I know there have been threads from time to time that have dealt with whether chiropractic is quackery. My basic thought (could be wrong) is that it depends on the doc and his/her concept of what s/he is doing. I think the cracking of joints can feel good, and it is probably therapeutic in some cases. Maybe in some cases, it makes a really big difference.
But here’s the point of this thread: the “adjustment” is really just cracking a joint, nothing more, right? It’s not as though the doc can move something around and just make it stick, especially with any kind of precision.
I did a promo thing with a chiropractor recently that was a ripoff IMO (though I didn’t do adjustments and kept my loss to a minimum). He took X-rays and said, “Your hip is rotated so and so, and your neck is off by so and so.” He said that his outfit could get those numbers where they should be (I called BS on this because I don’t believe that the X-rays were taken with that level of precision, nor would any X-rays of the “progress.”)
Mkay. Well, I crack my neck a lot. It feels good, and it feels as though I get just about every vertebra–so that’s all the doc could do anyway, right?
My actual problem is in my hips–which is why I was willing to hear the pitch in the first place. They probably really are out of alignment: my left hip gets a sore when I walk long walks (say, 8-10 miles). The cracking of the joints down there might really help, and I can’t do it myself, so that’s a case where chiropractic might do some good. But again, I would not expect any high-precision adjustment: just a rather crude treatment that might work a bit (not that I really need anything at this stage).
Does my interpretation of things make sense? Am I missing anything? Thanks for your thoughts!
When I went to the chiropractor, she cracked vertebrae in my neck that I didn’t even know existed. She cracked my back much more effectively than I’d ever be able to do on my own. I walked out of the office feeling pretty good, but it didn’t last more than a few days.* I’d say it’s possibly worth looking into for your ailment, but I haven’t been back. I don’t want to get addicted to it. My $15 copay isn’t bad, but over a year it’d be $780 if I went every week!
*There is a small but non-zero risk of stroke with cervical (neck) adjustments, which is also part of the reason I haven’t gone back.
This sort of statement should trip quackery alarms. Such “measurements” are bogus, as are claims of realigning “subluxated” joints. Whether or not chiro manipulations are of any benefit in relieving pain (at least temporarily) is another matter.
He/she could also tear your vertebral artery with a forceful manipulation, resulting in death or permanent disability. Not a pleasant prospect.
The bottom line is that neck cracking/manipulation by a chiro has little to no proven benefit. That makes any risk of serious complications (no matter how rare) completely unacceptable in my view.
I had a fairly serious injury years ago. Regular doctor blew me off. I went to a chiropractor. When I didn’t respond as he expected, he sent me in for xrays. He drove the push to get me in with the ortho doc who finally diagnosed me. In my two minutes with the specialist, I didn’t learn much. My chiropractor explained the diagnosis to me and helped me get to treatment. So, I guess it depends what your issues are, and how good your chiro is. Mine was a gem, and I was sad to see him retire.
Also, I got a deep muscle massage and some kind of sonic treatment, before each adjustment. Heavenly.
I, too, have only had possitive experiences with my chiro. She won’t adjust ( crack) until the muscle spasms are massaged out which leads to a wonderful hour long massage. For tennis elbow and frozen shoulder, I had ultra-sound treatments which cured those conditions in a short time. Walking around without tension in my neck muscles was wonderful.
Adjustment is not an exact science. However, the body always wants to heal. Over time and repetitive treatments, the adjustments stay put. When the adjustments stay put, muscle spasms vanish and pain disappears.
I think when you look at stroke statistics from neck adjustment ( I did not research) you must take into account that maybe some of those people had hidden conditions like an aneurism or congenital vascular defect, or a bad, bad doctor. I know some chiros just do adjustment, or lie you on a table where parts drop out to force a crack. I would never go to one of those.
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I think when you look at stroke statistics from neck adjustment ( I did not research) you must take into account that maybe some of those people had hidden conditions like an aneurism or congenital vascular defect, or a bad, bad doctor.
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Uh, huh - it was the patient’s fault or something a “bad, bad doctor” did, and nothing to do with the chiro forcefully wrenching a person’s neck until a major blood vessel broke and they suffered a stroke. :dubious:
Adjustments do not “take” over time. The perceived benefits are due to the laying on of hands which some people find therapeutic, and can also be had through massage or physical therapy (safer than having your spine forcefully “adjusted”).
I was referring to a bad bad chiro being the Doctor of Chiropracty. Not nonsense. Adjustments do take over time. Bone goes ‘out of line’. Mucle spasms around bone pulling it or securing it in its position (out of place). Fluid can form around the muscle spasm. Get the spasm loosened, the lactic acid out of the muscle. The body stops ‘sending’ fluid to the injured site. Muscle stops pulling bone out of whack. Bone stays where it should. No mystery. No voodoo.
A skilled chiro is gentle with the adjustment. If it doesn’t go, don’t crack it.
I have an acupucturist. He is a dr. of acupuncture. He co-wrote the text for training students. He likes to attach his needles to electical connections to tense the muscles around some injuries. Eventually, the spasms relax. Then disc or spine/neck healing can begin…as he explained it. No chi double talk. No mysticism. This is the same principle as my chiro and it can work. It has worked well, in fact.
I go to a sports chiro regularly (every two weeks) and she does way more than cracking my bones (and only those I feel comfortable with - if she’s going to crack my neck she ALWAYS asks first). She has also helped me with a hip issue by prescribing certain exercises and she pretty much fixed my tennis elbow with massage and adjustments.
There are certainly quacks in any area of medicine, and perhaps more in chiropractic than other areas, but there are chiro’s that do much more than just ‘crack your back’. I have a great one, she’s very holistic. YMMV of course.
My experience is similar. I stay away from the supplements they recommend, but I’ve had tremendous pain relieved almost instantly with adjustments. There’s a lot of woo associated with the practice, but a good chiropractor can do wonders.
Yeah, mine is very non-woo (apart from her being vegan, maybe). She doesn’t sell any supplements, etc. She owns her practice and has registered sports massage therapists (RMT’s) and a couple of practicing active release practitioners in the clinic.
Most back pain and such goes away on its own. I went to my doctor - he could tell by looking at my back that the muscles were pulled and he knew exactly which way I needed to get up to prevent this from happening. He told me there was nothing he could do - gave me Valium and Celebrex for pain - and said it would feel better in 3-4 days. It felt better exactly when he said he would. I would have bet big money there was no way that would happen.
Chiropractors are quacks (not necessarily on purpose) - period (for almost everything).
Of course if I went to a chiropractor - he would have done his/her adjustments - and they would have “set” - and then I would think he was a miracle worker.
People keep saying chiropractors work because of the placebo effect (not talking this thread in particular). Sorry, but I do not believe that is why it “works” in most cases. It works because in most cases - no matter how bad your pain feels - you will get better with nothing at all. That isn’t the placebo effect. The person is better. The chiropractor just had nothing to do with it.
Studies have been done - it doesn’t work for virtually anything. If it did - it would have showed up in the studies. Any treatment powerful enough for one person to be so confident that it works (would show up as working in even the smallest study).
Good luck. I counted eight misstatements in that one paragraph, my favorite being the suggestion that chiropractic “adjustment” somehow draws lactic acid out of muscles, which would be a neat trick (beyond the lack of any physiologic mechanism for such an effect, pain from exercise/trauma is not due to a mysterious lactic acid buildup).
It is unsurprising that a believer in chiro adjustments would also gravitate to acupuncture, which also postulates a laughable mechanism for its alleged results and relies heavily on testimonials and placebo effect.
Jacmannii, you need to practice your reading comprehension. I never said ‘adjustment’ rids a muscle of lactic acid. The chiro experience, as I know it, involves massage to help break up a muscle spasm. Just like you misread or misunderstood when I wrote ‘bad doctor’.you thought I was referring to an m.d. Why does my post threaten you so much?
Datax, you got Valium and Celebrex for your back. Yet, Valium is not a pain killer, nor is Celebrex. Valium can relax muscles and Celebrex is a non-steroid anti-inflammatory.
I’d cite effectiveness studies but they are all on Chiro sites so I doubt you would accept them as fact, although they all refer to valid studies.
[QUOTE=cococ173]
Jacmannii, you need to practice your reading comprehension. I never said ‘adjustment’ rids a muscle of lactic acid. The chiro experience, as I know it, involves massage to help break up a muscle spasm.
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So how exactly did I mischaracterize your statement? And would you like to supply us with some rational basis for these claims?
Where did I make any reference to M.D.s?
I’m not threatened - my own medical practice is unaffected by chiros doing neck adjustments.*
*apart from the possibility of one of their patients suffering a stroke from a vertebral artery tear and coming to autopsy, a situation I’d prefer to avoid.
If you’re having back pain/joint pain/muscle pain/whatever, it is most likely due to weak and/or underutilized muscles. Your best course of action is to hit the gym on a regular basis, where you should exercise all the major muscle groups, including upper and lower back.