songs about underage girls

Hi all! I am the prof who first asked the question! Let me thank Phungi for posing the question, and all on the board for providing more material than I could hope for! I spent much of today listening to a lot of old and new songs, each registering in its own way on the “creep-o-meter.”

I teach English and Gender Studies and have been thinking lately about a perceived paradox today regarding youth and sexuality: namely, that on one hand it is more taboo than ever – and the most reprehensible of modern figures is that of the “pedophile” – and that on the other hand children’s sexuality is more visible and emphasized than ever before.

I was in the car listening to the radio and Foreigner’s “Hot Blooded” with its line “Are you old enough?/Will you be ready when I call your bluff?” hit me as one of many examples of a kind of celebratory tone to what (today) would be considered both morally and legally questionable behavior by the “adult” involved. It’s hard to imagine such a line – so straight and un-ironic – in a popular song today. So I started thinking about the recirculation of these “classic” songs on the radio and the overt and subtle messages that contain. (I was talking to a class about changing meanings in literature over time, and ended up citing this “hot-blooded” example in the context of literary work once shunned as “sex fiction” in 1899, and now considered a very popular and widely acclaimed work of feminine sexual emancipation.)

As one commentator here suggested, things get complicated very quickly. First, as most readers know, you can’t assume the speaker in a poem (or “song” as the case may be) has a direct relationship to the “author” or “songwriter.” Several of the songs posted today seem clearly to be dramatizations – the Kinks’ “Art Lover,” and Oingo Boingo’s “Little Girls” both for example seem like they establish “distance” between author and speaker. To put it another way, it’s hard to claim Nabokov was a sicko for writing Lolita. These songs work like critiques of the impulses and behaviors in question, though (as another person noted) they nevertheless evoke the fantasy and may “titillate” on those grounds.

In songs where the “speaker” is of undetermined age, there is another difficulty. The speaker in “You’re Sixteen” (“you’re beautiful and your mine”) – despite his subtle possessiveness – may BE a sixteen year old “speaker.” People are also right to point out that when the artist or speaker is 19 and the subject in the song is 17, it may be no great cause for alarm. So the strictly legal dividing line between appropriate and inappropriate is perhaps not enough to single out a particular song as morally or culturally problematic. Though once again this does put the fantasy in play.

Anyway, there is a lot going on. I started out most interested in the “Hot Blooded” variety – the “un-ironic,” to which Aerosmith, Benny Mardones, the Knack and others add – but again thanks for opening up new issues and ideas, because a lot of these examples raise new issues about artworks and reception, recirculation and changing values, etc. Spinal Tap’s parody of these kinds of songs shows perhaps that people were thinking about this kind of stuff in the heyday of its representation, and that reminds me too of “Serge’s Song” from the (fictional) teenage band The Paranoids in Thomas Pynchon’s The Crying of Lot 49 (1966), when bandmember Serge loses his teenage girlfriend to the handsome (adult) actor Metzger. Serge’s only choice is to go younger himself:

What chance has a lonely surfer boy
For the love of a surfer chick,
With all these Humbert Humbert cats
Coming on so big and sick?
For me, my baby was a woman
For him she’s just another nymphet;
Why did they run around, why did she put me down,
And get me so upset?
Well as long as she’s gone away-yay,
I’ve had to find somebody new,
And the older generation
Has taught me what to do—
I had a date last night with an eight-year-old,
And she’s a swinger just like me,
So you can find us any night up on the football field,
In the back of P.S. 33 (oh yeah),
And it’s as groovy as it can be.

Thanks again, and keep em coming! This really is making me think and write about all kinds of new issues!

Pretty sure you were.

Francine by ZZ Top.

Oh Carol, by Smokie. Lyrics (from memory, so help me - I hated the song but for a while it was played constantly),

Ewww.

Welcome!

Hey, prof. We talk English real good in these parts. You don’t need all those words in quotes. We get it from the context.

And thank you for fulfilling my dreams of upbraiding a professor for language use!

My contribution – Cousin Dupree by Steely Dan. The ages are a little vague, but the pervy incestuousness isn’t.

That’s a cheating song, not a deflowering song.

“I don’t know and I don’t care what made you tell him you don’t love him any more”.

I think the point is that the narrator is a better lover than the previous partner. Kind of the opposite point of view to Madonna’s “Like A Virgin”.

Welcome to the SDMB, Professor. Please stay. All are welcome here, highly educated people doubly so. I’m sure your knowledge will make a useful contribution to our community.

In the studio version on Beggar’s Banquet she is 15, but on the live version on Get Yer Ya-Ya’s Out she is 13, and presumably this is what they normally sang in concert. The studio version was “cleaned up” a little, I think.

I don’t recall exactly how old Bill Wyman’s girlfriend was, but I am pretty sure she was at least 16, which is the age of consent in Britain. (Of course, the relationship was still considered shocking.)

“She Hangs Out” - The Monkees

How old’d you say your sister was?
How old’d you say your sister was?
You know you better keep an eye on her.

I always thought that song was about an inappropriate workplace relationship (i.e., she starts fucking her boss).

And Aaron Pritchett has ‘Eighteen’, which might be pushing it, but the first verse has him so struck by a girl that he wishes he was a kid again, so I think it kinda fits. (When I went looking for the song, I thought it was ‘Sixteen’)

From Wyman’s Wikipedia page:

“On 2 June 1989, aged 52, Wyman married 18-year-old Mandy Smith whom he had been dating since she was 13 and he was 47 years old. According to Smith, their relationship was sexually consummated when she was 14 years old. Their relationship was the subject of considerable media attention. The marriage ended in spring 1991, although the divorce was not finalised until 1993. In 1993, while Wyman was still married to Smith, Stephen, his son from his first marriage, became engaged to Smith’s mother.”

I suspect they just threw that line in to make the song seem (slightly) less creepy. Note also the will-you-still-love-me, baby-I’ll-love-you-even-more lyrics toward the end. Sure sounds like a deflowering to me.

Old 97s - Doreen

When I first met Doreen she was barely seventeen
She was drinking whiskey sours in a bar
The way she knocked 'em back I would have had a heart attack
But as it is I let her drive my car…

Maggie May - Rod Stewart

ETA oh sorry - thread’s about underage girls. Still, doesn’t hurt to consider the opposite perspective

My guess is they’re the same age - there’s the line in the chorus “We used to play when we were three.”

Young and Naive is a woman singing about a 19 year old boy, but the gender and age could easily be adapted to an underage girl.

Thirteen - Big Star

I always assumed “Only The Good Die Young” is about minors because of the line " Catholic girls start much too late…"

Billy Idol “Sweet Sixteen”.
…which was released when I was fifteen. :eek: God, I feel so old now! :wink:

Neil Sedanka’s Happy Birthday Sweet Sixteen.. Today those lyrics seem really creepy.