Straight Dope Electrical HELLLLP!!!!

The thing to take away from this is that LED lights are NOT always a direct replacement for simpler lighting types, especially not with dimmers, motor controllers, 3- and 4-way switch wiring and remote control in the mix.

Yeah. To be clear:

  • Tie “actual hot from panel” and “to wall switch” together
  • Tie “from wall switch” to the pair of “hot” LED lines
  • Tie “return to panel” to the pair of “neutral” LED lines
  • Put black/red tape on “from wall switch” and “to ceiling box” to indicate that it is a switched hot instead of a neutral

(and Dr Strangelove)…

I understand guys - easy enough. I made this change. STILL WORKS! :wink:

Did you label it well ? The next person that comes along might want a ceiling fan, could be you.:smiley:

Capt

Label? No.

I dinna think she would hold together inna fight, sir!

Red electrical tape?

Aye.

I think you answered your own question. The wire that used to go through the chain was probably only hot when the switch was on. And the chain probably had to be on for the fan to work. You need to just find and divide your hot.

A hearty Thank You from everyone who ever looked at a wiring mess and gone “WTF”. It won’t hurt to label the breaker either. You did not do a “Hot Swap”, I presume?

::Salute::

Capt

I know the breaker involved is one of six that actually control multiple outlets and multiple ceiling lights in multiple rooms. I didn’t know which one it was. I still don’t.

To be safe, and because I am paranoid because I don’t do this every day, I turned off the main breaker switch for ALL house power whenever I was working on the wires.

So the breaker is still not labeled. I could do it now probably through a process of elimination but I don’t know what other points that particular circuit is routed through or how those things are wired so it may not be a good idea.

A very useful tool for this kind of thing (admittedly less for lighting) is a clock radio or jam box. Plug it into a circuit you want to figure out, crank it up enough to hear at the breaker box and flip breakers, one at a time, til the radio shuts off. Then plug the radio into various outlets and map what ones are on that circuit, check for lighting too. Often lighting circuits are separate from wall plugs but who knows what was actually done before you.

Glad you turned the mains off.

Capt

Glad to help (even if others solved your problem first). A friend of mine faced her own wiring problems a while back and called me in to help. The trouble turned out to be an unlabeled (hot) traveler wire that she thought was a neutral. A little piece of tape would have avoided both headache and a potentially dangerous situation, so it’s good to hear that you’re making life easier for the next person to work on it.

I think I’ve seen illuminated switches that required a neutral. My feeling is it should be mandatory to provide neutrals at all switch locations, because even if the builder puts in a 50 cent light switch, the homeowner might want a computerized switch or something else that requires a neutral, and with houses being wired with romex you can’t just pull one in like greenfield or conduit. Some early X10 controllers used the trick of powering themselves by bleeding current through through the bulb, but newer ones don’t and at any rate won’t work with non-incandescent bulbs. There are various illegal and/or clumsy ways to deal with the problem, but none as elegant as having a neutral to use.