…you don’t have sympathy for them. You don’t even believe them. You want to make “my life better?” Then do more. Start with accepting that the sort of assholish behaviour that Whedon excelled in has no place in Hollywood, it has no place in any workplace anywhere.
Directors don’t have total control. Producers do.
The two most glaring issues with Justice League aren’t direction; they’re editing and script. Justice League is evidence Snyder is a poor editor and writer. It isn’t evidence he’s a bad director.
What has Whedon actually done? He got angry at Charisma Carpenter and made fun of her religion after she got pregnant on the show (presumably throwing the season into turmoil).
He called a pregnant lady fat upon meeting her. He shouldn’t have done that. I’ve heard people say that with no intention of being mean, for what it’s worth.
He asked a black actor to use a catchphrase in a dour hellscape of a movie where the three main leads were soulless glum pricks.
He made some writers cry, and then joked about them in private.
He asked Gal Godot to say some lines she didn’t like.
He cheated on his wife.
Is this an exhaustive list? What am I missing? I have no reason to disbelieve anything here. So you’re wrong that I don’t believe them.
If he’s willing to change his behavior, personally, I’d have no trouble with him having a job again ever. If he’s not, then I hope he saved that Avengers money.
True. I’d say his direction is bad in that he gets the soulless performance for Superman out of probably the most charismatic dude in Hollywood aside from Hugh Jackman. And he’s in love with slo-mo, like in an unhealthy way. But yes, his real problems are the writing, editing.
Seeing as Snyder has gotten like a billion dollars given to him to make films where he’s writing and editing them, he’s certainly good at working the producers.
…as I said.
You don’t believe them. So I don’t believe you have sympathy for them.
To characterize what Whedon did to Carpenter as merely making “fun of her religion after she got pregnant” ignores the fact that he literally changed the story arc for an entire season based around the pregnancy to mock her, belittle her then ultimately fire her. That takes being a vindictive asshole to the nth degree. You ignored the statements from the other co-stars that don’t elaborate on the details but paint a picture of a toxic set where bad things happened that still have impacts on their lives twenty years after it happened.
That isn’t fucking normal.
You ignore the fact that anyone who is comfortable enough to say to a complete stranger coming in for a job interview that “she was fat” that this was some sort of an isolated incident. That he had “no intention of being mean.” It doesn’t fucking matter what his intentions were. It was a completely inappropriate thing for someone in management to say.
You completely ignored the stories from the writers room describing the joy Whedon took in making women writers cry. That sort of bullshit has no place in the workplace.
You ask “what has Whedon done?” Is that a serious question? Any one of these things would be enough to get him fired from your average workplace. Its more than enough that he should never be able to work in Hollywood again.
You believe the sanitised version of the stories. The narrative you are comfortable with that fits the fiction you’ve decided fits best.
But that isn’t the real story. You’ve been told the real story. You just don’t want to hear it.
I do believe everything there. So you’re wrong again.
…I said you believe the sanitised version. The cleaned up version where all Whedon did was "merely make “fun of her religion after she got pregnant.”
He did much much more than that.
Such as?
…LOL.
I touched on that in my previous reply. Did you read it? Carpenters original statement is what this thread is all about. Did you read it? Was the only thing she complained about was that Joss made “fun of her religion after she got pregnant?”
Is that it?
Was that all she said?
How about the other things the other cast had to say?
Why are you acting like this? Are you pretending, or have you actually not read the words that Carpenter actually wrote? Do you even know what this thread is all about?
I read the article. She called the workplace, “hostile and toxic.” She said she has a chronic physical condition owing to the stress.
She says, “He was mean and biting, disparaging about others openly, and often played favorites,” she wrote. When Whedon found out she was pregnant, she says, he asked the actress if she was “going to keep it” and “manipulatively weaponized my womanhood and faith against me,” Carpenter alleged."
I read the tweets when they came out. She was called into work at 1 am. He asked if she was going to keep it. Yeah, pretty asshole things. Is there something I’m missing?
…yep.
Assholes who are petty, vindictive who run toxic and hostile workplaces who do things like call pregnant women into work at 1AM in the morning shouldn’t be allowed in positions of power. The person who the cast and crew decided should never be allowed alone in the same room as one of the actresses should never work in Hollywood again. I don’t think this is an uncontroversial statement.
So you do think it’s a controversial statement?
This discussion is degenerating into personal attacks. I think most of what was going to be said about the events had been said. I’m going to close it. If some of you want to restart it in the pit, that would be okay.