This sort of reminds me of this study: The “Reasonable” Way to Respond to Being Sexually Harassed - Behavioral Scientist
People don’t react the way they think they will.
And again, not making excuses, I’m saying that if we expect cops to always respond according to how they were trained, we are naive - or have entered Robocop world.
He’s not the only reason and I don’t think anyone is claiming that. It’s just the latest in a long line of failures from the FBI to the police, who were warned multiple times this kid has serious problems and they failed to act.
The article says, “‘He believed he did a good job calling in the location, setting up the perimeter and calling in the description (of Cruz),’ said the union official, Jim Bell.”
Given that schools have active shooter drills, I assume that his training covered the possibility of exactly this sort of thing occurring. So what was he taught in this training? Was it to establish a perimeter, call in the location and provide a description of the suspect or suspects? If so, I suppose we can’t fault him. I know that some on this board are in law enforcement. Perhaps they can tell us what police officers and sheriff’s deputies assigned to schools are instructed to do in their area.
As a resource officer, Peterson took a call in 2016 about Cruz being a potential danger.
I’m not saying that Peterson could have pre-empted all of this on his own two years ago. As has been stated, there was a breakdown all around, and no one bears full responsibility, except for Nikolas Cruz, of course.
PK covered it pretty well in post 18.
At this point we don’t know what the policies of the department are. We don’t know what training they do. Tactics and strategy are not covered by statute so there isn’t one universal method.
So speaking in generalities… As was mentioned there was a shift in thought after Columbine. After action reviews of the incident showed that there were armed police officers outside while the shooting was still happening. That was what they were trained to do at the time. Cordon off the area and maintain a perimeter until tactical units could arrive. Those units are usually either far away or made up of officers that are on other duties.
After Columbine most went to a first arrived first in approach. When you get there if back up is a few seconds behind you can go in together. If it’s only you then in you go. Head towards the sound of the guns. Ignore the wounded and the dead and go after the shooter. Bypass rooms that aren’t active. Disrupt him anyway you can. Often when their plan gets messed up or they are confronted they end it themselves.
That’s for an active shooter. That’s not a euphemism. It means the shooter is actively shooting. Things get more difficult if there is no sounds of gunfire. There is no place to advance to. The shooter can be anywhere. That’s when you go in as teams and start the tedious and dangerous job of clearing each room one by one.
Its unclear he could have done anything two years ago. Or any time since. We can’t lock people up because they MIGHT be dangerous.
After one of the school shootings there was a heartrending piece by a mother of a middle schooler who was a sociopath. She KNEW it could be her kid, and she was trying like anything to get help so it wouldn’t be her kid. But there aren’t resources.
A friend of mine has a nephew who was a huge problem. After getting expelled, he ended up in a group home. When he refused to follow the group home rules - they kicked him out. His relatives were done with him, the school was done with him, the social services were done with him - but he hadn’t yet acted in such a way that would justify locking him up. He will (he’s managed to stay out of jail so far), hopefully he’ll just get thrown in for dealing or stealing cars and won’t actually shoot anyone.
Yep. Electrons upon electrons of what a coward the armed guard was, what a useless piece of shit he is – but let’s arm teachers and trust them to act where even cops freeze. How is this not crystal clear? **Dangerosa **has hit the nail on the head. If even a cop, who theoretically knows what he’s getting into, can freeze, what in fresh hell would lead anyone to believe the guy who’s teaching you about covalent bonds is going to turn into Jason Bourne all of a sudden?
I’m afraid most gun nuts have seen too many movies and spent to much time at the gun range and they all think that if it were them in that position, why they’d calm their breathing as they leapt sideways over a bunsen burner and gone for center mass, firing both pistols Jon Woo style. I’m betting more people than not would have reacted the precise same way this deputy did.
Considering his boss put him on suspended leave I think he was expected to do more than just call it in.
His boss is an elected official who wants to be re-elected. Just because that’s what he does in front of the cameras doesn’t mean his policies are modernized or that his subordinates get the proper training.
Scot Peterson, the deputy in this case, has more than thirty years on the job. I assume he’s been through many training exercises over the years and spent many hours at the gun range that he should have known what to do and how to react.
I can kind of understand why he didn’t act. I know that I’d like to think I’d act bravely when confronted with a horrible situation like this, but who knows how anyone would react? Some people, like this deputy, have the training and expertise and yet they respond poorly. And others have no training or expertise, and perform admirably.
And those who ARE trained, expected, and paid to act, but don’t, should be loudly criticized, and possibly face other repercussions.
BTW - I’ll take a trained cop w/ his 9mm on familiar turf, over a young adult w/ an AR-15 - at least to reduce casualties and/or slow the shooter down.
I’m betting its the quiet little English teacher with a thing for Jane Austen who will turn out to the the badass.
Would anybody even know about this if his boss hadn’t decided to suspend him first?
I guarantee the Broward County Sheriffs Office isn’t the only or highest angency involved. On the state level the FDLE is probably deeply involved. And federally the FBI and ATF at least though most likely in an advisory role. It’s also reasonable to assume that there are a bunch of pissed off cops who wouldn’t keep their mouth shut. Every agency in the county responded to the call.
Hey, I just wanted to say “thanks” to you for participating in this thread, Loach. I think you bring a much-needed perspective to the discussion. I’m also very glad this isn’t in the Pit; sometimes reasonably calm and substantive exchanges are more desirable than being able to tell others to piss off.
I’m not wiling to regard Mr. Peterson’s inaction as anything other than a terrible, awful failure, but I am willing to believe that Mr. Peterson is also not happy with himself and will spend his days and nights, prolly for the rest of his life, regretting his own failure.
And yeah, I’d still like to see him denied any bonuses, etc. for retiring. I’d also like to see that the fact that he retired doesn’t stop the investigation.
How could these guys have failed their duty so badly? I am truly stunned. Especially since it’s in their job description.
And I speak as someone who once did put myself in a situation where the odds of me dying were probably at least 50%, in trying to rescue a child in a very dangerous circumstance. I tried, I failed, the child died, I got rescued. But I don’t know how I could not had tried. Not doing what I did seems inconceivable to me.
But I got a bit more understanding about the phenomenon from listening to a Radiolab Podcast on the topic. How to be a Hero. Apparently too much empathy can make you freeze up. So can too much analysis of the risks involved. Some folks apparently can never act in such a manner, others will almost always do so, but most people may well be capable of taking positive action in one situation and not in another. But training also is supposed to help being able to take the right action!
I don’t know, I’m disgusted, fed up, tired of tragedy and the failure of those in authority to step up and take meaningful action. From the cops who didn’t go in, to the POTUS; it’s sickening.
Eleven years ago, there was a notorious home invasion in a small Connecticut town. The local police were aware of the situation and were at the scene, setting up a perimeter and didn’t act for more than thirty minutes, while the wife and two daughters were raped and murdered.
(One reason the police were aware of the situation at the house was that one of the two criminals drove the mother to the bank so she could withdraw $15,000. He stayed in the car outside, while she withdrew the money and informed the teller of the situation, before she went back to the car.)
I bring up that case because perhaps it demonstrates that a small-town police force is out of its depths when dealing with such a situation?
Wow, that’s a very interesting article. I’m wondering if that dept is still training officers to do the old, pre-Columbine way of setting up a perimeter given that four deputies from that dept didn’t enter the building. When officers from another dept arrived it sounds like the deputies directed them but didn’t join them in making entry.
This guy was milking the system for a few more years at the high school. He assumed he wouldn’t need his weapons or get roughed up and would do a cushy 8 hour shift and go home. He wanted the badge, but not the job and responsibilities that go with it.