Yes, of course. I should have looked at your OP a little more closely. Sorry about that.
But it doesn’t really change my experience. At my elementary school, there were no soft drink machines, and for that matter, no cafeteria–in those days of June Cleaver Moms, we were expected to go home for lunch, where Mom was supposed to serve a nutritious lunch. That’s not really practical now, I understand, and in some cases it wasn’t then either (the kids who had to take their lunch to school were left to eat them in a utility room under the supervision of a teacher who made it clear that she would rather be in the staff room, smoking cigarettes and drinking coffee). But nothing–and most certainly not soda pop–was available at elementary school.
A few things were in the caf of my senior public school (that’s what the local junior high was called in my neighbourhood). There, we could buy hot soup and milk and juice to supplement the lunches we brought from home. But again, the school allowed neither soda nor vending machines of any kind.
Having managed to survive my elementary and middle-school years on just the beverages and meals that were allowed by my parents (both directly at meals and in the lunch I’d take to school), I see no need for such things as soda pop to be available from vending machines in schools.
Take it away from the kids. They have their entire adult lives to fill up on empty calories. And while you’re at it, take it away from most of the parents, too. Americans drink way too much pop.
Ditto that – I attended public school from 1973-ish through 1985, and never saw any sort of soft-drink machine or soda sale on campus at all. The closest I could get to a Coke was in high school, and that was only by leaving campus and visiting the restaurant/arcade/pizzerias across the street.
What Spoons said. 100%. Schools could also do a lot more about the kinds of lunches available. There are those that have actual salad bars available.
The federal school lunch program has certain very, very minimal standards, one of which is that there be a “vegetable.” Unfortunately, the “vegetables” that are easy to prepare and serve to potentially hundreds of picky youngsters are things like fried potatoes. Or canned vegetables that are nasty, virtually devoid of nutritional content, and mostly end up in the garbage anyway. Fresh fruit is a good alternative; what’s the big difficulty with having oranges or apples available?
In one school I taught in, there was a dentist on the school board who raised holy hell if there was any suggestion of sugary drinks or snacks sold in any form.
IMHO vending machines of all kinds should never have been there in the first place.
If you’re going to do that, might as well consider ketchup a vegetable.
100% juices are not a healthy alternative to sodas, people! The fiber is gone, and we’re used to drinking it in such large serving sizes that it’s just a huge sugar load, nothing more. Its vitamin content does not make up for its carb load.
Schools should promote good nutrition and healthy eating habits. Soda and juice can be part of a healthy diet in moderation, like candy, but judging from the rampant obesity among elementary school kids, many of them and their families have no idea what a healthy diet is. So why add to the problem by giving kids an opportunity to load up on more empty calories at school? Add to that the increasing rates of adult-onset diabetes and it seems to me like a no-brainer.
[sup]applause, applause[/sup] I thought I was a lone voice in the wilderness. I’ve been trying to convince a number of coworkers that juice is not healthier than the original fruit!
BTW, what’s wrong with kids drinking water at school. They aren’t going to starve. Most should be able to crawl home for a snack before they actually disappear completely.:dubious:
Poor thing. I’ve never had any doubt that my role, while different from the "boys,"was just as vital. That said, after 30 years in teaching facilities, I now know you guys wouldn’t last a day without us.
I have actually said to a wet-behind-the-ears ego "Listen to me. I’ve been doing this longer than you’ve been alive. You will not hurt my patient! " Yes, I’ve made interns cry. But, I’ve saved many a butt as well.
At my school, all our soda machine hasd was pop. All our snack machines had was sugary crap. All our cafeteria sold was crap. here’s what I could get to eat:
Pizza.
Fries.
Taco something, depending on the day.
Ice cream.
Chicken breasts (probably the most healthful thing sold on a regular basis).
I love the days when I could get a baked potato.
And since I had to pay for my own food senior year (since I had a job, thanks mom), I usually ended up with a Dr. Pepper and Doritos for lunch. Sometimes I’d splurge and spend $3 on 5 chicken breasts (which came on fries). That was about once a month. Maybe once every week or two, I’d get pizza or a baked potato. That’s how most of my friends ate, too.
I always wished there was something more healthful for me to eat, that I could afford. Since my parents made good monies, I couldn’t get free lunches, despite the fact that I had to pay for them myelf. Gah!
I mostly stuck to bring from home food in high school, buy only milk and possibly potato chips if the mood struck me.
I loved that salad bar though. It only came around twice a week during my senior year, but I took advantage of it, and so did a lot of other kids. You had to get to the cafeteria early if you wanted salad.
The only vending machine had Hawaian punch type juices and iced tea.
I never said that juice was just as good as the original fruit. I said it was better than soda, and I still maintain that it is. If a kid is going to drink a sugar-laden beverage, isn’t it better if that beverage has vitamins in it, at least? There is no nutritional value to soda whatsoever.
Also, let’s not forget that high fructose corn syrup is not very good for you, and it’s in bloody everything. At least juice has more natural sugars that don’t tax your liver to process.
Calories (8 oz): 100
Carbohydrates: 27
Carbohydrates from Sugars: 27
Not a lot of difference between a Pepsi and an OJ, and fewer calories in the Pepsi. Lack of vitamins isn’t really the concern for removing the drink machines from schools. Both are full of empty sugar calories that just cause you to get fat if you drink too much of it.
I am really surprised that people are unconcerned with how much soda kids are drinking. Calories and carb amounts in these beverages don’t tell the full story; all sugars are NOT created equal.
High fructose corn syrup can actually contribute to mineral losses in the body, in a way that sugar won’t. This is another disadvantage to sodas.
Fructose is bad for kids, especially in the quantity they drink, which lemme tell you is a lot. I am not kidding: today, a girl told me she had a Pepsi and a bowl of Froot Loops for breakfast. Of course, she was massively overweight, and I don’t imagine she’ll get any slimmer drinking 5 cans of soda a day.
Also, an I just say that a room full of 12 year olds hepped up on caffeine makes me nuts? To me, that’s enough reason to get rid of soda. That and the fact that you can’t tell me juice and soda have equal merit in a kid’s diet.
Shouldn’t her parents be there to intervine? I’m sure that banning pop would prove to be a much healthier alternative, but to kids like this, pop isn’t the only problem.
rubystreak, drinking large quantities of fruit juice is only marginally less bad than drinking large quantities of soda with sugar or fructose. The vitamins in fruit juice are absolutely not needed in 99.9% of the kids consuming the juice, therefore they offer no nutrititve effect.
You rail about fructose in your last post, but that’s what juices are full of. Fructose: Fruit sugar.
And digesting sugar doesn’t put undue burden on the liver. Those links you list are not what I’d call real credible. Speaking as a medical scientist, that is. They may strain the pancreas in the long run, and lead towards diabetes, which can affect the liver too. But Fructose (the main ingredient in fruit juice after water) is not hepato-toxic.
And caffiene is an infinitesimal health concern vs. consuming all those damn carbs in soda and juice.
So: In the quantities being consumed by our population, especially young people, both non-diet soda and juice are pretty much equivalent and neither are healthy choices. They are strongly associated with obesity and diabetes.
In short, rubystreak, please continue to rail against our society’s excess consumption of non-diet sodas and also rail against excessive consumption of fruit juices, especially amongst our young.
Flodjunior’s school doesn’t have a cafeteria, although they do have a small kitchen. Certainly they have no vending machines. Kids have to bring their lunches. And the school has a policy about lunches, too: no candy, no cakes or cookies, no jam or other sweet spreads. They may bring their own drink, but no sodas or sweet punches, and no juices other than 100% orange or grapefruit. The school provides the child’s choice of low-fat milk or water, and a fruit or vegetable is available if the child chooses to eat it.
After lunch, they spend a full hour outside, regardless of the weather.
Have I mentioned I love this school?
Non-citrus juices really don’t have any vitamins worth mentioning, unless fortified, and if you’re counting vitamins added later you could just as well give the kid a glass of water and a Flintstones Chewable. Most juice “blends” are overwhelmingly apple juice, which is cheap sugar water with an unearned reputation for healthfulness. Citrus juice has vitamin C, so it’s a bit better, but it’s still not something you want kids to be guzzling down all day long.
When someone – be it parent groups or governmental agency – wants healthy food and drink served in school, LET THEM FUND IT.
As it is, the Reagan administration achieved a certain level of fame for calling ketchup a vegetable simply to make their “balanced meals” work out on paper. This is a prime example of the level of importance our children seem to have in the minds of our politicians.
As far as politicians are concerned, schools and public education exist largely to serve as a whipping boy, to generate votes whenever a politician chooses to create an issue to crusade upon.
You want healthy food and drink in the schools? Peachy. Legislate it, and THEN FUND IT.
Oh, and an eye toward some sort of reality might be a good idea here, too. If the kids are expected to PAY for food, then they won’t BUY it if they don’t LIKE it!
So besides water, what IS a healthy beverage for kids? Are you saying that soda and juice are equally healthy? And is high fructose corn syrup not qualitatively different from the fructose that naturally occurs in fruit?
Please do educate me on this, as it’s starting to seem that I am uninformed.
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