Snow-obscured speed limit signs?

Factual Questions
1

I was driving home from work last night at 2:30 AM (long story behind that one), and so was actually paying attention to the speed limit signs. Normally I’d just match speeds with the car in front of me. Now we just had some snow here, about a foot, and the town I was driving thru seemed to have used a snow blower thingie to clear the road, spraying the snow far into the woods on either side. Well, in the path of that blown snow was virtually every speed limit sign on the route, and they were solidly caked with snow, to the point where I couldn’t even read the foot-high letters. The roads themselves were perfectly fine.

So that got me wondering, can I be held responsible for speed limit signs that aren’t legible? Does that even count as posting a limit?

2

This is just my WAG, but I was always told that “failure to know the law is not a legal defense”.

Maybe they would say you should have known.

Just an observation from a guy hyped on caffeine.

3

Along with what CnoteChris said, when I was in the fabulous and glamorous Sears Driving School in high school, we learned what speed limits are in each zoning area. For example, residential or school areas have a 25mph limit, business areas can be 30 to 40mph, etc. We had to learn how to identify what zone we were in, so that if the speed wasn’t posted, we’d know how fast we could go.

So a non-posted or obscured speed limit probably won’t help you in the eyes of The Law.

4

I just asked my s.o. who’s a cop and he says yes – I said why - he said the driver is supposed to know (?) In his failed attempts to explain further, I take it he meant that drivers are supposed to have SOME idea of the speed limit regardless of what’s posted. Anyways, the answer is yes.

5

I was always told, Growing up in Central MN where snow occurs at least 6 out of 12 months, that when you can’t read the speed limits, go only as fast as weather permits.

and remember, you can get in trouble going too fast, but you can’t get in trouble for going too slow when it’s snowing.

6

What’s more important than the actual speed limit is whether or not the officer (and judge, if it comes to that) believes that your speed was not safe for the situation. Even if you can’t see the speed limit sign, if you’re exceeding the speed limit on a snowy road, you’re probably not driving safely. It’s also possible to be ticketed for driving below the speed limit, if the officer feels that your speed was nevertheless unsafe for the road conditions. It’s also theoretically possible, albeit unlikely, to fight a ticket for exceeding the speed limit if you can prove that your speed was appropriate.

7

A friend of mine was pulled over for speeding once. It was immediatly after a sign that was blocked by a tree limb. When we went to fight it in court, the judge found him guilty, probably with the “should have known” logic.

Interestingly, though, there turned out to be a large group of people there that were caught at that exact same location, by the same cop. There was enough testimony (along with photos) to show that he was using the sign blockage as a speed trap. The judge reversed the convictions for all, and I believe that the cop was disciplined…

So, just prove that the cop put the snow on the sign, I guess…

8

My mother had the same experience, sort of. My mom was pulled over for speeding by a cop who was pointing a radar gun right at her. She was speeding because she thought the radar gun was a real gun. She went back and took photos of the officer’s stance and location, took them to court, and beat the ticket.

Seems the same officer had written enough other questionable tickets that the judge reprimanded him on the spot.

Robin

9

Thanks. I figured as much. Good thing I didn’t get caught!

(Just to clarify, the weather was fine and the roads were clear – it had just stayed below freezing for the 5 days since it had originally snowed, so the stuff stuck to the signs hadn’t moved.)

10

State law and city ordinances govern the speed limits. If you’re within a city you must obey the city. In unincorporated areas, the state. Those laws always provide “unless otherwise posted.” Obviously you can’t post a sign under the ground or behind a large tree. It must be so that a person can reasonably see it. If it’s covered with snow and no one can reasonably see it, you can’t be required to follow that sign, just the general law.