Sorry ladies, you can't hang with the SEALS

[Psychopants]

My position, for the record:

Let women try.
Do not alter the evaluation criteria.
Deal with the outcome.

In the meantime, shut the fuck up. Nobody knows how many will try, why they will, or if they will succeed.
The. End.

[WhyNot]

Well, not SEALS yet, but they’re on their way…

Four Women Pass Marine Corps Infantry Test For The First Time

[Sicks_Ate]

Unless it’s gotten exponentially harder in the last 20 years, enlisted infantry training is still nowhere near the level of SEAL training.

I think that using this to say that “they’re on their way” to being SEALS is a gross mis-characterization.

Infantry Officer Course is a better standard, though by no means equivalent…and as far as I know, no female Marine has passed it yet.

[Not_Carlson]

Kyewel!

From the article:

The four women who made it, however, will still have to face a new requirement that they do a certain number of pull-ups as part of their final fitness test. If they can do it, they will likely graduate next month, putting the ball in Congress’s court to officially open the infantry to women.

I was curious about the pullups requirement and found this.

Starting Jan. 1, women will be required to complete three pullups in order to pass the PFT. If they want a perfect score, they’ll need to do eight.

I was kind of expecting a higher number of pullups to be required, but then I doubt I could manage even three.

I hope congress approves the change.

[Lasciel]

@Sicks_Ate

Infantry Officer Course is a better standard, though by no means equivalent…and as far as I know, no female Marine has passed it yet.

That’s a true statement, but a misleading one. From what I can tell, only two have even tried it so far. Estimates range that about a quarter of men can’t hack the Officer Course, so being charitable, that means that probably between 50 and 75% of women can’t hack it. It’s not even remotely surprising that out of two applicants, neither of them made it through.

With the low numbers so far just in the basic infantry course, it’s going to take a while for the numbers to rack up high enough that someone makes it through the officer course. For infantry, we’re at 4 of 7 women (of 19 originally) that made it through, which is a pretty decent percentage in my opinion. Officer is going to be a lot lower, so the numbers attempting have to be much higher before someone makes it through.

[Sicks_Ate]

@Lasciel

That’s a true statement, but a misleading one. From what I can tell, only two have even tried it so far.

I thought there were 4, but I was wrong about that too:

Women began reporting to IOC on a voluntary basis last year. Counting the latest class, 10 women have attempted IOC, and none has passed. Nine failed to make it through the combat endurance test. The tenth passed the initial test last fall but was dropped a little more than a week into training due to stress fractures in her foot, Marine officials said. Two women were among the last class of 79 Marines who attempted it in July; both failed the CET.

http://www.militarytimes.com/article/20131004/NEWS/310040025/

[Lasciel]

@Sicks_Ate

I thought there were 4, but I was wrong about that too:

http://www.militarytimes.com/article/20131004/NEWS/310040025/

Thanks for the link - I only found that most recent two. I’d be interested if that one woman who passed would be able to go back and try again after her foot healed up, or if that being a known weak point would disqualify someone.

[Malacandra]

@Not_Carlson

Kyewel!

From the article:

I was curious about the pullups requirement and found this.

I was kind of expecting a higher number of pullups to be required, but then I doubt I could manage even three.

I assume though you would not be holding yourself up as a standard for Marine fitness. :dubious:

[Una_Persson]

@Not_Carlson

I was kind of expecting a higher number of pullups to be required, but then I doubt I could manage even three.

Any physically fit woman trying out for the military ought to be able to do 8 pullups. One of my best friends does 100 pullups in 5 sets of 20 every day.

[Not_Carlson]

@Malacandra

I assume though you would not be holding yourself up as a standard for Marine fitness. :dubious:

Good golly no!

(:dubious: indeed.)

[Sicks_Ate]

@Una_Persson

Any physically fit woman trying out for the military ought to be able to do 8 pullups. One of my best friends does 100 pullups in 5 sets of 20 every day.

3 is also the minimum for a male Marine…and 20 pullups (just one set!) is a perfect score on the physical fitness test.

[Not_Carlson]

@Una_Persson

Any physically fit woman trying out for the military ought to be able to do 8 pullups. One of my best friends does 100 pullups in 5 sets of 20 every day.

That is astounding!
I wonder then why they’ve set the bar so low.
(I mean the minimum of 3. Which I wouldn’t have a snowball’s chance in hell of reaching myself. )

[Great_Antibob]

Note that 3 pullups is “passing” which is basically a D grade. Nobody is shocked at the low standards for getting a D in school.

In addition, you get scored for each element of the test. If you barely get the minimum for each test, you fail on the overall score. So, if you’re only able to do 3 pullups, you have to make it up in crunches or running or another category.

As for why 20 is a perfect score, past a certain point, it’s not really going to matter, is it? The test is for physical fitness, not athletic godhood.

[epbrown01]

@Una_Persson

Any physically fit woman trying out for the military ought to be able to do 8 pullups. One of my best friends does 100 pullups in 5 sets of 20 every day.

That’s damned impressive! I’m guessing rock climber?

[Malacandra]

@Not_Carlson

Good golly no!

(:dubious: indeed.)

Don’t mind me. I’m not even the physical fitness bar for a career chair-warmer.

[drachillix]

@Crazyhorse

fraternization/harrassment/rape which are already problems for female soldiers throughout the armed forces. They are thinking about forming all-female SEAL squadrons to try to deal with these more realistic obstacles that female applicants would be facing.

Someone trying to rape a woman who passed SEAL school sounds like a problem solving itself.

<brings squeegee to cleanup whats left of attempted rapist>

[Longshanks]

@drachillix

Someone trying to rape a woman who passed SEAL school sounds like a problem solving itself.

<brings squeegee to cleanup whats left of attempted rapist>

Well if it’s a SEAL attempting the rape or a group of them then…

[Lasciel]

@Longshanks

Well if it’s a SEAL attempting the rape or a group of them then…

…obviously need a bigger squeegee.

(I’ll show myself out, thanks)

[Una_Persson]

@epbrown01

That’s damned impressive! I’m guessing rock climber?

Dancer and fitness rat. And she’s not small either, she’s about 160 pounds.

[bengangmo]

Starting Jan. 1, women will be required to complete three pullups in order to pass the PFT. If they want a perfect score, they’ll need to do eight.

IMHO - to a guy, three is a joke.
Eight, if you’re working out regularly barely more so.

I’m 39, in the healthy weight range for my age but I don’t work out (run yes, workout no) - I randomly did some pull-ups last week for the first time in over four years - I still did 5 in the first set.