Skyfall for those who've seen it - open spoilers

Cafe Society
161

If he had the capacity to arrange police cars and uniforms, why didn’t he just catch a flight to Heathrow?

I’m sure I’m missing something.
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I’m sure that was Plan A. Have Severine supervise Patrice the hitman’s payoff at the casino. Make sure Patrice got whacked. Have Severine bring back the four million euro to the island. Sail to England (too much security at Heathrow). Meet the London crew with the fake cop credentials. Go kill M. Cover escape by blowing up a tube train.

He MUST have had a Plan B in case he got arrested or recognized in London. He just tweaked plan B when Bond showed up.

162

My theory is that QUANTUM still has moles in MI6 who funnelled info to Silva, who is either working for them or has them as one of his clients.

163

In any case, not having been reared on the literary Bond I have always preferred the Bond I saw in Connery and still see in the characterization by Craig (even as it is written out by this backstory): Bond is a very well trained very well equipped thug at his heart, a thug who knows how to well play the role of refined and who loves his country, but a thug nevertheless. Him actually being of upper social class and having learned to act the thug is much less appealing.
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You should read the books. Bond’s father had a very minor title, and very little beyond a crumbling old family home. Bond was “upper class” in name only and hated school. He was kicked out of at least one school precisely because he had a habit of getting into fights with snotty upperclassmen. So he eventually quit school and joined the Navy. Once in the OO section, he enjoyed the finer things because he realized that every day could literally be his last, not because he was an upper-class snob.

164

My favorite part of Skyfall was when it turned into Hard Target.

165

Did anyone else notice Severine’s pendant in the shape of a stylized, elongated Q? I initially thought this could be a connection to Quantum.

Also in the crowd “That’s not how you forensically examine a possibly hostile computer” when Q plugged it into the MI6 network.

I was also disappointed that they didn’t cast Connory as the the elderly groundskeeper.

Personally, I like QoS better than Casino Royale as an action movie. CR has a better story, but QoS has better action scenes.
I’d rate Skyfall somewhere between those two, then the first four Connory films, then Goldeneye, OMSS, and the Moore films would be the worst of the Bond films, IMHO.

166

They can’t, he’s retired.

167

Didn’t a lot of people have Q lapel pins or am I misremembering?

168

The whole point of the train being empty is that is is what happens in bond films.
It is how they keep it family friendly. Minimal gore, no deaths on camera of innocent passerby.
They are staple network fodder for 5pm on a Saturday, or Xmas day.

Check Pierce Brosnan running over a car with a tank…and yet the driver gets out and walks away.

169

The train wasn’t empty. The passenger were shown inside, scared but unhurt.

170

I think she’s reffering to the subway train and not the train at the beginning of the movie.

171

Here’s a question my son raised: Silva’s cage obviously opened up when Q allowed his computer access to the MI6 network, but how did the guys guarding him get shot? I can’t imagine he had a gun in there. Unless it was hidden in his false teeth? Or did he have insiders in MI6 for whom the network thing was a signal?

172

I just assumed there were people waiting in the tunnels for the computer to open the security up. He was alone while being chased though.

173

I’m not sure that requires much hand-waving: he’s alone in the cell with a bored guard nearby, the doors open, he smacks bored-guard and takes his gun, then shoots all the other guards.

Or maybe not, but this seems like the very least problem in this f’d up movie.

174

I didn’t like it, despite having enjoyed the other two Craig as Bond films. There was just too much stuff that required one to check your brain at the door, even by the standards of a Bond movie.

175

I stand corrected. Thanks.

176

And that exact location was also used in the final chase / assassination scene from The International.

I just saw it and enjoyed it. One thing I didn’t see mentioned here, and I probably only recognized him b/c I saw Casino Royale just before going to it - but one of the poker players from the final table from Casino Royale was at the Macau casino and seemed to recognize Bond while he was beating up the guards. It was the Asian guy with a long gray-haired ponytail. Nice touch.

177

I know someone’s mentioned this, but it’s not a shotgun, it’s a large-bore double rifle (AKA an Elephant Gun). Exactly the sort of thing a distinguished member of the Landed Gentry (or someone with a large Estate from that era) would have.

They date from the era when bolt-action rifles weren’t strong enough to reliably handle .500 Express-type cartridges, and the whole “Sporting” thing basically meant if you couldn’t bring down your target with two shots you shouldn’t have been there in the first place.

As for Skyfall - I liked the movie. Maybe not quite as good as Casino Royale, but better than Quantum of Solace and quite a few of the 1970s/1980s Bonds (some of which tended to get A Bit Silly, and I say that as a Bond fan).

Also, I thought they missed a really good opportunity by not casting Richard Ayoade (AKA Moss from The IT Crowd) as Q. The actor they had was bringing a similar vibe, but plugging a hostile rogue agent’s computer into the MI6 network just struck me as the sort of thing Moss would do, not someone who’s supposed to be one of the country’s top IT boffins.

178

I haven’t read all the comments yet, but I saw this over the weekend and wanted to register my thoughts.

It was a good, solid Bond flick, although not the incredibly GREAT film the reviews seem to be making it out to be. Great stunts, interesting writing, cute to tie this all to Bond’s family, something that’s been little touched on since Fleming’s novel On Her Majesty’s Secret Service.
I also have to complain about a plot element that I seem to be seeing a lot of of late, and which I can’t stand. – The Chief Villain Lets Himself Get Captured So That He can Break Out From the Prison and Wreak Havoc. The Joker did it in The Dark Knight, Loki did it in The Avengers, and now Silva does it in Skyfall. I can understand why filmmakers do it, but it’s thoroughly stupid and makes zero sense (the villains could more easily have accomplished their goals without getting captured in the first place), and only “fantastic” films do it – you won’t see this in any serious movie. Close behind is an old plot element I loathe as well – The Villain Who Has Planned Everything Out Wellin Advance and Knows the Hero Perfectly. This is never convincing, either, but makes for interesting run-on plots that don’t lag, which is why it’s used. Even if I allow it once or twice, my Suspension of Disbelief runs out long before they’ve exhausted it. Again, look at The Dark Knight for such overuse, but there are lots of other examples.
Nonetheless, a well-done flick for the most part, with Bond being believably resourceful and clever, which is always the best of all situations.

179

It’s been interesting reading this thread. I’m too young to have any fond memories of the old Bond movies; I started watching the franchise in the Brosnan era, when it was mostly forgettable schlock. Bond has apparently had so many personalities, appealing to so many different people, that it’s now evident to me that one movie couldn’t possibly make everyone happy.

For me, here’s what I don’t want Bond to be. I don’t want him to be Ethan Hunt or Batman, a superhero with gadgets. I don’t want him to be Jason Bourne, an unstoppable assassin grounded in a real world. I also don’t want him to be Charles Bronson from Death Wish, an indiscriminate murderer.

What I want Bond to be is an extremely cool guy. Like, a guy who became a spy because it was the hip thing to do; because it let him travel the world and sleep with beautiful women and generally not give a fuck about anything but being the coolest motherfucker in the room at all times. I think the Daniel Craig “gritty reality” remake lost some of that swagger.

Skyfall brought some of that back. I liked the bold advances with women; the entire casino scene, komodo dragons and all; not giving a shit about his recent sexual conquest getting shot for no reason. I like that he always wears a suit. I liked the DB5.

I didn’t really care for the dumb computer plot; if it wasn’t necessary for the baddie’s plan, they should have cut it, because it wasn’t entertaining to watch. The entire underground HQ set looked cheap; I want exotic locations, not something that’s obviously a sound stage somewhere. They spent way too much time underground not being cool.

Overall I think it was a decent movie. I hope they don’t forget that Bond is a spy and not special forces. His primary goal should be to gather intelligence. Bond gathers intelligence by going places where normal folk can’t go, like the high-roller’s club. He fits in where he doesn’t belong by being cool. Exceedingly cool. If he kills people or gets into a fight, it should be an unintended consequence of his dangerous job, not the primary mission. Taking out a small squad of well equipped para-military assassins isn’t a job for a spy, it’s a job for special forces. I really don’t want or need my James Bond to be good at that sort of thing; hell, it should be beneath him.

That’s my 2 cents. I know there’s probably several examples from classic Bond movies that show him doing the things I’ve said that Bond shouldn’t be doing, which I guess is the problem. I have a mental image of what Bond should be, but it’s not the same as anyone else’s, because Bond has had so many personalities over the years.

180

This is being analyzed to death; and I can’t really add anything more insightful than what’s already been said. But why let that stop me! :slight_smile:

Here’s my take on it now that some time has gone by since I’ve seen it…
My reaction to the movie is similar to that of when Speed came out (Sandra Bullock, Keanu Reeves). Right after the movie was over I thought it was the best, most exciting movie I’d ever seen! And then a few weeks went by; I realized there just wasn’t a lot of substance to it.

And finally my litmus test of a good movie:
Would I watch Casino Royale again right now? Absolutely.
Would I watch Quantum of Solace again right now? Absolutely.
Would I watch Skyfall again right now? Hell No.