Well, I got my first ever speeding ticket tonight–57.2 in a 45. I didn’t try to get out of it at the time–was polite to the officer, tried not to cry, even though I felt like it (didn’t do everything correctly, though; I forgot to turn off my motor and keep my hands where he could see them, I was too busy rummaging through my purse looking for my license.)
Anyway, my main concern is points on my license, which will make my insurance skyrocket. I’m a 20 year-old driving a sportcar (although I wasn’t tonight)–I really would like to keep it as low as possible. I have no trouble paying the fee, I just don’t want the points. When I asked the officer if there was a class or anything I could take to reduce my points, he told me that I need to send in my ticket, plead not guilty, and show up to the court, where they would reduce my speeding ticket to five mph over, and take away my points.
It sounds like a good deal to me; almost too good. Should I believe the officer?
Also, as I was looking over my ticket at home tonight, I noticed that the method used to catch me was VASCAR–so the miles they had been tracking me for, along with the time should have been on the ticket. The miles they’d been tracking me for were there, but the time wasn’t. It was completely blank. I was puzzled, but then I wondered if I could use this information to get off altogether. I’d really like to have been able to do the math myself and see if it matched up with the 57.2, but I can’t.
To reiterate, I’d be perfectly happy to take this “deal” that the policeman told me about, but I’m still a little confused by the mistake on my ticket. Should I point it out immediately when I go, only use it as ammo if they don’t let me plea bargain, or just forget it all together?
Call one of those get out of a speeding ticket lawyers. They charge you a fee, and use some wile or other to get you off. Check your phone book for these guys. Given the way contemporary Yellow Pages are organized, you should probably look under S for speeding ticket.
My son went to traffic court and when he got up in front of the judge he was respectful and courteous and the judge dismissed the ticket; you might luck out since this is your first one. I’ve gotten out of a couple of stops by playing the innocent, dumb, female. BUT, I am a very conservative and safe driver, and follow the speed limit 99% of the time so I don’t feel bad about this.
Personally, my experience with tickets:
I tried to pass a snowplow on the NY thruway and spun out and hit the guardrail. The officer, who came after the fact, gave me a ticket for speeding. I got out of it by citing, in writing to the judge, the time that I went though the toll gate and that I couldn’t have been going more than 35mph given the time that I had the accident, a couple of hours later, unless of course I had spent an hour sitting at a rest stop, which I hadn’t. He dismissed it. I never had to go to court because I was a bank examiner and traveling all over so he took the written complaint.
I was ticketed for parking in a loading zone and again fought it through the mail. I wrote to the DA and the judge dismissed it when I told him I was unloading stuff for the bank exam and the president of the bank would make a statement for me.
I was speeding going through a small village on Rt. 20 in NY after following a truck going 35mph for 10 miles. I sped up just as a state trooper was coming by in the opposite direction. I fought it by citing that the speed limit sign was covered by snow (it was); although not knowing the law is usually not an excuse, we went back and forth in the mail several times and finally the judge reduced it to 45mph in a 40mph zone from 60mph. I never got any points on my record.
I personally think that representing yourself and bugging the s**t out of them works very well.
I see no reason to suspect the officer of having some sinister agenda.
If this is your first moving traffic violation and you are respectful of the court and the police officer, I think it would be normal to have the level of charges reduced.
In some States, you can plead: “Guilty With An Explanation”, appear in court, and get the above results that way.
Good Luck!
If you admitted guilt when talking to the officer, you’re screwed.
DO NOT get a lawyer. You can represent yourself, just go to the library a check out a couple books. Look for Nolo especially.
Go request what’s called “discovery” on the officer’s notes, they will help you a lot. The officer will rely on these rather than memory.
It might be difficult to get out of a situation when you were allegedly going 12.2 mph over the limit. Find out if the area you were driving was Presumed or Absolute speed limit. Presumed is good for you. If you go to court, you can almost always get the fine reduced, but you’re worried about insurance, or course.
If you can find that there was something wrong with the VASCAR reading, attack it and the case will be dismissed.
I don’t know about there but here even with just regular radar they right in the amout you were doing over…no mathematical proof just their word they don’t even have to show you the radar if you ask. My first ticket I went to court and got off by doing community service in an ER (not bad fun actually) taking a driving class and the whole thing was taken entirely off my record. As far as fighting cause that isn’t on the ticket…my signature wasn’t on my ticket it didn’t matter…it tends to be their word against yours and normally the judge is gonna side with the cop.
IANAL, however I have successfully beaten several tickets in PA. The bottom of your citation should have a portion which is to be mailed in if you wish to dispute the verity of the charges and request a hearing. IIRC that is 3-5 days before the listed date on the citation. You need a friend in another state-think Alaska-who will send the request to the magistrate at the close of business on the last possible day, and then overnight the evidence of mailing to you, such that the charges must be dismissed owing to failure to proscecute. (Typically the officer will only attend if the citation is contested)
Without seeing the citation, I’m at a loss to advise you as to whether or not the citation was properly completed. If errors exist, then it may dismissable as the PA RCP/ROE statutes were not followed.
The officer may be willing to exchange a guilty plea for a reduced charge. A PA State Trooper dropped my charge from 80 to 61 MPH because I was clean and honest with him. It also helped that it was 3 AM and he and I were the only two people on that stretch of the turnpike-it wouldn’t work at rush hour.
Beyond that, you can request certification evidence for the Vascar unit, current evidence of the Officer’s training for said speed control device, photograph the area in which you were cited and ensure that the lines are an appropriate distance apart, and that signage for the area is correct, such that the speed limit is enforceable.
Part of me says good luck, yet most of me says slow down. Something I’ve learned with the passage of time.
One of the potential problems with disputing traffic tickets is that
Courts will always give more weight to the testimony of the officer, especially over someone who is young.
If you choose to fight it and lose, they are unlikely to lower the charge.
If you fight the ticket and lose, they are unlikely to permit you to take traffic school to get the charge off your record
Some states allow taking traffic school to erase points from your record entirely. There are even internet traffic schools that can be completed in a third the time regular ones take. Check with your local DMV on that- you might be better off paying the ticket and taking traffic school. That way you do not gamble with your driving record.
BTW, according to PA MVC, 3 points are assigned for exceeding the speed limit by 11-15 MPH per §3362. Even if the cite is reduced to a ‘too fast for conditions’ charge, 2 points will still be assessed. 3 points are removed for every year of violation free operation. The only way point removal class credit exists is if you’ve gone to 6, which is a bad place.
Hmm, must be a lot of speeding dopers as this comes up a lot. On amazon.com or BN.com you can find nice books called ‘Beat That Ticket’ or similiar. They are law books for the layperson, they explain what to do. Nolo.com also has some, they are a direct link.
You’ve already decided on a course of action so this may come too late, but one thing to bear in mind is that the police officer has ZERO authority to make binding deals with you. No matter what he says, it’s up to the judge to decide the punishment upon your conviction. It has been my experience that municipal court judges will reduce the punishment based on a no contest or guilty plea depending on your record, but will not based on your being convicted after a “not guilty” plea. My experience is based on appearances in front of four judges in three states and YMMV. Making decisions based on what the cop tells you is probably not a good idea.
If your main concern is points and the money isn’t a huge issue just get a lawyer. It will probably cost about $150-$200 and you won’t have to worry about it anymore. I have never seen anyone who hired a lawyer not get completely out of their first (or even second) speeding ticket.
I was pulled over for reckless one time, and the officer felt sorry for me and told me he wasn’t going to check this box that said I had to appear at court, that I could send in the fine and not go to court.
Except that reckless citations impose a mandatory court appearance.
Yes, they uphold the law, but cops are not lawyers and can get it wrong. Do your own research, don’t depend on what the officer said on the scene. He definately won’t remember it by the time your court date rolls around.
Also, while I was in court I did see this guy’s lawyer get a speeding charge dropped because they couldn’t find the certificate saying that the radar gun had been checked that day. Then they dropped a marijuana posession charge because they lost the chain of custody paperwork. He was still stuck with the DUI (his third!) and got three days in jail.
