So, I was thinking that in the event of the ZA, medicines will probably be snatched up pretty quickly, but most people would probably forget about spices during the collapse, so there are probably a lot of spices to be had.
Which spices would make good antivirals or antibiotics? I tried Googling, but I’m getting a lot of new-agey stuff, rather than actual scientific studies. On The Walking Dead, they used elderberry for the flu, but it’s unclear to me if that’s actually an antiviral, or if it just alleviates symptoms.
In my family, we use a folk remedy for sore throats that uses turmeric and black pepper, and it seems to work, so I’m guessing one or both of those have some antiviral or antibacterial properties?
I do not think spices are any more likely to have humanly useful antibiotic properties than anything else, or at least than other chemicals produced by plants. It is true that many of the more unusual chemical produced by plants play a role in protecting the plant from from infection, but (1) most of the microorganisms that infect plants do not infect humans (and vice-versa), so if some plant product kills human pathogens, that is mainly just a lucky side-effect, and (2) there is not likely to be much if any correlation between plant products that taste good to humans and those that happen to kill things that are pathogenic in humans (penicillin, for instance, tastes disgusting, as do many other actual antibiotics).
Some spices may have antiseptic properties, but that is not the same the same thing, and, in any case, they are likely to weak antiseptics compared to readily available mineral based ones such as bleach and salt.
As for anti-viral properties, to the best of our knowledge, very few substances at all have useful anti-viral properties. Viral diseases are mostly fought via boosting immune response in some way.
In other words, I think there is a good reason why you are only finding information about this idea on “new-agey” woo sites. The notion that spices, in particular, are likely to have significant medically beneficial properties is, essentially, woo, superstition rather than science. (And if any did happen, by some chance, to have such properties, they would almost certainly already be being used by conventional medicine, and we would know all about it.)
No, I am saying there is no particular reason to expect that spices would have useful antibiotic properties, so there is no particular reason to test them rather than anything else. They probably haven’t done lots of scientific studies on spices, because there is no particular reason to (and scientists have better uses for their time, like testing things that they actually have good reason to suspect might have useful properties).
Yes, but (to repeat) that is not the same as their having useful antibiotic (let alone anti-viral) properties.
Well, this is GQ. You’re saying you don’t know if they’ve done studies, and you’re speculating. If you don’t know about this topic specifically, I don’t think that these answers are very helpful. Either they’ve done studies or they haven’t. Speculation about what has probably happened isn’t what I’m looking for.
Also, I’m not asking whether spices are more effective than current medications. I’m asking whether or not spices would be useful in a situation where there’s no access to modern medication, like a Zombie Apocalypse.
You are confusing antibiotic effects with general antimicrobial (or antiseptic, including antifungal) effects. They are not the same thing, and I explicitly drew the distinction, and said I was talking specifically about antibiotic effects (which is what the OP asked about) in two of my 3 posts in this thread. It does not in any way follow from the fact that some substance has antimicrobial properties (as very many substances do) that it will be of any use as an antibiotic drug.
Well, you clearly do not like my answer. I was trying to be polite about it, but I guess you have sensed that I am saying that your question is a silly one, and that I suspect it is motivated by quasi-superstitious beliefs about the wondrous properties of spices. I am saying, and it is not speculation, that there is no more reason to expect spices to have medically useful antibiotic properties than any other botanically produced substance, such as, for instance infusions of woods (or leaves, roots or petals), or fruit juices (many of all of which, incidentally, are likely to have some antimicrobial properties). Would you have asked the same question about infusions of wood or leaves? I doubt it. Would you want scientists to spend their time testing infusions of every sort of wood and the juice of every sort of fruit (edible or not) for antibiotic qualities? I hope not.
I was never under any illusion that you were asking whether spices might be more effective than current medicines. My answer, (based on biological knowledge, not speculation) is no, there is no reason to believe that spices would be of any significant medical use at all in the event of a zombie apocalypse. It is not absolutely inconceivable that some spice might have some sort of antibiotic property, but there is no reason to expect that any of them would. I do not need to know about specific scientific tests, that probably have not been made (because the relevant scientists know what I am telling you), to know that.
If what you were really asking about was the antiseptic, antimicrobial properties of spices (as opposed to their usefulness as antibiotic medicines), then yes, many, probably most, spices will have some antimicrobial effects. It does not follow, however, that they would be useful for such purposes after your zombie apocalypse (apart from salt, which can be counted as a spice, and is useful as an antiseptic). There are many more easily obtained substances that would be more effective.
I don’t have anything I can cite at the moment, but the research I’ve done into this (inspired by wacky family members) boils down to this:
Most spices have antibacterial effects in food. In other words, spicy taco meat isn’t just tasty, it will hinder the growth of bacteria in the taco meat. In a post-apocalyptic world where you may not have refrigeration, this could be an important issue. Chiles, garlic, onion, mustard, salt, pepper, oregano, ginger, turmeric, cumin, cinnamon, etc. are all great at inhibiting microbial growth in the food. So is anything acidic, like vinegar and citrus juice. (And it may even be that spicier foods are more common near the equator precisely because higher ambient temperatures make it harder to safely prepare/store food.)
But it must be emphasized, this effect is in the food. You’re not going to mainline Tabasco sauce to treat the common cold because a concentration in your blood that would kill infectious agents would also kill you.
Some of the stories about spices or foods curing a disease I think stem from times when most people had poor nutrition. An apple a day does nothing for a person with a healthy diet… but if you’re malnourished and low on nutrients like vitamin C, it’s a different story.
If you’re looking for spices that can actually treat an infectious disease, there’s just not much to go on. Even all these people who go around talking about onion poultices - find me some real evidence on that, especially when they go around talking BS about “pulling toxins out of the wound” and “burn the onion paste to destroy the toxins.”
Um, no. I specifically drew the distinction between antibacterial vs antimicrobial and provided cites that demonstrated specific reductions in bacterial populations using spices. There have been studies done and you are wrong. In fact, one of the cites states quite plainly that garlic is considered to be 1% as active as penicillin.
Elderberry extract is an antiviral against the flu, I don’t know if it works against anything else. Elderberry extract works by inhibiting the H and N proteins on the flu virus (Tamiflu by comparison only blocks the N protein).
Um, I’m asking about a Zombie Apocalypse. Of course the question is silly. And no, my motivation was that I watched an episode of The Walking Dead and I started wondering about it. You’re way out of line for GQ. Either answer the question I asked with factual information or leave the thread. If you persist in making up motivations for me, I’ll report you to a moderator.
Huh? Scientist test all sorts of stuff that I think have dubious value. I don’t set their priorities and neither do you. Plus, sometimes governments fund stuff of dubious medical proposition that later turn out to have some value. The Soviets researched woo-woo stuff all the time. Stop turning this question around on me. It’s simple. Are there studies or not? If you’re going to try to derail the thread, then leave.:rolleyes:
Okaaay. Thanks for letting me know what is more easily obtained in a ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE. You’re an expert on that too now?
I’ve heard that honey and cinnamon have the cure for all that ails you, according to a persistent pop-up ad on my computer. But there’s this one weird trick that I don’t know the details of…