Some Facts of Lucid Dreaming

wissdok, I have heard of this a couple of times before. (ever hang out at the LD4all forum?) Being a more go with the flow guy I never really try to be a super magician in my LDs, just subtle pushes usually.

If you are actually looking for tips to make the dream experience surprising again why not try the reverse of LD inducing techniques. During the day practice cultivating an attitude of non-interference to your scenery and take paths that are presented to you. Do some completely form free day-dreaming.

To be a little critical:

it doesn’t sound like you’ve taken much initiative to keep your dreams interesting. All you seem to be doing is controlling mundane dreams. Have you lived a dream as an animal? Watch a long sequence from 3rd person? Do a meditation sitting? Don’t think “amusement park” think “I control the universe”

originally posted Yohan Go
Do you mind if I write a novel based on your experience?

That would be wonderful, as I would need a ghost writer. Sorry to all… that my earilier post was way too long, full of grammar errors, and violated every rule of the English language. I am from the south, where the fact I can sometimes read, write, and type makes me a Rhodes scholar. My real excuse is that I normally write when I am on the job, and often, my idiot supervisor makes me do something called “work.” When will these employers realize that all work and no play makes Jack a dull boy?

Sorry again for my poor writing style.

Thanks wissdok. I’ll let you know how it turns out. I think it is interesting material for a short novel and it sure does rip through my imagination. But it won’t be originaly in english as it is not my first spoken language. E-mail in profile or just bump this thread in six months or so.

I don’t dream lucidly often, but I have been doing it a long time, as I mentioned in another thread. I don’t know who is closer to unique, but I don’t have wissdok’s problems.

Perhaps it is because do not tend to have nightmares, so I haven’t ever exercised so much control. I can only think of a few instances off-hand. If the nightmare was something happening to me, I either switched to the third person, so that it wasn’t me in the scary situation, or took over the role of another person in the dream. If it was something happening to a loved one, I often deliberately exited the dream. (For me, this can be hard. I’ve even woken up unable to move.)

Perhaps it is because I don’t often try to control my dreams. Pleasurable dreams are just that, pleasurable, so why change them? (If Ashleyy Judd is there, and I wanted Sandra Bullock, she’d probably be there already!) Again, I don’t have many scary dreams, so I generally only take control to make my dreams more interesting, and occassionally less nonsensical. (Yeah, right, Ashley Judd and Sandra Bullock just jumped me out of the blue. Let’s apply some set up here…)

I’ve had a few lucid dreams, among them finding myself speaking with my dead father, and this has flipped the lucidity switch. I know in my dream that the words spoken by him are not his but mine, so I wake up — no fun at 3 a.m.

This reads like a script to the movie The Butterfly Effect; despite all efforts, you cannot make it right. After 25 years of such failures, perhaps you have even less control than you acknowledge. Complete lucidity would prevent the magic altogether, as it did in the dreams I had of my father. This could hint as to how to diminish or end the lucid dreams, so there is hope.

It also suggests that since the lucidity is far less than perfect, you may have dreams without it. There is no way you could know. Are there no mornings when you wake up with no thought of the night’s dreams?

Do you know why that happens and how to break out of it with less effort?

No, but I’ve read that it is not uncommon when woken up from deep sleep.

I occasionally have what I would lucid dreams, but rarely have the sort of ultimate power a lot of people seems to associate with that term. If I’m conscious that I’m dreaming, and can control my own actions to approximately the same degree as when I’m awake, does that not count as lucid dreaming?
I enjoy these dreams a great deal because I can explore the dreamscape as much as I like and still be surprised and emotionally involved in it without having to worry about looking after every detail of it.
A mild but recent example would be a dream about dreams I had a few weeks ago. I was in a large conference room where a series of speakers were describing their dreams. One of them included my dead grandfather, which I think triggered my lucidity. I realised I was dreaming but could still sit back and listen to the speakers, knowing it was all coming from my own subconscious but not feeling the need to take control. Two friends of mine were in the audience too and I remember explaining to them that this was dream and told them to remember it so I get in touch in the morning and see if we had psychic powers or not. :slight_smile: They were a bit confused at first but they came to accept it.
I never get round to raising the subject with those friends but I’m still curious to find out about their own memories from that night.

Already been done, more or less; Better Than Life in the Red Dwarf series - the characters take part in an immersive VR game called Better Than Life (the demand for which was so high that the crowds at the launch had to be controlled by the deployment of rubber nuclear weapons) - Cat, Kryten and Lister all find the game to be exactly as promised - utopia in every possible sense. Rimmer - the eternal loser - ends up creating his own personal hell.

The movie “Waking Life” is a Lucid Dream story as well, though not about someone with total control.

Apparently because of this:

It used to happen to me quite often, and it was extraordinarily hard to break the paralysis. In reading about it, I learned that by moving the eyes first, the paralysis was easier to break. It proved so for me.

I’d just like to say what an interesting thread, and it offers a lot of answers for many of my questions which have baffled me for years.

I’m not a frequent lucid dreamer, infact I’m not even sure they can be classed as lucid at all. The first dream i can remember must have occurred in the first few years of my education. This took the form of me being in class, getting shouted at for doing something (probably sleeping :wink: ). Then i just stand up, exclaim “wait a minute this is just a dream, you cant tell me what to do” and then drift through the wall. The wierd thing is, both the classroom interior and the outside of the school are almost photographicly correct with real life. Despite the fact i’ve never drifted through a wall at my old school, everything seems to be in the correct place. Most dreams i can walk out of my bedroom door and end up at the mall or something, they rarely “match up” with reality.

Anyway this seems remarkably similar to other posters dreams, most noteably Leviosaurus’ post about the bully.
The phenomenon occured more recently but in a slightly more obscure manner, about a year or two ago. Again i was in class, higher up the educational ladder this time, and my Maths teacher (yes, I’m English) was talking about nothing as usual, and i just said something along the lines of “F–k this i’m off to sleep” and i fell asleep on the desk. This resulted in me having another dream.

Personally i find these kind of dreams fascinating, and the sense of power you get from blatantly falling asleep in school is…well…empowering i guess.

OK that’s my personal experience over now i’m gonna join in and discuss various theories.

Personally I reckon lucid dreams are the minds way of letting us explore he world around us without actually disturbing anything (or for that matter * damaging * anything), in the same way as we play video games or experiment with computer simulations or “sandboxes” as they’re sometimes known as.
This sort of mental “sandbox” lets us explore the world which we live in and experiment with different social and maybe even physical situations.
I’ve heard about “wish-fulfilment” dreams, well, maybe this is the mind letting us have control over our own dreams and what we wish for.

I’m rambling now…

I’ve noticed in the few LD’s i’ve had, everything is VERY realistic. this includes peoples faces, environment, and as i mentioned physical properties of things. Maybe next time Wissdok has a lucid dream he could build a domino rally or somthing and see if it works :D. I wish i could have more lucid dreams myself but from what i’ve read here it doesn’t seem like such a good thing.

I keep promising myself not to respond because I am so long-winded, but yet I can’t help myself. I want to thanks those that have responded. My original post was just to let people know that LD was often presented with only the “rosy” saleable image, while, like anything else…nothing is all good. I was, by no means, trying to claim that people shouldn’t try LD, but that it can become so common it is no longer fun.

On the power of lucid dreaming, I earlier listed some examples of some of my dreams. The fact that I didn’t use Godlike power wasn’t meant to show I don’t . It just that it is hard to remember all 25 years of my dreams, and the ones I do remember years later had some special meaning to me. As I gained more experience I have felt more relax and my dreams reflex that. My normal dreams now don’t involve trying to push “the envelop.” Like I said before, control has a trade-off, more control you have (or I, in this case), less you dream. In general I try now to go with the flow. In that sense I am lucky, that I have enough willpower that I don’t micromanage every detail. As the earlier writer mentioned about his late father, I don’t know if he meant that he directly put words into his father’s mouth or in the greater realm of dreaming, his mind …his words. If it were the former, I would consider that micromanaging. I generally chose to set the mood, environment, or overall feelings in a dream, but rarely go to the trouble to script the dialogue of the dream. In my earlier story about my girlfriend dream, I wanted some emotional element that I couldn’t get with a completely scripted dream. The frustrating part wasn’t what happened in the dream, but how easy it was to end it and start over. Outside of dreams like that, I generally ignore problems that come up in dreams, which in a way, is also control.

To stress the difference, here are two examples to help explain about control.

>Some years ago, a dream started with me in my house. While deciding what I wanted to do, I noticed that I didn’t like the view from my front window. I chose to have my house rotate 90 degrees to the right. But now I had a view of my neighbor’s shrubbery. I kept turning my house 90 degrees until I was back to the front. I then realized that I would much rather live in an apartment in metropolitan area. So I exited my house and walked across the street into my new skyscraper condo complex. Once I was in to lobby I found a staircase going down, but yet I had no desire to live below ground. So I changed the staircase to going up. Then I thought, “I want to live near the top and I am lazy, so I need an elevator instead.” Out goes the stairs and in comes an elevator. I enter the elevator and there are only 7 floors. Because I wanted to live on the 110th floor, I had to change that too. Having never since an elevator with 110 buttons, my elevator had floors 1 thru 7 plus a 110th floor button. I exited the elevator on the 110th floor to find a long hallway with one door. As I like neighbors I added 10 doors to each side of the hallways. As I entered my apartment I noticed it was just like the Odd Couples. For simplicity, I walked through the apartment and redesigned the furniture, the layout, and the view based on different television shows that I remembered. The point to this example is by the end of the dream I designed everything but had not interacted with even a single person, had any event take place, or even have time to do anything else.

.> I chose one night to show my military leadership ability by not only taking on Erwin Rommel, but also George Patton at the same time. I landed my African mercenary army in Marseille, France sometime in 1944. I split my army into two forces, one going toward Normandy-Belgium (Patton) and another going toward Frankfurt (Rommel). I didn’t plan any strategy just estimating that I would have more than a million men against each. I knew that I could easily empty Africa of all its’ people if I needed to. I did not worry about how many tanks, planes, or artillery I had…just pure numbers. Before my armies reached their objectives, I got a report that Rommel was attacking me from Northern Italy. I ignored it. As my armies progressed, so did Rommel. I could hear gunfire and artillery getting closer. By the time my armies reached their objectives, the German army was invading my port city Headquarter. Once I got word that my armies had taken their objectives, I exited my HQ into the middle of a combat ridden street(Germans everywhere) and announced to the world I had won. Combat stopped and shortly both Patton and Rommel arrived to sign their surrender.
*{before someone writes about my version of history…I was dreaming so I had no ability to check a history book for historical accuracy.}
*

As you can see the second one was far more entertaining, and yet it took far less planning and control.

Wissdok :slight_smile:

:cool:

:wally

I use dreams to create by. I draw all that I see in my dreams and sell them ultimate creations that are made out of them. Many times I will get caught talking to a person and at the same time I’m seeing where each object is to go and fill it in while they are looking at the drawing at the same time, trying to figure out “How I knew what to put there” with my mind drawn towards on what our communication is about at the same time.