Strange that when you say “most don’t suffer” it’s okay, but when I say that it’s “utterly absurd” … care to clarify? …
So to be sure, my exposure to folks with Down Syndrome is through Special Olympics … that’s self-selecting for parents who care enough to work with their child … other parents just keep their child in a locked and padded room all the time and here we will have great suffering for the individual …
My mistake is focusing exclusively on 21st trisomy … you may be right that the other forms of Down Syndrome do not have such rosy outcomes … plus I’m addressing the mental disabilities, obviously the physical disabilities associated with 21st trisomy can be quite painful … the “lack of muscle tone” for the heart can’t be an easy thing to live with …
I’m blessed to live in an area with far more “liberal” attitudes toward the disabled in public … certainly there’s other areas where such carries a tremendous social stigma … but this is suffering imposed on the disabled individual, my point is that there’s not as much intrinsic suffering from Down Syndrome …
“Utterly absurd” is because people get this image of Downs people as sweet, patient souls who are happy all the time, smiling and wonderful, and wouldn’t it be lovely if we were all like that, cheerful and carefree. Which is bullshit. How much exposure do you have with them in the Special Olympics? Do you work with these people day to day, or just watch them out in public?
Ask their parents if they have a “worry-free existance”? There is a major stereotype out of there of Downs patients always being happy and cheerful, and not only is it wrong, it’s considered offensive to them and their families.
One of my Facebook friends, a former co-worker, has a DS son who is in his early 20s. He’s very high functioning although he will never live independently. She’s said that they have been asked more than once if she ever considered having an abortion (what kind of sicko would ask a question like that, anyway?) and she said no; he was planned, and they didn’t know he was disabled until he was born, and even if they had known, and known what they were getting into, they still would have had him. That said, they know that not everyone can make the same decision they did.
His older sister, who recently had her FOURTH child, rejected all prenatal testing that was about the baby (i.e. she did a diabetes test during mid-pregnancy but not the quad screen) and her kids are all normal.
Please help me understand…so, under this proposed bill, it’s still okay to have a normal abortion under Roe V Wade, but if the fetus is identified with Down’s syndrome qualifiers, it’s not? Am I reading this correctly? Under what possible legal grounds could right to lifers argue this if so?
It’s only not okay if it’s done because the fetus is believed to have DS. And it will certainly be challenged. Neighboring Indiana is currently blocked from enforcing its similar ban.
The local bowling center opened up their lanes for free to the Special Olympics folks and I’d be there helping down on the lanes while the parents drank coffee and visited among themselves … I also did quite a bit of respite work, whenever I went shopping in the The Big City, I’d grab a couple of the kids and bring them with to give the parents a few hours break … so when you see Down Syndrome people in public, I’d be the person herding them around …
Oh … my step-daughter has Down Syndrome … that’s why I’m familiar with the commonality of prognosis … “cradle-to-grave”, it’s all pretty straightforward …
Regardless of your relationship with people affected by DS, you truly are coming across as condescending and ignorant. I believe I understand what you’re trying to say - that as far as significant disabilities go, it is one that has the potential to expect a reasonably long lifespan with minimal health complications or physical discomfort, a fairly high quality of life, and it is true that many people living with it do self-identify as being happy with their life and with who they are.
But unfortunately you sound like you are perpetuating the dehumanizing stereotype that everyone with DS is a happy-go-lucky clone lacking any complexity of emotional range. Which, of course, you know is not true at all.
If you actually read what I wrote, you would see that (I think) I do understand what you’re trying to say – but that the words you chose have led at least some people to misunderstand your point. Where’s the strawman?
And I didn’t call you a liar, nor do I have an opinion on whether you are one. It is simply very weird that you implied that your only experience with Down Syndrome is via Special Olympics, and then multiple posts later your experience is that you are in fact the parent of a child with Down Syndrome. How do you not see that it is a really bizarre thing to do?
And your last comment, just, huh? My best interpretation of that is that you assume I am not a parent of a child with DS (which is true, but not terribly relevant), not that I am not a parent at all (which is not true, but would be even more irrelevant), and that this somehow has caused me to stereotype (which I haven’t in any way done). Have I translated that even close?
I find it very odd that someone who claims to be a step-parent of some with Downs Syndrome isn’t aware of the stereotype of people with Downs always being happy and worryfree. And while some can live independently, not all of them can. Don’t try and stereotype an entire group of people.
Stereotype of children with Down’s syndrome as almost always happy is incorrect
And for what it’s worth, I don’t think that a woman should necessarily choose an abortion if her fetus tests positive for Downs*. But she SHOULD be allowed to have that choice. And I worry that this is a slippery slope towards outlawing abortion entirely.
*If your child tests positive for a birth defect that’s absolutely incompatible with life though, I would most certainly advocate an abortion. Or at least, if you can’t bring yourself to do so, don’t try and keep the poor thing alive and suffering with constant medical intervention. I previously mentioned Matthew Manuel Nel. The kid spends his days choking, vomitting, gagging and seizing, he can barely sleep, he’s basically a vegetable, but his parents insist he’s a miracle. That’s just torture.
