Softball and the infield fly rule.

Factual Questions
1

I play in a pretty casual softball league during the summer. It’s an intramural league for grad students, and is completely self-officiated, with no proper umpires or anything like that. It is a slow-pitch league, with no balls and strikes. The batter just keeps swinging until he or she gets the ball in play. As i said, all pretty casual and fun.

Now, to the play i want to ask about. If i give an excessive amount of detail for the play, i hope it will be obvious why.

My team is in the field, and the other side has runners on first and second. There is one out. I’m fielding at shortstop. Now, unusually for a shortstop—and another indicator of the amateur nature of our league—i throw left-handed, so i’m wearing my glove on my right hand. The pitcher sends the ball in to the hitter, who hits a hard, low line drive just to my left. In order to catch the ball, i have to make a quick step to my left, and bring my right hand across my body and down to ground level. I grab the ball, backhanded, inches off the ground. I quickly spring up to see if i could catch one of the runners for a double play, but both had made it back on base.

Now, i’m not the world’s greatest shortstop, so i was happy to make the catch. The ball was travelling quickly, and i had to move myself pretty rapidly to get my glove down to it. All of my teammates applauded the effort.

The guy on second base for the other team said something like, “If you had dropped it and then picked it up again, you probably could have got a double play.”

But then a guy on my team, who is studying to be an ASA umpire, said, “No, it would have been ruled an infield fly.”

I told him that i thought that an infield fly had to be just that—a fly ball that could be caught with minimal effort. He said that any infield hit that could be caught with “ordinary effort” qualified as an infield fly when there are runners on first and second.

So, help me out here.

First, can a line drive be ruled an infield fly, if it goes straight to a fielder?

Second, in the case i described above, do you think the play i made could reasonably be described as “ordinary effort.” I don’t want to blow my own horn or anything, but i actually thought it was a pretty good catch.

I went to the ASA’s website, but i couldn’t seem to find a complete set of rules.

2

I’m not sure if the softball rules are the same as in Organized Baseball, but there a line drive is not an infield fly under the infield fly rule. However there is another rule prohibting the deliberate droping of a fly ball to get a double play in this situation. If you could have ben confident about blocking the ball instead of catching it and then turning a double play, that would have been OK.

3

The MLB rules are online. I would assume that for this rule, the ASA would use the same one as MLB.

No. Definition of infield fly from the MLB rules…

*An INFIELD FLY is a fair fly ball (not including a line drive nor an attempted bunt) which can be caught by an infielder with ordinary effort, when first and second, or first, second and third bases are occupied, before two are out. The pitcher, catcher and any outfielder who stations himself in the infield on the play shall be considered infielders for the purpose of this rule. When it seems apparent that a batted ball will be an Infield Fly, the umpire shall immediately declare “Infield Fly” for the benefit of the runners. If the ball is near the baselines, the umpire shall declare “Infield Fly, if Fair.” The ball is alive and runners may advance at the risk of the ball being caught, or retouch and advance after the ball is touched, the same as on any fly ball. If the hit becomes a foul ball, it is treated the same as any foul. If a declared Infield Fly is allowed to fall untouched to the ground, and bounces foul before passing first or third base, it is a foul ball. If a declared Infield Fly falls untouched to the ground outside the baseline, and bounces fair before passing first or third base, it is an Infield Fly. On the infield fly rule the umpire is to rule whether the ball could ordinarily have been handled by an infielder not by some arbitrary limitation such as the grass, or the base lines. The umpire must rule also that a ball is an infield fly, even if handled by an outfielder, if, in the umpire’s judgment, the ball could have been as easily handled by an infielder. The infield fly is in no sense to be considered an appeal play. The umpire’s judgment must govern, and the decision should be made immediately. When an infield fly rule is called, runners may advance at their own risk. If on an infield fly rule, the infielder intentionally drops a fair ball, the ball remains in play despite the provisions of Rule 6.05 (L). The infield fly rule takes precedence. *

Line drives are specifically excluded from being an infield fly, so that’s not relevant. However, section 6.05(l) of the MLB rules states…

A batter is out when…<snip>An infielder intentionally drops a fair fly ball or line drive, with first, first and second, first and third, or first, second and third base occupied before two are out. The ball is dead and runner or runners shall return to their original base or bases;

You could have tried letting it hit the ground first though… that section continues…

APPROVED RULING: In this situation, the batter is not out if the infielder permits the ball to drop untouched to the ground, except when the Infield Fly rule applies.

4

Thanks for the input. I was aware of the infield fly rule for baseball, and i knew that the infield fly rule wouldn’t have applied to my situation in baseball.

But one of the reasons for starting the thread is that i didn’t know whether baseball’s infield fly rule works in exactly the same way as softball’s infield fly rule. I couldn’t find a rule book on the ASA website, but i know that softball rules are not always the same as baseball rules—hence the two different sports.

5

Heck, tag the runner and a good turn at second gets you a triple play.

6

Not in this situation.

A few years back, I was playing in (what I assume to be) the exact same league as MHendo describes here.

From shortstop, I snagged a line drive near sceond, tagged the runner who had left the bag, and was running down the runner who had left first. Instead of catching him, which I could have done, I flipped the ball to the first baseman and missing my place in the record books for the unassisted triple play. I offer this as a warning to anyone who might be in the same situation someday. If you don’t attempt to run that guy down, you’ll regret it for years.

Also: one day I was at an O’s game where, with a runner on first, the batter popped up to Roberto Alomar at second. The batter kind of stood near the batter’s box as Alomar moved under the ball. Alomar let the ball drop, threw to second for one, and Ripken threw to first in front of the runner with the VERY late start.

7

The infield fly rule is probably the greatest source of dispute in amateur baseball and softball leagues. The point that is most often missed is that the rule only applies if the umpire declares an infield fly while the ball is in the air. Unless the umpire specifically invokes the rule, it’s not in effect. The umpire can make the call or choose not to make it at his discretion. it can’t be applied retroactively

8

I’m sorry. I didn’t mean unassisted. The OP spoke of a double play; I was just pointing out that it could be a triple.

9

This suggests that there’s no way my situation could have been an infield fly rule, then.

Because my belief is that for the rule to be in effect, the umpire has to call out something like “infield fly, if fair.”

Well, in the case i described in the OP, the ball was hit hard enough that it would have been firmly ensconced in my glove by the time the umpire finished the first half of that instruction.

10

I was just being a wise-ass because he stated that there was one out. :smiley:

11

Oops. My bad.

12

All the written versions of the infield fly rule I’ve seen (both of them, I guess) say that it applies when both first and second base are occupied. First base, I can see. Why does it require someone on second base too? Is it because a fly ball takes a while to come down, so a 6-4-3 double play isn’t likely (the runner will have made it to first already)?

13

There’s a similar rule in softball. When I get home I’ll look it up and post it here, but from my recollection, the batter would have been out, and you wouldn’t have had a shot at a double play.

14

The “if fair” appendage is generally used only if the ball looks like it’s close to the foul line and might or might not be a fair ball.

Technically, the umpire should usually call “Infield fly, batter’s out.”

No rule gives you more headaches than this. Honestly, as an ump, I dread infield fly situations, because it is utterly certain that someone will complain about something. People don’t understand the rule, or they think the ball is dead, or they think the runners don’t have to tag up if the ball’s caught, or they think it can be applied retroactively. It’s just nuts.

Curtc: Exactly.

mhendo, your acquaintance was clearly wrong in specifically claiming that situation was an “infield fly” rule, but I think he had the right idea; obviously he knew about Rule 6.05(l), which is SORT of like the infield fly rule, and while his terminology was wrong the jist of what he was saying was right.

15

First of all there’s no way the play you described could have been an infield fly. “Ordinary effort” pretty much means it’s a pop up that you can settle under. Contrary to the belief of many coaches, that could possibly be a ball hit behind the infielder; as long as they can move backwards (again, with “ordinary effort”) and catch the ball it could be an infield fly.

Regarding anson2995’s comment about it can’t be applied retroactively, that’s not entirely correct. While it’s correct you cannot change your judgement retroactively, if you had an infield fly situation that you did not call because you forgot, or if you thought there was two outs or something like that, then you can go back and correct that.

RickJay, I rarely have any problem with the infield fly rule. In my experience you have a lot more explaining to do over obstruction / interferience… especially since ASA changed their wording on the obstruction rule where you must have the ball in the glove before you can block the base, as opposed to “about to receive”.

As a side note, intentionally letting a ball drop is legal in ASA, and you can do it What you can’t do is guide (intentionally drop) the ball to the ground. Even if there’s a runner on first only you can call an out. (you can’t intentionally set up a double play in this way)

e3

16

You got it. The batter would have little to no trouble getting to first, so should an infielder let the ball fall, he’d get the runner out at second, but not the batter-runner at first. When the play was over, you’d have one more out either way, though you would have a different baserunner. With a runner on second, you’d be able to turn an easy double play, leaving only the batter-runner safe on first.

17

But if i had made a genuine play at the ball, and dropped it completely unintentionally, then i could have picked it up and turned a double play. Correct?

18

Theoretically, yes. It depends what it looks like to the ump.

19

The wording of the rule in softball is practically identical to the one Ass for a Hat quoted, so I won’t bother reproducing it here. It’s Rule 7-8i if anyone’s interested in looking at it.

20

[hijack]
Do they have an infield fly rule in kickball, too? :wink:
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