Sentencing $30 or 30 days - Has the monetary amount always seemed insignificant?

Factual Questions
1

Sometimes I think that it must be just a matter of inflation.
You know, that the first sentencing law, say for public drunkenness, was made $30 or 30 days back when $30 was equal to today’s $1,000.

But we have new laws enacted all the time and the same odd ratios seem to be used.

Like today,
“SACRAMENTO — Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger added the bedroom Tuesday to the list of places where it is illegal to film or photograph someone without their knowledge… Violators face punishment of up to a year in county jail, a $1,000 fine or both.”

The fine pales against even a modest defense bill. Probably less than the bail on a crime with a year’s sentence.

What were the proportions in prior years? Say the 30’s or even the 50’s?

2

Defendant, holding out hand, “Yer honor, I’ll take the $30.”

3

The actual fine isn’t what determines whether someone should challenge something in court.

Someone charged with DUI for instance may be willing to pay even the maximum fine. But, since there are other legal headaches involved, they will usually hire an attorney and go to court. License suspension, AA meetings, community service, higher insurance rates, ignition interlock devices just to name a few.

Plus, the criminal conviction itself of anything more serious than a traffic ticket means you’ll have a conviction on your record. This type of information shows up in employer’s background checks and is a serious drawback when trying to get a new job.

The fine doesn’t include court costs which usually double the amount of the fine.

Also, if the fine is $500 or 30 days in jail, there is always that chance that the judge will impose some of the jail time. Many people who might be convicted of a “peeping tom” type of crime are not likely to have any experience with the justice system. Even a minor 3 day jail stay would be quite traumatic.

The person convicted of such a crime may also have to register as a sex offender.

So, there are many reasons people incure expensive legal bills rather than pay a relatively small fine.

4

The question is one of ratios over time.

5

Minor nitpick: I don’t think $30 was ever worth quite as much as $1000 in today’s money. As a very rough rule of thumb, one can recall that during the days of true gold standard currency, before 1933, an ounce of gold was pegged at just about $20. So $30 would have been like an ounce and a half of gold–at today’s price, about $614.

Admittedly, still a stiff fine, though.

6

That’s all too true. Court costs are a sneaky way for the government to, in effect, impose a tax on the criminals as well as the fine. “Court costs” don’t just refer to the cost of the court’s electric bill, paper clip expenses and jurors’ fees, but often may also include amounts for “DARE programs”, “driver education funds”, “new court construction funds”, or “victims aid funds”, etc. I’m not saying that the court doesn’t need a new building, and I’m for drivers education and victim aid, but I think these costs should be paid by all the taxpayers and not just those who happen to get caught speeding.

7

As others have pointed out, the defendant isn’t the one making the decision about which penalty is imposed. Call me cynical, but I wouldn’t be surprised if when a “upstanding member of the community” with his family lawyer gets brought before a judge for a DWI, the penalty is a lot more likely to be the $600 fine rather than the six months in jail. A “suspicious type” being represented by the public defender is more likely to get a trip to the county jail.

8

Spectre of Pithecanthropus:

Probably depends on what you’re using for an index.

When I was a kid, comic books came in two main sizes: regular issues and special “80 page giant” editions. The regular issues cost 10¢ and I believe the same size comics nowadays retail for about $3, and that’s almost the same markup as $30 to $1000: factor of 30, give or take.

Mainstream cars had sticker prices in the mid-to-upper $2000’s and haven’t gone up quite as much (comparable cars seem to go for $35K to $50K).

Letters took a nickel stamp and now cost, what, 37¢? Less markup there, just a factor of a bit more than 7.

Soda has gone from a dime to a buck for a can. Factor of ten.

Don’t know cigarette prices from my childhood but in high school they sold for 50¢ a pack and now it looks like they cost around $7. Factor of 14 over a shorter period of time.

Pay phones, to the extent they still exist, take a quarter now, took a dime when I was a kid. Factor of a mere 2.5 there.

Then of course there’s the computer. I have no idea how much it would’ve cost to buy a computer in the early 1960s but jumping ahead to the 80s, a high-end Mac (the IIfx) ran for a bit over $10,000 and a new dual 2.5 GHz G5 can be yours nowadays for $3000, so a factor of 0.3 over a shorter period of time.

I don’t know general prices from the 1930s or 1890s, but I do know that single pieces of candy of the sort that will cost you a quarter apiece in the deli nowadays went about a half-dozen or more of them for a penny (factor of around 150); and the Ford Model T was a $500 car, yes? Factor of 100.

9

Actually, the defendant often does have a choice of sentences. The sentence in the majority of cases is worked out prior to pleading between the DA and the defense attorney; in most jurisdictions the judge doesn’t have to follow the plea agreement, but will let you change your plea if he/she doesn’t, which he/she almost always does. Usually when I’m getting an offer from a district attorney, we’ll ask for an either/or offer. The offer for a misdemeanor will often look like:

"$500 fine/court costs/6 months probated 1 year/40 hours community service

or

$200 fine/court costs/15 days in jail."

The DA will generally give an either/or offer unless they see a reason not to, like a history of priors for the same offense or not having sucessfully completed probation in the past. Usually the primary consideration in giving a better deal isn’t ones standing in the community, but whether a better deal will make a potentially troublesome case go away. Most DA’s make it a point of honor to treat Mayor Brown and Joe Shadycharacter the same, except where Shadycharacter may have a history of priors that merits a stiffer sentence.

Generally the deal isn’t an either/or between a fine or jail time, it’s between probation or jail time, withe a fine assumed either way. Sometimes in the case of an indigent defendant the DA will go ahead and waive the fine altogether, but generally you’re going to be paying a fine in addition to whatever other punishment you receive.

10

My father, in the late 1920s, worked in mines for $5.00 a day, which was decent money then (a day being from ‘kin to kaint’, is from when you first kin see outdoors, to when you kain’t see). A poorly paid job might pay $1.00 per day; or jobs in prior years, when this phrase may have gained currency (WAG) might pay $1.00 a day.

So you would spend a month’s time or a month’s income for your violation (order of magnitude, anyway).

[/speculation]

11

How the hell does this work?If someone photographs me without my knowledge, how do I then report them?Or is someone else loitering outside to see whether or not I take pictures and then if I do,ask my subject on the way out whether they knew about it?
Or should that be ‘without their consent’?

12

Computers have been steadily (and rapidly) deprecating ever since their invention. The cost/value ratio is fractional, with computer resources becoming less and less expensive and more and more valuable. It’s now so cheap to buy ludicrously overpowered computers that nobody will sell computers that only do what the buyer needs.

I suppose my point is that using computers as a judge of inflation is a bad idea.

13

Sure, of course you’d think that, with a name like zamboniracer.

:smiley:

14

Well, it’s the act of taking the photograph which was without my knowledge, not the knowledge of it. So if I discover you taking photos or someone else finds you taking photos or if you develop the photos and they are found and I was not informed, then the law is applied.

15

That’s right. Next year Speedvision TV will be showing NASCAR, Indy car racing and zamboniracing!