Aaaand, I’m fired. Customer isn’t going to tolerate me cracking up like a hyena.
That is an incredibly shitty thing to say to someone in recovery and not even a teeny bit funny.
Yeah. Never, ever joke about recovery. It might lead to a bunch of bugs coming out of people’s asses, and I’m not cleaning it up, I tell you that much.
Did I ever tell you I love reading your posts? No? Well I do. That should soften up the rest of this post quite nicely…
If you feel that this topic is above criticism, jokes, ridicule or whatever…why didn’t you voice that the moment you saw it in the pit? Surely you must have known how rough it gets in the pit.
Recovery is hilarious, if successful.
Eh, whatever you guys can live with I guess.
I would point out that it is at least worth considering that this may be one of those things that a person who has/is battling addiction can joke about but that it may be in pretty poor taste for others to do so.
With an attitude like that, what the hell are you doing in this community? Can’t you find somewhere that your hard-on for woo is embraced instead of derided?
My magic rock may cause coins to land face-up more often than face-down, though the evidence for this is from one small study where I tossed six coins on the ground and five of them landed face-up and should not be regarded as conclusive.
Anyone whose [del]self control[/del] trust in their “higher power” :rolleyes: is *so tenuous *that a joke will drive them to drink again doesn’t belong anywhere on the internet. And definitely not in the Pit.
OK, here’s the most recent review I’ve found on AA. It restates the other NIH article that appears to be repeatedly misinterpreted by people who insist on saying that it proved that AA (as opposed to simply committing to some form of long term intervention) is effective.
I tried to explain this in my earlier post. To make the case that AA works, you have to show evidence for specificity. This review summarizes that specificity is where AA and other 12 step programs do not have scientific evidence (yet) to support it. When randomized to normalize for “hey, I’m committed to stop drinking” studies are mixed with one showing that AA is actually counterproductive.
Here’s some relevant quotes:
AA may work simply because it is a organization where committed people go and it has a social network of people with experience that can help you out. Long story short, if you want to improve remission rates you need to have a scientific basis for the approach. Find out what exactly “works” within AA and distill it (oops) from all the mumbo-jumbo, counterproductive stuff.
It isn’t a question of being driven to drink, and I will point out that I am not trying to speak for gravitycrash.
Think of it like this: You have a poster (in the Pit even) who discloses that he is a cancer patient and had undergone chemo. Is it in good taste to start making bald jokes?
Are we talking about the Pit, or are we talking about good taste? Make up your mind.
Well, sure, bad jokes. Made one in…let’s see, been a while…I was wearing an onion in my belt, I remember that…so, a long time ago.
Come to think if it, it wasn’t me, it was Vinny.
We are talking about both, naturally. I get that this is all rough and tumble and go-hard and that you get some sort of a charge out of waving your e-peen around. Really. Good for you.
I’d heard that a sardonic sense of humor was de rigeur for recovery alumni. If it isn’t, it sure seems like it oughta be.
It depends on the individual, I guess. I’ll tell you this, though-the next time I’m in a bad way like that, my first stop is going to be The BBQ Pit. I can’t think of anything that would cheer me up more than huge quantities of crassness and bad taste from some of the best in the biz.
Jack Daniels. QED.
I think that’s obvious, but it’s like distilling what “works” with psychotherapy–there are so many variables, that even when someone gets better, you can’t identify it across a group.
Moreover, you can’t devise a study which would show this anyway, because you can’t randomly assign someone to AA. Suppose you have 1000 really sleepy people in a big hall, and a lot of coffee, some of it with cream. Seven hundred of those people want nothing other than to go to sleep. 300 people end up drinking some of that coffee. However, 75 of them–for whatever reason–can’t stomach coffee black so they take it with cream. After a certain, unspecified length of time, about 200 people in the big hall start to wake, and leave the big hall.
Somewhere else far away, there is a guy from PETA who objects to people drinking coffee with cream, because it’s an animal product. He scrounges around on-line, and comes across a report about the 1000 sleepy people in the big hall, and it says that of those 200 people who left the hall, the same percentage who drank coffee with cream fell back asleep as those who drank coffee black.
So the PETA guy proclaims to the world, “CREAM DOESN’T WORK! I HAVE THE FACTS RIGHT HERE. I FOUND IT ON THE INTERNET!” Well, duh, of course the cream doesn’t work to keep you awake, but it does work to get more people to drink the coffee.
So you don’t accept that long-term use of alcohol has demonstrable long-term, if not permanent, effects on brain physiology, particularly neurotransmitters and how they handle serotonin and dopamine? Granted, AA hasn’t come to this conclusion itself, but other research has.
The fuck! I was sober prior to reading this!
I didn’t say that it was untestable. I said that the experimental method used was insufficient to establish anything. Someone else has already pointed out in the thread one problem–often the people are assigned randomly. Another is what’s being tested: perhaps the only reason AA works is because it adds a social element of acceptance–one that others can get elsewhere.
My wording may have been unclear, but my examples were not, so either you intentionally misrepresented me to get an insult off, or, more likely, you didn’t read for comprehension.