- Do they provide them out in the field at the same rate they provide chaplains?
- Will they have the same level of confidentiality as they would with chaplains?
Chaplains don’t just provide counselling as far as mental health. They can recommend a compassionate posting, ask for someone to be returned home early for personal reasons and also provide advice for Comd based on general troop morale (because they are usually around).
Also, there is no perceived stigma in asking for a padre. It can be for mental health or a bunch of other reasons.
The same reason that religious people want chaplains in addition to psychologists and therapists: they provide different services.
Also, chaplains is just jargon for the purposes of this discussion. The military won’t want to make a new code just for “atheists chaplains” simply because calling them chaplains doesn’t make sense in this case.
If the answer to both of these questions is “Yes” would it change your opinion?
And you would be happy if atheist chaplains provided this exact same advice to troops in the field? Come on :rolleyes:
But that’s just it. Those arguing ‘for’ atheist chaplains are not looking to ensure that atheist troops receive secular counseling or other psychological treatment by professionals. They actually want people in the military labeled “Atheist Chaplain” for whatever reason even though there are already better solutions available in the military, but they don’t have the title “Atheist Chaplain” so I guess they are not good enough :rolleyes:
It would make me lean that way…if there weren’t a perception problem with others(especially supervisors) finding out you are going to a psychiatrist-it could become a problem come promotion time. There isn’t the same stigma when it comes to talking to the chaplain.
You keep saying “for whatever reason” as if no reasons have been given, when really the problem is you are disinclined to allow atheist chaplains, reasons be damned.
I have seen no reason that a person who offers secular advice to military troops NEEDS to be called an “Atheist Chaplain” other than “Well, other religions have them”
And I am certain that you are highly overstating the amount of “stigma” visiting a psychologist has during “promotion time”
But an “atheist chaplain” would not be performing the same tasks as a psychologist, etc. anymore than a theistic chaplain right now is performing the same tasks as a psychologist, etc. Atheists are asking for an officer to provide the same services as a theistic chaplain, just from an atheistic point of view as opposed to a specific theistic one.
I can tell you from reports I have heard from servicemen and reports about issues of mental health in the military that there very much is a stigma against seeking psychological help. It is arguably worse than it is in the general public.
Been there, done that, seen what happens. There is definitely more stigma attached to seeing a psychiatrist than there is to seeing a chaplain.
In your view, what services would an atheistic chaplain provide that are not already covered by existing personnel? Please be specific.
Could you be a little more specific, not with names or whatever of course, but what have you seen happen?
In my case, enlisted in the AF, that type of stuff never even comes up during promotions, it’s a straight numbers game. Score enough points to put you over the cutoff, you get promoted - medical history is no where to be found in the process.
Would you be asking this question if Jew or Southern Baptists weren’t allowed as chaplains and were fighting to be allowed in?
What happened?
You said it yourself that there is only one position available for Chaplain.
If that position is filled by a Buddhist chaplain, then how exactly is he supposed to provide spiritual guidance for a Catholic? I’ll answer for you: the same way an atheist chaplain would!
Chaplains are cross-trained in all faiths and able to take care of soldiers regardless of religious affiliation. An atheist chaplain would have to learn to perform all the same services that a religious one would.
Immediate 24/7, on call marital counseling. How’s that for specific? The waiting list to see a psychiatrist or counselor is ridiculous, if you can even get on that list at all! It’s like pulling teeth to get some of my soldiers into necessary alcohol and drug abuse counseling. But guess what, they can always go see a chaplain. There’s never a waiting list, a sign up sheet or an approval process. They simply go see the chaplain and talk about whatever is bothering them. And there is always a chaplain on call. If I had a soldier fighting with his wife on Saturday night, good luck getting a counselor to show up at their house. I could get a chaplain there to talk to them, though. Atheist, Catholic or Hindu… wouldn’t matter.
I’ve had friends that said they were passed up for promotion, and even stopped from reenlisting, because they had something in their files about seeking psychiatric help. Now this may not constitute verifiable evidence to you, but I have yet to hear about anyone that got in trouble in the military for seeing a chaplain.
Basically the question shouldn’t be “Why allow it?”
It should be “Why not allow it?”