocks off by demonizing everything that they can. Please put a smiley and several spaces after the first sentence.
Oh, and to the rest of you. “felching donkey” is used in the sense of “the donkey that you felch.”
And, now that I’m somewhat calmed down, I saw an asshole SUV driver yesterday and it upset me that he was adding to the list of people who hate SUV’s. Here’s a note to a lot of you Escalade and Navigator drivers, that ain’t a car, and you can’t drive it like one.
Thanks, ChiefWahoo. (And also for not pointing out that I wrote “Esplanade” instead of “Escalade”.)
Only the majority of SUV drivers? I would say that the majority of drivers, period, seems to be a jackass.
I just came up with a theory about the supposed proliferation of SUV-driver assholicness, however… most people are self-centered, basically. When they’re driving, they’re only looking out for number one (that is, themselves). So when they’re in a small car, they’ve got a tad more paranoia about getting hit by someone else. Ergo, they’re more careful in the muchly-aforementioned Metro.
In an SUV, the danger to their lives from other drivers (real or imagined) is lessened to a great degree, so they’re not as aware of their surroundings when they drive.
Like I said, and like ol’ Chief said… don’t blame the SUV’s, blame the drivers.
Lemme tell y’all about the time my sis and BIL hit the moose.
They’d just moved to the Cariboo region of British Columbia. The boonies? Think “Northern Exposure”, except it’s not quaint. Makes South Park look like Paris in the 20’s. The snow starts about 3 weeks after the kids go back to school. It’s where they film SUV commercials.
Anyhow, they’d just moved there and were still driving the Hyundai Sonata. Late one night they were coming back from the nearest town that didn’t take pelts as currency when some bigassed moose moseyed onto the road. They hit Bullwinkle head on.
The carnage was hideous. Moose bits everywhere. They tried to salvage as much as they could for meat but nary enough for stew. (See, there’s a rotating list of people who will come scoop up the road kill for meat there when the victim is…umm… serviceable.)The humans? Sis got a bit of glass to the forehead and BIL cut his arm-the cop thinks it was from the antler. Both got bandaided up and went home.
Seems that by driving into the moose’s legs, rather than his torso, they were better able to knock him over, thus avoiding serious injury. The cop told them that when it’s moose vs. SUV or truck, too often it becomes irresistable force vs. immovable object and the vehicle occupants are squished.
Or they rollover the SUV swerving out of the way. Little known fact: if you hit a critter in the road in BC, it’s not treated as driver at fault for insurance purposes. If you wreck the car swerving out of the way however, they figure you’re lying like some drunken dawg and don’t cover the damages. Fuck Greenpeace and gun it I guess.
I always think about Bullwinkle when I hear people say “if we weren’t in the SUV/F250/armored car we would’ve been killed for sure…” Now, lemme tell you about the time I was rearended by the 18 wheeler in my 72 Toyota Corrola…
I know I’m not saying anything new, but I freakin’ hate SUV’s. People who drive them are (generally) assholes.
They tailgate me when they’re behind me, and they block my view when they’re in front of me (even if I’m FAR back).
They think they’re invincible - today on the NJTPK there was a 35 mph speed limit (‘cause of the snow) And some freakin’ Ford Explorer blows by me at 70.
And yeah, I know they’re not all bad, but a certain kind of person drives them - usually a macho asshole or the female equivalent.
Gather ‘round, everyone! Auntie Annie’s tellin’ a story!
Oh, nevermind… now Father John’s talkin’.
WOW! This is still around. Is there some kind of award for a thread surviving this long?
stuffinb, I was surprised to see it too. You definately get a prize!
fatherjohn,I know I’m not saying anything new, but I freakin’ hate posters who don’t have anything to add and just call groups of people assholes (PWDHATAAJCGOPA). PWDHATAAJCGOPA are (generally) assholes themselves.
They irritate me when they’re behind me, and they block my view when they’re in front of me (even if I’m FAR back).
They think they’re invincible - today on the SDMB there was such a post.
And yeah, I know they’re not all bad, but a certain kind of person does this - usually a macho asshole or the female equivalent.
We have dorks down here who drive SUV’s also. And then there’s my cousin who’s a hard core off-roader with several weeks worth of intensive driving courses behind him.
Here, SUV’s are refered to as ‘Moas’, because they’re rarely seen in the bush.
That being said, as soon as I can, I want to get my family a 1971 Regal (think 'Cuda with 4 doors) in order to be safe from the fuckwits in the little cars. At the moment I keep us fairly safe because my '79 Galant has tires worth 4 times as much as the rest of the car. However, the little fuckwits in their worked Preludes, and DOHC turbo 323’s (not that the drivers usually did the work themselves, of course) constantly give me the shits coming out of corners towards me while only just in control of their vehicles. I want a car with a 265 hemi, and the bodywork to match, so I can laugh as the fuckwits bounce off and slam into a nearby powerpole at 120 kph.
FWIW, before I owned it, someone slammed a Toyota Celica into the back of my first Regal. The driver of the Regal didn’t know it had happened 'til someone knocked on his window. There was about 12 inches left between the bumper and the windscreen of the Celica. There was a dent the size of a quarter on the back bumper of the Regal.
Um…I smell envy…of the SUV owner.
And…I sense some folks are bitter over the younger dudes with sporty little cars…because…well they’re.
What are you driving? Are you all driving the perfect fucking automobile at the perect fucking speed, using it for it’s perfect fucking purpose in the enviromentally perfect fucking way?
Here’s a big Fuck You to all the people who don’t like what the other guy is driving. You’re all so perfect. Frankly, I don’t give a rat’s ass what you drive.
Why aren’t there threads popping up from SUV owners bitter over the little Honda Civiv owners who dart in and out of traffic. Why? Because SUV owners don’t give a fuck like car owners give a fuck about SUV owners.
There are assholes everywhere, some in cars, some in SUVs, but it’s the resentment of the SUV owner that stirs the emotion.
Little car owners, you’re right - You’re not less of a man and your penis isn’t smaller because you don’t drive that big SUV. But you are pathetic when you are obviously bitter and insecure enough to trash SUV owners and owners of other vehicles you elected not to own.
Here’s a big Fuck You to all you insecure people.
Thanks- I’ll think of you while I’m burning alive. Anyway, I’m terribly sorry for your loss, I really am. I drive an SUV because I live in upstate, NY where we get more goddamned snow then you can shake a stick at. I literally could not get around in the winter without one. (I’ve tried- it doesn’t work where I live). I hopefully won’t be rolling over and burning up in one any time soon, as I’m a careful driver no matter if I’m in a car, SUV or on a motorcycle. I’ll gladly sell it and drive a VW bug if you’ll pay my lost wages for the winter months (Nov-March, usually). I won’t be going far without 4 wheel drive.
I personally am sick to death of the “selfish SUV owner” arguement. It might go over in areas where there is no snow and no one carrys any cargo (music equipment, camping gear, etc), but it doesn’t hold water here in NY. We drive big assed trucks and SUVs, and that’s the way it’s going to stay. Most of us have gotten quite fond of having an entire winter where we get home safely every day, rather then getting stuck in ditches and snowdrifts and walking the rest of the way home or hoping some nice person stops and helps. I know I’m a big fan of it, myself.
Zette