But other people may not be you. I’m probably no longer the target for hot, I’ve been with my husband twenty years, which should indicate I’m not 23. But when we go out for a date night, I make the same effort I did twenty years ago - to be attractive and sexually stimulating FOR HIM. Not for random stranger in the restaurant.
As a sensible male well past the age of letting the small head do the thinking, I’d like to take this at face value.
As a societal observer who actively looks for the BS quotient in everyday behavior, I have to say that this attitude seems to have its full measure of bovine excrement. It falls into the same category of self-serving pseudo argument as most other small-L libertarian nonsense that NOTHING a person does should affect another in any way unless it’s intended to do so. (“Yeah, we run around our property waving guns at everything… so what’s yer problem, asshole?”)
There are nearly universal assumptions about female beauty in our society, and they are deeply ingrained in our sexual mores and behavior, and all the wishful thinking in the world is not going to change them. If a woman blessed with a lovely rack chooses to wrap it in formfitting 6-ounce cotton and share a public space with me, telling me that I’m wrong to find it attractive and admire it is somewhere between BS and wishful thinking of the first order.
How bout you? You wearing a shapeless, formless bed sheet to work each day? Grimace costume? A long, flowery dress? Or do you wear pants that fit your waist in a length that stops within a couple centimeters of your shoes? Wearing a XXXXL shirt or one that fits your shoulders and covers your belly? A belt, tie, watch, or other accessory? Do you wear clothing that fits your shape? I’m curious about your motivations WRT your chosen apparel.
And if she’s wrapping that rack in a tight, revealing shirt then you may be correct in your assumption that she doesn’t mind some attention. But unless she has shown an interest, she probably doesn’t want it from you.
We’re not wishfully thinking, we’re asking that you use your manners and refrain from making us uncomfortable with your ogling. No one is attempting to police your thoughts or your glances. Glances.
To be fair, in any given situation it is generally considered more acceptable for men to wear less formal and less tailored clothes than women. NitroPress may very well wear baggy shirts to work and will probably not be overly socially penalized for doing so. The problem is that he seems not to realize that this option is not available to everyone.
If he’s wearing any clothing that fits his dimensions, then his butt, his chest, his biceps, his waist (or lack thereof) and his package are on display to anyone who cares to study his fine, masculine form.
That doesn’t mean that he spent hours in the store and in front of the mirror in an attempt to pinch, tuck, plump, and snug his muscles and lumps into a woman-pleasing tableau. I mean, his nuts may have a spectacular profile in a certain pair of khakis, but I’m willing to put quite a bit of money on the wager that most of his female coworkers aren’t rejoicing that “Carl wore his nut pants today!!”
Not at all - but I am aware of what underlies my choices of clothing, and a lot of it is the general “attractiveness to all, especially women” conditioning. (I once got my share of admiration and fluttering eyelashes but would not claim to be attractive to anyone but my wife these days.)
I don’t disagree that there is a spectrum of response to sexual attractiveness and that no two strangers or casual acquaintances are likely to share the same thinking. But I do find it eye-rolling when it’s claimed that a woman who’s dressed to highlight her charms is doing so for attention and response only from selected individuals. Yes, hitting on her without that being an appropriate action or running up to try and see her bellybutton between the grand tetons is out of line… but sometimes that line is drawn so far over that everything but averting your eyes is called an infringement.
Well, I don’t differentiate because I don’t really feel the need to fit my work clothes into some sort of complex, internally consistent, completely justifiable scheme. I put on clothes that I like, that generally fit in with what other women in my organization are wearing, and that I think look nice on me by whatever whim I’m going on that day.
It’s not at all murky. Your job is to act appropriately with people at work, including women. If they are doing something inappropriate, report them to HR and they will follow up according to company policy.
That one’s easy to test. Find a provocatively dressed young woman half your age and ogle the bejeezus out of her. Then, observe what happens when a good-looking guy closer to her age does the same, and get back to me with those results.
Don’t flatter yourself. Attention from every male that crosses one’s path is *not *the desired result of dressing in a provocative fashion unless one hopes to earn money from that attention.
Don’t laugh yet, my last call to arms resulted in expanded sizes for the Wonder Bra so that even the bustiest of women were granted a boost. I was clearly laboring under the misguided belief that more cleavage = happier, more peaceable society. Clearly men have let the mammary bounty go to their heads.
If this keeps up, I’ll petition for total repeal and if it goes through: me will have to call a plumber if they get a hankering from some cleave.
I don’t expect men not to look, but if they do look and I’m not comfortable with them looking, then I’m going to readjust so I’m more comfortable. Just because I chose a busty shirt this morning does not mean I’m obligated to leave it all hanging out this afternoon.
I’m not trying to control your looking, but I will try to control what (of me) you see. Pretty simple, really.
With very short skirts, I sometimes tug them down because they ride up as I move around. Nothing to do with wanting men to notice my legs. Given that, when I’m out with female friends in similar attire, they’re always a bit awkward about having to readjust, I think my experience is fairly common.
And for shirts, apart from what everyone else has said, some shirts will be demure in one week of the month and obscene in another.
A’ight, so here’s the thing. Like what some other ladies have said, sometimes you put on a top and the collar isn’t cooperating, so you have to move it over to minimize boob exposure.
But about the “lookit my boobs” argument. Psshaw. You know, not all outfits look the same on all women. There are some very thin women without any boobs who can wear a tank and shorts during the summer because it’s goddamned hot, and no one thinks for a moment that they’re showing off or are trying to attract attention. You take another woman in that same outfit who is… shapely? I don’t know what term to use anymore, since words like “shapely,” “curvy,” and “voluptuous” have been hijacked by fat women. Let’s just say there’s a woman anywhere between thin and average sized who is booby and hippy, but when she wears a little tank and shorts, all of a sudden she’s pulling a “lookit mah tits!” move. She’s wearing the same damn thing, except with her it’s titillating (no pun intended – seriously, I hate puns) because she has a curvy body.
That’s bullshit and it’s just fucking annoying. Is she supposed to wear a parka because if she wears a tank, it’s clear she wants creepy male attention, else why’d she wear it? Sadly, many women have learned to adjust their wardrobe in order to fend off this kind of silliness, but some women won’t. And hell, good for them. But idiot guys who drool or go “Well she’s wearing that, so she must want attention” are why at the next meeting, we’re all going to agree to wear burqas by 2015.
