I’ve just returned from my second school trip (8th graders) to NYC, and we stayed a block away from Times Square.
The first trip was in 2008. I remember looking up Times Square to see when it had been “cleaned up.” I was surprised to see that it happened in the mid 90s. I thought it had started much earlier than that.
What was it like before? In each decade? And how did wealthy patrons of the arts go to plays on Broadway when it was at its seediest?
I noticed HUGE changes between 2008 and 2010, so I can imagine what someone who has grown up in NYC must notice. In 2008, there were a lot of “tourist” stores…selling t-shirts and other NYC crap. Now? It’s almost exclusively boutique name-brand stores, selling popular candy and clothing.
People complain about the “Disneyfication” of NYC. I dunno. I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, I can imagine the seedier Times Square and the excitement that went along with the danger of it. Now? The place repulses me. Yeah, it’s nice to be able to walk around with a camera, and with all the LCD screens it’s certainly bright enough to take pictures to prove that we were there. I’m just not a fan of tourist traps in general, not out of snobbishness but out of personal preference.
I don’t like crime, and Manhattan sure seems really safe now. What was “unsafe”? I don’t know. I was never there before. NYC was so famous for rudeness and crime. Rudeness? It’s one of the friendliest places I’ve ever been. The most wonderful moments for me were chatting up locals.
I sure love the place, either way. So much of it is an experience, and one cannot deny the cultural, political, financial, etc. relevance. It truly is one-of-a-kind.
(BTW…stay away from The Addams Family musical. Holy shit it’s bad.)
I was there for a week in the spring of '86. Lots of porn stores, hookers, and drugs. I went down to a the corner to get a paper about 8:00 am on a weekday morning. In the space of half a block, I was approached by 3 hookers, and 2 people tried to sell me drugs. Didn’t see or experience any violent crime.
On New Year’s Eve of 1971, I ran away from home in Maryland at 14, hitchhiked to New York City, and got drunk for the first time in Times Square. I only specifically remember being asked for my draft card as proof of age in one bar; I remember very little else of that evening.
Sometime about 1978, I got ripped off trying to buy a couple of joints.
I recall no muggings or violence. I’d be the first to say that perhaps I was just lucky, as I spent the bulk of my 10 years bumming around two countries without, in general, muggings or violence.
Starting when I was in high school in the late 1960s, we used to go down there (from the Bronx) to look around and get a bit of a thrill. Lots of porn stores on the main drags and general seediness and trash all around; lots of guys trying to peddle weed. As I recall the hookers were mostly a block or two west of the Square itself. I don’t recall feeling that Times Square itself was particularly dangerous, because there were usually lots of people around.
Even though I can be a fan of sleazy, I don’t mind that the place has been cleaned up. As a New Yorker, I felt it was a bit of a disgrace that one of the most famous places in the world was such a shithole. You can still find sleazy in New York; it just doesn’t have to be be featured on Times Square itself (and I think it’s better if you have to go look for it). Maybe it’s a bit Disneyfied, but in my book that’s better than having it crappy.
My first and only visit to Times Square was in the mid eighties.
I recall seeing prostitutes, porn stores, and live sex shows in the back or upstairs areas of the porn stores.
The fee to go upstairs for the sex show was $10.
Did not experience any crime or other problems.
I don’t think I’ve ever been to Times Square. I’ve only been to NYC twice (shame, since I live in Boston).
The first time was in 1980, and I found it to be overwhelming and scary, yet thrilling. Broadway stunk. (The show was great, but the street itself had an odd odor.) At the time I was a country boy, so cities were alien to me.
The second time was two weeks ago. The people were friendly but the weather sucked.
I didn’t notice any change between 2008 and 2010 to be honest. There’s still a lot of touristy crap. And there’s been a lot of chain type stores for a while.
The first time I visited the US was in 1993, and the first city I spent the night in was NYC, in a cheap hotel near Times Square. It was somewhat sleazy, but (once I got used to the big city feel*) was pretty safe. From what I’ve heard, the clean-up of crime in NYC was shortly before then, in the early 90s.
Yes, I’ve lived in big cities, including 9 months in London, but Manhattan has more of a big-city feel even than London does, to me at least.
Honestly I haven’t noticed any major changes between 2008 and 2010 other than the new TKTS booth and the new pedestrian areas. Virgin closed and American Eagle opened but all the other stores seem the same. There’s still all those T-shirt/electronics/touristy shops.
My first visit in '99, we stayed on 45th Street, in a hostel just off the Square. We had a fantastic time and NYC seemed really friendly and welcoming.
The second visit was in August '01, I was on my own and arrived at 3am at the Port Authority. I had 12hrs to kill until I could check in to my seedy hostel. Walking around the area, 47th Street, west of the Square I was propositioned by a couple of prostitutes but most people about at that time seemed to be delivery people and maintainance workers. Being there at 4am or later I was able to see Times Square with the lights off which was great, different from expectation. I wondered around the city for hours and it being a bright clear August morning the sky started brightening while I could still see stars. It was magical.
I’ve never felt safer in a big city as I do in NYC. The biggest nuisance is the long hard luck story panhandlers but I never felt threatened by any of them.
I recall in '99 that gentrification was an issue. Somebody told me about Alphabet City that you used to go down there to score crack but now you’d go to score brie.
In the late eighties, early nineties, I worked in an office building that was located on 42 between 7th & 8th (this block was sometimes referred to as “the deuce”). This company did not want an address on 42 st, so they used the address and entrance on 41 st. At that time 41 st was basically the toilet for 42 st. Two or three times a week I would come across someone urinating near our door. Good times. Subsequently I got a job up near Rockefeller Center and moved to New Jersey, so I would walk every day through Times Square. I wish I had carried a camera and kept a journal because I saw the transformation. I am not really a fan of the new Times Square, but it was fun to watch it change.
In the 60’s I would visit Times Square for the pinball parlors. Once, in the early seventies I was there with a bunch of friends and we went to a “peepshow” where you would watch live naked women. Basically it was a room surrounded by a wall of small, booth-like rooms. When you put a quarter in, a shade would roll up for a set amount of time and you could see the women posing in the middle. You could also see other people’s faces in the other windows and there, right across from me was my little brother, waving at me and laughing his ass off.
I remember walking from the Port Authority to my office near Grand Central and telling a Greenpeace volunteer to go fuck himself for being a smartass.
I also recall starting a new job in 2001 and then having a skyscraper fall on my office the next day (fortunately I wasn’t in it at the time).
The major change I’ve noticed in Times Square in the past few years are the pedestrian parks they placed up and down Broadway. It actually does help get around on foot a bit easier since everyone isn’t crammed onto the sidewalks.
IMHO gentrification is only an “issue” if you are a crackhead and need to score crack. The only people I know who miss the “character” of old St Marks st with it’s heroine addicts and sleazy bars and tatoo shops are middle-aged family guys who live in the suburbs who haven’t been there since they were a teenager in the early 80s. No one wants to see that shit if you actually live down there.
I probably first saw Times Square in the mid-70s, and the current nonsleazy aspect of it today still catches me by surprise sometimes. There are some great images on this page which really take me back.
I never partook in the sleaze, so I’m not that sentimental about it being pushed to the margins, but I will say that it’s too bad that the Times Square Howard Johnson’s restaurant closed because it was one of the top 5 places in the world where you felt like you were in a Tom Waits song from the 70s.
In the late 80s/early 90s, the first establishment that you would see when exiting the Port Authority and walking down 42nd Street has a big banner than said something like: “LIVE NUDE GIRLS – WORKING THEIR WAY THROUGH COLLEGE.” Which always made me laugh. Like, you don’t want to get a lap dance from a gal who won’t understand your subtle references to Foucault’s history of sex and the male gaze while she’s grinding her pelvis on you.
Those were also the days when the hookers were out in force and you’d get propositioned all the time, especially when sitting in traffic trying to get through the tunnels.
I probably visited there first in the 1960s, when the building on the square was the Allied Chemical Building. There also was a newsstand where you could buy any newspaper in the world (supposedly). I remember picking up a French-English dictionary there. More movie theaters then there are now, often blaring out trailers (for some reason, I got stuck watching one for The End of the Road with James Earl Jones.
I stopped going around 1970, and didn’t go back there until 1996. Lots of “All Nude Women” places. It was a kind of cheerful sleeze, though – it didn’t seem dangerous, but certainly not a place to bring the kids. No hookers propositioned me.
I was actually there last weekend. Had a great time*. The big change I noticed is that there were few actual stores in the area – just restaurants and theaters (plus a few rip-off electronics places). It struck me that it used to have more real businesses in the 60s. The only things that were the same from my youth were the army recruiting station and the police station.Now it’s much nicer and cleaner (though not what I would call “clean”). I liked that they closed that portion of Broadway and set out tables and chairs (my wife was able to sit while I explored). Overall, a great improvement from the last time. I didn’t mind the sleeze, but I wouldn’t glorify it.
*Got to see Tony Shalhoub, Anthony LaPaglia, and Justin Bartha in Lend Me a Tenor for only $26 for 2nd row seats. Very funny play, and Shalhoub was hilarious.
