Our roof has peaks and valleys. Because of the configuration of the roof, a lot of water gets directed to one downspout. Even though this downspout is on the south side of the house, in the winter it freqently freezes up. (We live in Chicago suburbs. Winter temps below zero F are not uncommon.) When that happens, we can get water damage in the house. We’d like to resolve this problem once and for all.
The most common fix is to use some kind of heat tape or the like either outside or within the downspout. However, we do not have an outside outlet on that side of the house, so we’d have to get one installed.
My husband thinks I’m nuts, but I thought, “Hey! Solar!” The collection panel could be on the roof, but would have to be some distance from the downspout, which is at the bottom of a valley. I think it might be doable.
Would this work? Would the snow that causes the downspout to freeze prevent the solar panel from generating enough power? (This is the main reason husband thinks I’m nuts.) If it would work, any idea on how to find someone to design and install the system?
I know it would likely be pretty expensive, but having an outlet installed outside (and fixing whatever is needed to do this inside) won’t be all that cheap, and we really like the idea of not having to use (and pay for) electricity to operate it.
I think you’ll probably spend more doing it this way than getting an electrician out there. It’s not just the solar panel. You’ll also need a battery possibly an inverter, and probably more solar panels/batteries than you think to be able to provide 100ish watts for any length of time, especially if you’ll be doing it when the sun isn’t shining on the panel and/or at night.
You might look into getting an extension cord long enough to get to an outlet and using that. Run the heat tape so the plug is at the bottom of the downspout instead of the top, get a heavy duty extension cord that’s rated for at least as many amps as the heat trace will draw and do what you can to make sure everything is water tight and not in a place where it’s going to get run over or hit with a shovel/snowblower.
I think I was enamored with the “greenness” of solar, but I suspect the system won’t use that much electricity. Plus of course the environmental impact of the manufacture of solar panels.
Any thoughts on how we can automate the system so that it will automatically kick on when the outside temp gets below a certain temp? Although come to think of it, even if the outside temp gets low the system won’t need to turn on unless there’s enough melting snow to maybe freeze the downspout.
If you want one that turns it self on and off only when there is snow (or ice) present, you need to upgrade beyond what you can get at Home Depot.
Some of the more industrial brands have sensors you put on the roof that monitor the outdoor temp and whether or not snow/ice is present. Raychem is a well known brand in the HVAC industry and I believe they have a system like that.
However, it would probably be easier to get a timer. You can get a countdown timer that would allow you to, when needed, turn it on for a set period of time (ie 2 hours, 6 hours etc) and it’ll shut off so you don’t have to go back out. There are also remote controlled switches which would allow you to turn it on and off from inside.
That’s the thing about energy saving products. The real savings require some scaling up. Sure, replacing some lights with LEDs is good, but you’re talking about saving a dollar or two a month.
I don’t know how much heat trace you’re going to need (are you just doing the downspout, or the eves as well), but if you just did the downspout and we call it 15 feet, that’s going to be about 90 watts/<1 amp. Running that for a few hours at a time, a few times per month, only during winter and you’re probably talking about 5 to 10 dollars a year.
Have you cleaned your gutters and downspout recently? Usually a freezing downspout means some kind of partial blockage that slows down the water flow. Or have you got a bunch of elbows on the spout? Those can act as sources of freezing as well.
It’s always better to fix the problem passively than to use heat to keep a poor flowing downspout clear. You might consider calling in an expert to evaluate the design of your spouts and see if they can be changed to prevent freezing.
When there is sun, the snow on your roof melts, and runs down the downpipe, which is melted, because of the sun. Seems perfect. You don’t need any kind of inverter or energy storage for this. Of course, the question is, how well will it work? Solar panels are typically black, and work extremely well at cold temperatures: snow is white, and is slow to melt even on bright sunny days. But if your panel is covered with snow, it won’t work at all. I think it would be worth trying if you have a fairly vertical south-facing wall you can mount the panel on.
It’s not about clogged gutters or downspouts. It’s about gradual ice buildup.
Here in the Chicagoland area (and Midwest in general) we get very sunny days with air temps well below freezing. The snow will absorb enough energy from the sun for the top layer to start melting. As this water flows through the gutters it loses its thermal energy and freezes creating a thin layer of ice on the surface of (most importantly for this discussion) the downspout. As more meltwater flows down the spout the ice grows, layer by layer. Freezing from the outside in. It isn’t very long before the downspout it a solid block of ice. It’s the same process by which icicles are formed. This is exacerbated by the fact that the bottom of the spout is often buried under snow, so an ice clog can also build up from the bottom.
Yes it could work, and if you design the system with a big enough solar panel installed on a post at an angle that would prevent snow accumulation, you could generate enough power. BUT,
You would need an inverter and probably a small battery bank to store the electricity generated to keep the ice from forming at night or to melt what has already formed during dark hours.
As mentioned, the issue is gradual ice build-up over time. You get a little solar radiation which melts a little snow which runs down the very cold downspout; some makes it to the bottom and out and some freezes in the pipe along the way, especially near the bottom elbow where the flow changes from horizontal to near-vertical. If you don’t have energy going in to melt this ice (which tends to form most when it gets dark and the melt water flow tapers off), you’ll build up ice.
At any rate, you are probably overestimating the cost of having an additional outlet installed, as well as overestimating the cost/value of the electricity you’d generate with a panel. You’re talking about a few dollars worth of electricity for the entire winter, and an hour or two max for an electrician to install an outlet for you. With a panel you will still be using electricity, and while the power it’s self is free you’re now paying for 100% of the infrastructure to generate it. Using the power service you already have, that’s a shared cost.
If it’s possible, make sure the problem downspout gets direct sunlight. You said it’s on the Southside, but is it hiding behind a tree or bushes? Also make sure the bottom is not buried in the snow…
I have a troublesome spout on the north side of my house and no matter how vigilant I am, it will freeze up at some point during the winter.
For some reason, the downspouts on the north side aren’t as big a problem. (Well, once 20+ years ago we had ice dams – big problem!)
The really problemsome downspout is on the south. I think it’s because of the way the roof is – a large section has no other downspout to go to, and there’s no way to put in an other downspout for it.
It gets some direct sunlight, but not all day. Unfortunately it’s shaded by the house next door, so there’s not much we can do.
Thanks. I’ll bring it up with Mr. Middon. We spent large sums earlier this year to replace the roof and several windows, so we want to be sure we don’t have any water problems.