I’m not an “armchair warrior”, I’m not any sort of warrior at all. But Peterson was. That is the career that he chose. Not me, him. For more than 30 years he was being paid to be an armed defender of the public, and when faced with doing his job, he didn’t. In a battle when warriors run and hide, they can be summarily executed as cowards.
Here he is in 2015 bragging about what a Big Dam Hero he was.
Remember that Scot Peterson, the “school resource officer” in this case, isn’t just a poorly trained rent-a-cop (private security guard). He is a deputy sheriff with over three decades on the job. And as to what he should have done, upthread Loach (who is, I believe active-duty law enforcement) said that the standard operating procedure after Columbine is that officers in that position should go in and attempt to engage the shooter. In short, don’t wait for backup. Go in and try to kill or disable him before any more kids die.
He didn’t have a gun - it’s right in the part you quoted.
Right, that’s exactly what he should have done, he failed at his job because he didn’t do that. But are there any previous times that that has happened, that the school cop has gone and ended a school shooting?
You’re right, I missed that, it was a poor example, and he does say he would have gone in if he had a gun on him.
This article is a better discussion of why he didn’t go in. People often talk about the fight or flight reflex, ignoring that freezing is often a common reflex. From a clinical psychologist who works with police officers:
I want to know more about what training he had, and how often it was, and how seriously he took it. If there’s any indication he blew it off, or that his superiors didn’t require much or any, then I hope appropriate measures are taken.
What does a School Resource Officer do anyhow?
I’d guess pretty much what any bored out of their mind guard does.
I’d include these duties in the personnel file…
Search lockers for contraband, break up fights between students, operate the metal detectors at the entrance, ticket cars, walk staff to their cars, and most frequently: walk the hallways. Endlessly walk those hallways.
It’s the nature of the job. 99% of the time.
You could do the job for 20 years and never have anything more exciting than a kid with a pen knife or maybe some drugs in a locker.
I’m not sure how that person transforms into a man of action at the sound of gunfire.
There were no guards in any of the schools I attended. They weren’t needed. I recognize that they are needed today. Their presence is a deterrent.
It’s very similar to the TSA. Security theater reassures a nervous public and gives the illusion of safety.
We could spend twenty times more money and create an elite force for school security. Send them to various tactical schools. Train all the time. Then wait, for something to happen. Eventually.
QFT.
Sergeant Jeff Heinrich and the Coral Springs Police Department knows what it means to “move to the sound of the guns.”
It’s a concept that runs deep in the Armed Forces, be they Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines, or Coast Guard.
It’s understood by law enforcement, firefighters, and paramedics.
When there’s trouble, whether it’s enemy combatants on a foreign field of battle, whether it’s people injured or lost at sea, whether it’s criminals in the streets, or ordinary citizens needing assistance when they’re in peril, their home is on fire, or they’re suffering some kind of medical distress, those who Serve & Protect move TOWARDS the trouble, TOWARDS the danger, to confront the issue at hand and resolve it.
They might reckon the cost before they do it; but once committed, they don’t. The Coast Guard says, “You have to go out; you don’t have to come back.”
Fear, of course, is a rational emotion response to these situations. But it’s what you let your fear do to you, how you let it dictate your actions, that determines whether you’re a hero, or a coward. A servant of the people you swore an oath to Serve and Protect, or just another dick with a badge and a gun, who’s worth fuck-all when the rubber meets the road.
Broward County Sheriff’s Department should be run out of town on a rail, stripped of rank, title, and benefits (maybe take all of those fat pensions and donate them to the Victims Fund!), for Cowardice.
And Coral Springs PD should get Medals of Honor.
At least in this case, the SRO is an actual cop who did cop things for 20+ years. This jerkwad was fully trained to handle this situation.
He may have tried, but there may not have been any fatalities.
Easier than a gun? Yes, you get to sit in a comfortable seat listening to your favorite music with the windows rolled up so you can’t hear them scream or get blood splattered on you. Think of the song selection… Helter Skelter, I shot a man in Reno, I can’t drive 55… It would be the scene in Clock Work Orange only with car tires instead of boots.
What don’t you understand about someone who is batshit crazy?
Solid walls don’t yield easily to cars. You have to go very fast which leaves you in poor shape on the other side. That is assuming that the classrooms are all nicely on a level with road. Even a foot or two of kerb will screw up your plan. Oh, and they have to be next to the exterior wall and with a clear run to allow you to build up to speed. Slightly too slow and you will stick in the wall. Plus you only get one chance. Bad luck if the classroom is empty or they are all clustered around the board.
I understand that neither you nor I nor probably they themselves understand their true motivations. Certainly some of the “benefits” of a car you list above could be seen as negatives to a batshit crazy person.
well sometimes yes.
There was a shooting in a church recently which was stopped by a guy who ran out to his truck, got his AR15, came back in and shot the killer.
In my sons district they actually train using actors and scenarios to be able to handle just such a situation.
You can do that if you want. We will continue to discuss the topic.
That’s what we do here. We use a local technical college and students pose as if they are trying to get out of the building with an active shooter inside. They are yelling, screaming, crying, trying to cling onto officers running in while they run out. Officers and the active shooter use simunition ammo. It’s the most realistic training I’ve ever done in 36 years on the job. It is very stressful and intense training. But it prepares for what is going to actually happen during an active shooter situation.
The training does not include officers putting on dresses and hiding.
I believe that the general public has a misconception regarding the firearms and tactical training the average cop gets. Basic academy training with firearms consists, mostly, of safe handling of a weapon and marksmanship. In other words, how to not shoot yourself or any one else by accident followed by how to hit a static paper target. Where I live and work (as a trainer) firearms training is mandated twice a year. Officers must pass day and “low light” qualification courses. Passing requires no great skills and these courses of fire have little or nothing to do with combat shooting. Before I retired there was an increase in “force on force” training using marking cartridges (essentially, paintballs or similar). In my opinion this is the best type of training, by far. I’ve seen guys/gals who I believed were excellent cops lose control, lock up, fall down after being shot in the leg, swear up and down that they didn’t do what we just recorded them doing and all kinds of other crazy things. All this knowing that the worst that would happen was a sting from being hit or maybe a drop or two of blood. The thing is, this training is time and manpower intensive and not cheap, depending on the type of weapons being used. When budgets are tight, training is often the first thing on the chopping block. Generally speaking, force on force training has definitely declined over the last ten years or so.
All cops are, hopefully, getting active shooter training. For the most part, this consists of moving around in various formations and talking about what they should do if it ever happens to them. Attacking a shooter who is more and more likely to have a rifle is contrary to the vast majority of training (maintain distance, stay behind cover, wait for back up with more firepower etc.) that cops get. The idea that cops, even SWAT guys, are a step or three below Delta or SEALs is laughable. I don’t know whether the mindset of running into an ongoing shooting can be trained into someone or not. Personally, I think you either have that as part of your personality or you don’t and you will never know until it actually happens. I do know that the training the vast majority of officers get today will never do it. The idea that cops are highly trained to handle these kinds of situations is a sad joke. Maybe in some progressive departments but not as a rule.
MikeF, good post. The range requirement for officers is pretty weak. CCW requirements are weaker. It’s the personal time on the range that improves accuracy and that has zero to do with tactical training.
Without training for an active shooter it’s got to be confusing as hell to approach one from the outside. It’s different if you’re IN the shooting spree. Take cover and return fire. That’s your basic plan. You know where the shooter is and the direction he’s moving.
If you’re on the OUTSIDE you don’t know squat beyond shots being fired and people running in every direction. If you try to enter the building in the middle of a stampede (remember the Who Concert) you risk starting a pileup.
What’s needed is an accurate report of what’s going on so better trained people can storm the building. Even with the training it takes time and that’s not something that can be mitigated.
Imagine if your neighborhood is getting shot up and people are running everywhere. Are you going to grab your trusty side arm and run into the street looking for a target? Hell no. You need a target to shoot at before any thoughts of bravery kick in. It’s not Star Wars, the bad guy isn’t firing tracer rounds so you can draw a line back to him. You need something to work before you engage.
Arkansas has 2 school districts with armed, volunteer staff. It’s an extension of the concealed carry license.
You can read details here.
The main advantage is having people inside the situation that can respond. Rather than police on the outside who have limited information and arrive several minutes after the attack began.
Btw, it was implemented long before our current president was elected. Please don’t equate it with anything he’s said.
Texas, Missouri, Ohio, Colorado, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Connecticut and Washington state. Other states are looking into it.
Still hoping for your response, Magiver, to the following thread, which was inspired by an earlier post of yours:
https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=849927
Care to respond?
Not really, I didn’t see a response that suggested absence of a gun would have prevented the attack. this was a premeditated attack against random people with the intent to rack up numbers of dead people. a car is just as convenient.