14 SF novels? Any of them published, or just fanfic?
(Not that I’m doubting your word, of course. ;))
Except I didn’t call you a snowflake. And I didn’t call you a troll, either. I did imply you were engaging in trolling, because you seem to be dead set on personally attacking me rather than addressing the subject. That’s not an attack, it’s an accurate assessment of your posts.
None of them are fanfic. All of them are published except the latest, which is still being edited.
Shit all over Luke’s character??
These complaints are being written by people in their twenties who have not put enough decades under their belt to look back and realize that they are in no way the person they were 20 years ago.
It is a natural progression of a person maturing and looking back and considering what they’ve done and looking ahead.
It was not Leia’s moment to die, so she didn’t die in outer space.
It was his moment to die floating a few inches above that rock. And so he did.
Life is change. You don’t want Luke’s to change? Drop in the first VHS release of “Star Wars” and put it on autorepeat.
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I personally don’t agree that it shit all over Luke’s character, I was just saying that’s what the complaint was, not that it was “too different.”
I LIKE what they did with Luke, and honestly I didn’t mind his ending, although I would have preferred if he had been there physically.
I liked nearly all the scenes with Luke, Rey and Kylo-Ren and Snoke. It was everything happening with Finn, Rose, Poe, Leia and Holdo that brought the film down for me. It kind of felt like someone else wrote that whole section of the film.
So no actual cites of a personal attack from me then? Just more assertions?
I will stipulate that it was in fact an imaginary voice in your head that called me a snowflake, but I don’t really think that improves things. And implying trolling behavior is certainly a personal attack. The overall hostility of your posts is also pretty evident. Oddly everything you are accusing me of would seem more appropriately directed back at yourself.
At any rate, by all means lets get back to discussing the movie. So was there anything at all redeeming about it in your mind? Anything positive? What about the Ren/Rey battle team up in the throne room? I thought that was pretty cool, and set up some interesting potential for them in the next episode. I think both are light/dark conflicted, but obviously pulling in opposite directions of the spectrum.
Just trying to make you feel more at home. But yes, you abandoned discussion of the film to state outright I was dismissing everyone else’s opinion because I expressed a different one. That’s pretty much the definition of a personal attack on me. Go hunt down your own first post at me if it’s that important to you.
Wow are you so wrong about this. I suggest you take your own advice and reread our entire exchange. Here is a hint, start at my first post in the thread #489. You then replied to someone agreeing with that post of mine.
I then replied to you in post #493 with a link to the plot holes in the OT since you mentioned that you are a fan of stories that make sense and are internally consistent. You never replied to this.
Then in post 581 I replied to your post 577 starting with “Look, I respect your opinion on the film” and nothing in that post could possible be confused with a personal attack. I wrote a long paragraph disagreeing with your comment about everything being back to status quo at the end of TLJ. You didn’t reply to that either.
So I began our exchange by making substantive posts about the movie that you ignored repeatedly. I made it clear that I respect your opinion at every point along the way, in fact one of my main points was that everyone’s opinion should be respected. Yet I am the one that ignored discussing the movie to personally attack you? It was the other way around. The thread clearly shows this.
Well, I’ll give it a go:
15) Luke was never all that good at force-lifting stuff. We see him lift a lightsaber, then while training with Yoda, himself and a few small rocks, then once they get to Endor, C3PO. That’s it.
14) EVERYBODY slipped past that blockade - possibly because that one Imperial guy was out of position and got disabled. The only ship that had trouble was the Falcon, and that’s because its hyperdrive was on the fritz.
13) “Imperials screw up” isn’t a plot hole. Even if the plans were on the escape pod, they could just recover them. Assuming the gunners knew what they were there to do in the first place. Also, the Empire didn’t like to rely on droids (we only see them using the interrogation bot, the mouse droids, the probe droids and one bounty hunter) so overlooking them shouldn’t be surprising.
12) No e-mail. Uh, yeah - instantaneous inter-solar video chats no problem, everything else was by courier. Weird world-building is not a plot hole. And e-mail didn’t exist in the 70s, the author is showing his (lack of) age.
11) Did the author pay any attention? Hyperdrive is significantly faster than no hyperdrive. And instant interstellar communication. Not a plot-hole.
10) Emperor over-reliant on his visions. Also, he did keep details secret - like the fleet being present, and the Death Star being functional.
9) Hey he may actually have a point here. Possibly Luke doing the whole “forseeing” thing that eventually gets Vader and the Emperor killed. Still, overcomplicated plan is not quite the same as a plot hole.
8) Does the Death Star’s laser work on gas giants? Guess the author knows better than the scriptwriters.
7) OK, so the author must have completely missed that interstellar travel without a hyperdrive takes a long time. His ADD doesn’t mean there’s a plot hole.
6) Ditch them where, exactly? Was she just going to hop out an airlock and hitch a ride? Han wasn’t going to let her out of his sight till he got paid.
5) This one’s pretty good. Except a non-functional hyperdrive wouldn’t be immediately obvious. The ship not being able to launch would be.
4) A plot hole introduced 20+ years later in a prequel is not a plot hole in the original movie.
3) Gee, the hero of the day got press. And the emperor made the not-so-huge leap of logic (or, possibly, investigated) that “Luke Skywalker” was the nephew of Anakin’s only brother. No indication he knew jack about Leia, until the throne-room scene in ROTJ, despite the author’s claim. Must be a plot hole, right?
2) Welcome to an adventure movie, not a psychiatry lecture.
- He’s actually got something of a plot hole finally! And Leia being Luke’s backup if he died at Cloud City makes perfect sense…unless she needed to I don’t know, NOT be a prisoner herself, which was likely if he didn’t go.
Of course, of course. That must be it. :rolleyes:
Yet another completely unresponsive reply to a substantive post of mine. So nothing else to say about repeatedly mischaracterizing my contributions to the thread? About me completely proving your assertions wrong about how I we initially engaged each other in this discussion? About unjustly accusing me of trolling behavior?
All you have is a rolleyes emoji?
Wow
Substantive?
Substantive? REALLY?
ROFLMAO!
Okay man. I’m sorry, I apologize, I kept going with you after I said I wouldn’t answer anymore, just because you’ve been so very funny. I love you. (The proper response is: I know.)
Did you actually read what these are?
There is maybe one legitimate plot hole…but just looking at the first one, I don’t think the person that wrote this watched the movies…
The plot hole is that in Return of the Jedi, Luke asks Han to grab his lightsaber during his battle with Jabba’s guards.
OK Didn’t happen in the movie. He did ask later on Endor, but even then it doesn’t make it a plot hole.
…
Quickly scanning the rest…
Leia didn’t email the Death Star plans to Yavin once she got them from the Bothan spies?
Leia and Luke didn’t mourn who they lost long enough?
Obi Wan didn’t consider Leia to be a Jedi?
Seriously? This is the list of plot holes you’re asking to be refuted?
The ships are constantly accelerating. When the rebel ship runs out of fuel, it is no longer able to accelerate and it continues at a constant velocity along its original path. Meanwhile, the FO ship is continuing to accelerate and therefore catch up to the rebel ship, giving the impression that the rebel ship is drifting backwards compared to an accelerating reference point.
Others may have made those complaints, but if you look at my strong criticisms of the movie, literally none of them are on your list.
How do you get “different” from that? To me, it just confirms what I said: they will keep copying/reheating the same meal and cashing it in over and over and over, as a cornerstone of the corporate bottom line.
I have a hard time taking seriously the opinion of anyone who loves “the original trilogy” because RotJ was so bad. ESB has some cringeworthy retcons itself. But I cannot think of any plot holes in the original film as a stand-alone story, which is how I am going to present it to my younger children.
I sincerely don’t understand why people keep saying TLJ is so different. It’s a lot of ESB with some RotJ and “ANH” sprinkled in.
This is a great point. #2 would be better, but probably would arouse ire.
Fair point. I am tempted to go Danny Glover and just declare that I am getting too old for this shit.
D’oh, you skipped the wrong prequel! IMO it and “Rogue One” are the only good Star Wars films released since 1980.
Oh crap, another great question! D’oh.
Unfortunately, the answer seems to be that the Johnson worked backwards from “Movie ends with only enough rebels left to escape on the Falcon.” So the opposite of plot armor but just as annoying.
You are wrong on this one. All the ships with fuel were accelerating. Ones not accelerating would appear to drift backward.
However:
- If the rebel ships were faster, they should have been able to steadily increase their distance from their pursuers, not just maintain it.
- Why couldn’t the First Order use hyperspeed to get ahead of the rebels?
Dude, I completely destroyed all of your claims about my behavior in this thread with post citations and everything. Proved that you were the one that refused to reply to the discussion at hand and started with the personal stuff. Including two posts full of content on the movie discussion at the start of our exchange that you completely ignored. You are showing your ass and making yourself look like a complete fool. But keep digging that hole if you must.
I’d be amused as well if it wasn’t all so sad.
I’m afraid you missed the point. My claim is that people are criticizing the new Star Wars movie with a rigor that if applied to the OT would show some issues as well. That some people are having a tough time viewing the old movies and the new movies in the same light. That list was an illustration, not any kind of proof about anything.
No, I didn’t miss the point. And your claim sucks. You were begging him to respond to your list of plot holes. Some of us did, and they aren’t plot holes. The Last Jedi, has some really huge valid plot holes.
The list you gave lists things that are completely invalid. Their first plot hole is confusing two parts of the movie. Yes, Luke asks Han to grab his light saber, but it isn’t during the skiff battle, it’s on Endor. And Han wasn’t blind when he was asked.
Look some people hated TLJ, some people really liked TLJ. I’m not saying its a perfect movie, but I do think some people are being critical toward TLJ in a way that would also show some issues with the OT if they honestly viewed them in that same light. You obviously disagree. What I don’t get is the emotion here. I was begging? My claim sucks? This is an internet message board thread about a science fiction/fantasy movie, why are some people getting so heated about this?
You are funny!